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Massa; Team Player?
Topic Started: Jun 9 2009, 09:04 AM (533 Views)
Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Massa's move on Kimi on Sunday would have taken both himself and his team mate out if Kimi had not taken evasive action. Having to avoid his team mate left Kimi vulnerable to other cars behind him and resulted in him damaging his car.

Massa made up one world championship point for himself and cost his team at least two, possibly more.

Massa's been out-qualified twice in the last two races and is not looking quite as much like the team lead that he keeps insinuating he is. Is the pressure starting to get to him? Nobody can call Kimi a warm and cuddly Team Player, but at least he doesn't cost his team points in trying to get past his team mate.
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Norbert
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No, usually Kimi costs his team points by not bothering at all. Like setting the fastest lap on the last lap of the race after speding much of it trundling around. Are drivers not supposed to try and overtake any more? It's hard enough with even the latest aero regs that have helped a little bit.

Kimi resulted in Kimi damaging his car by running into the back of someone. You cannot blame Massa for that, any more than you could blame Kovalainen for shutting the door on Rubens, who then spun, and later collided with Sutil (?) when he was trying to make places back up.
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Massa's cutting accross Kimi at the start started a chain of events which resulted in Kimi being passed by Alonso and hitting him in the process of trying to get back past. The fact that he did have the collision in trying to pass a car makes your tired old 'lazy Kimi' assertion null and void.

Anyway, this thread is about Massa. Why did he see fit to cut his team mate up like that?
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Norbert
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Er, because his job is to beat his teammate.

And if Kimi wasn't lazy he'd have done his fastest laps when he was trying to catch people, rather than on the last lap. He's spent several years doing that....
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Rams
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Kimi did not set the fastest lap on his last lap. He was a bit faster in his final stint, this is understandable as the track would be more rubbered in. In fact over 90% of the field set their personal fastest lap after lap 40, but because it's Kimi he MUST have been lazy earlier in the race <rolleyes>
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Lord Tau
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Actually, Nakajima and Kubica did their fastest laps on the last lap too, as well as Kimi. Also, Alonso & Buemi did their's on the penultimate lap, Glock on the lap before and Sutil on the lap before that.

Are all these drivers lazy and cannot be bothered?
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Red Andy
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Lord Tau,Jun 9 2009
02:01 PM
Are all these drivers lazy and cannot be bothered?

No, but then none of them have a history of doing exactly that, race after race, in a season where their teammate was challenging for the championship while they were making silly errors and generally being the slower of the two drivers.

I'm not saying Kimi's performance yesterday was necessarily down to laziness or a lack of motivation, but many of the reasons for reaching that conclusion aren't exactly invalid.
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Norbert
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Rams,Jun 9 2009
01:17 PM
Kimi did not set the fastest lap on his last lap. He was a bit faster in his final stint, this is understandable as the track would be more rubbered in. In fact over 90% of the field set their personal fastest lap after lap 40, but because it's Kimi he MUST have been lazy earlier in the race <rolleyes>

Sorry, I meant his fastest lap. However last year and the year before that was often THE fastest lap. There is no excuse for consistantly posting your absolute fastest lap on the last lap, because that one hardly ever matters. Unless there are only thousandths in it, or if it took a couple of pitstopns to sort the car out to get it to go fast, then maybe there's an excuse. But in the pit-stop era it seems there is little reason. If my driver spent the race not getting anywhere then suddenly pulling the anchors out on the last lap, I'd be asking them why they didn't do it sooner.... that applies to all drivers, not just Kimi, although he's the master of it...
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Surely a lazy driver wouldn't bother to set a fast lap at any stage of the race? A lazy driver would not bother to set his car up in the first place, but in order to set the fastest lap, you'd have to set your car up pretty darn good.
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Rams
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,Jun 9 2009
03:03 PM
Surely a lazy driver wouldn't bother to set a fast lap at any stage of the race? A lazy driver would not bother to set his car up in the first place, but in order to set the fastest lap, you'd have to set your car up pretty darn good.

Indeed, it just does not make any logical sense.

If you have no chance of winning (or even points in this case), why would you bother lapping quickly at the end of a race? In what way does that personify laziness? If he was lazy would he not lap quickly at the beginning of the race and then tail off?
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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A lazy driver who found himself in a new team and 26 points behind the leader half way through would give up on a season. Kimi went on to win 5 races and the WDC.

I think people call him lazy because he doesn't need to exert himself in the way that other drivers do, in order to achieve results. Other people call him lazy because they are jealous... a particular former team mate who now has a job with the BBC springs readily to mind.
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Lord Tau
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,Jun 9 2009
03:19 PM
A lazy driver who found himself in a new team and 26 points behind the leader half way through would give up on a season. Kimi went on to win 5 races and the WDC.

So there's still hope for Rubens yet!
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Norbert
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<yahoo>

<roflmao>
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Poor Rubens. He's back where he was at Ferrari. I don't see him spending another year in F1 after this.
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Lex
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Love it!

14 posts on a thread about Massa and 3 are actually about him! (4/15 after this one ;) )

I've always seen him as a particularly high-maintenance driver who:

- benefited from nepotism to get his drive with Ferrari
- had been totally error-prone at Sauber
- had personal coaching and tutoring by MS to achieve any level of competence (and may still do)
- has dubious wet-weather skills and appears somewhat mentally fragile unless all is going well
- when he wins, it's from pole
- when everything is going ok, he's quick

I certainly don't see him as a natural team leader

Perhaps this year will be good for him too!
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