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Who said there were no double standards in F1
Topic Started: May 24 2009, 10:51 PM (1,020 Views)
Rob
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stradlin24,May 25 2009
08:00 AM
I also firmly believe that if Hamilton had done what Massa did by cutting the chicane then he would have been penalised and I also don't think anyone can disagree with that


And I'm 100% sure that if that had been the case you'd be either defending Lewis or atacking others for castng jugdement on Lewis. <thumbsup>
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stradlin24
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Rob,May 25 2009
03:54 PM
stradlin24,May 25 2009
08:00 AM
I also firmly believe that if Hamilton had done what Massa did by cutting the chicane then he would have been penalised and I also don't think anyone can disagree with that


And I'm 100% sure that if that had been the case you'd be either defending Lewis or atacking others for castng jugdement on Lewis. <thumbsup>

and your completley wrong

I would have said what i'd seen and called it down the middle just like I have with Hamilton's past penalties, McLarens antics in Spygate and Liegate and Massa's token penalty last season...

And now your accusing me of attacking others? So once again i'm being singled out and attacked by a moderator, I don't understand this...

I've just given my honest opinion using facts and things i've seen from the race. I do not understand why I am being singled out and attacked again.

If you read back a couple of threads you will see I agree with Red Andy when he said the blocking penalties are a joke (no matter who gets them, even if it was a Ferrari!) but what I am looking at is consistency and how decisions have fallen in the past.

Contray to popular belief I don't have a problem with Massa or Raikkonen (infact you'd be hard pressed to find anything negative i've ever said about Raikkonen) but my evidence I have gathered over the past couple of seasons leads me to believe that decisions by race stewards and the FIA greatly favour them

Looking at it from a 50/50 point of view, there is no doubt that Alonso should have had a penalty for blocking Massa. Looking at the Monza incident, it was an appaling decision and I would say the same if it was Hamilton that benefited BUT the important thing was that the precedent was set. Now why isn't that followed through? Why is it a different matter when it's not a Ferrari involved? You have to admit it does look very very fishy

And also, you keep telling me there is no conspiracy against me and you do not single me out but your making it hard for me not to believe that mate
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stradlin24
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SaveOurSilverstone,May 25 2009
02:01 PM
Quote:
 
But fastest lap counts for no more than bragging rights anyway, so nothing was really gained.


It matters for the fantasy league.. <thumbsup>

did massa cut the corner on lap 50???? <devil>

Do we think we could put that arguement forward to the FIA?

<roflmao>
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SaveOurSilverstone
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stradlin24,May 25 2009
06:21 PM
SaveOurSilverstone,May 25 2009
02:01 PM
Quote:
 
But fastest lap counts for no more than bragging rights anyway, so nothing was really gained.


It matters for the fantasy league.. <thumbsup>

did massa cut the corner on lap 50???? <devil>

Do we think we could put that arguement forward to the FIA?

<roflmao>

you never know... they might listen... if they agree it wouldn't be the worst descision they have ever made.. <think>
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Red Andy
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I think an appeal to the Court of Tau might be a better bet, he is the supreme authority on Fantasy F1 matters!
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Brave_Lee_Flea
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stradlin24,May 25 2009
04:44 PM
Rob,May 25 2009
03:54 PM
stradlin24,May 25 2009
08:00 AM
I also firmly believe that if Hamilton had done what Massa did by cutting the chicane then he would have been penalised and I also don't think anyone can disagree with that


And I'm 100% sure that if that had been the case you'd be either defending Lewis or atacking others for castng jugdement on Lewis. <thumbsup>

and your completley wrong

I would have said what i'd seen and called it down the middle just like I have with Hamilton's past penalties, McLarens antics in Spygate and Liegate and Massa's token penalty last season...

And now your accusing me of attacking others? So once again i'm being singled out and attacked by a moderator, I don't understand this...

I've just given my honest opinion using facts and things i've seen from the race. I do not understand why I am being singled out and attacked again.

If you read back a couple of threads you will see I agree with Red Andy when he said the blocking penalties are a joke (no matter who gets them, even if it was a Ferrari!) but what I am looking at is consistency and how decisions have fallen in the past.

Contray to popular belief I don't have a problem with Massa or Raikkonen (infact you'd be hard pressed to find anything negative i've ever said about Raikkonen) but my evidence I have gathered over the past couple of seasons leads me to believe that decisions by race stewards and the FIA greatly favour them

Looking at it from a 50/50 point of view, there is no doubt that Alonso should have had a penalty for blocking Massa. Looking at the Monza incident, it was an appaling decision and I would say the same if it was Hamilton that benefited BUT the important thing was that the precedent was set. Now why isn't that followed through? Why is it a different matter when it's not a Ferrari involved? You have to admit it does look very very fishy

And also, you keep telling me there is no conspiracy against me and you do not single me out but your making it hard for me not to believe that mate

I have to say that I think Rob is probably right.

Maybe I am doing you an injustice but over the past months you are always at your most vociferous, indeed sometimes downright aggressive, on any topic in which you can either diss Ferrari or diss those who might dare to say something less than positive about Lewis.

You say you are objective and regularly acuse everybody else of bias but that's not what I see in the majority of your posts. As I recall even your signature was for a long time intended to do little more than provoke fans of the scarlet team (amongst whom I most certainly do not count myself).

Now before you suggest that I am attacking the poster and not the post ... I'm not. I'm trying to give a measured and considered response to the content of your post.

I don't think there is a conspiracy against you but there probably is a strong reaction to the things you say and to the way you say them. If you don't like the way people are reacting to you then perhaps you should consider why they are reacting the way they do.

For example John and I used to knock heads quite agressively over all things Schumacher, Hill and Ferrari, starting on 606 and working it's way across several boards, which often descended into personal insults. It took a long time but in the end I think we worked out how to get our points across without needing to have a ruck.

Well, either that or I finally battered him into submission but to be honest if there is anyone even more stubborn than me it's him so I doubt that's the case!
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Rob
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stradlin24,May 25 2009
11:44 AM
Rob,May 25 2009
03:54 PM
stradlin24,May 25 2009
08:00 AM
I also firmly believe that if Hamilton had done what Massa did by cutting the chicane then he would have been penalised and I also don't think anyone can disagree with that


And I'm 100% sure that if that had been the case you'd be either defending Lewis or atacking others for castng jugdement on Lewis. <thumbsup>

and your completley wrong

I would have said what i'd seen and called it down the middle just like I have with Hamilton's past penalties, McLarens antics in Spygate and Liegate and Massa's token penalty last season...

And now your accusing me of attacking others? So once again i'm being singled out and attacked by a moderator, I don't understand this...

I've just given my honest opinion using facts and things i've seen from the race. I do not understand why I am being singled out and attacked again.


Again you play the poor me role. My position on this board has nothing to due with me disagreeing with you. There was a time when you were a mod and I wasn't. We disagreed then as well, and I didn't cry that a member of staff was singling me out; I just stated my point, moved on and continued to have my point of view while you had yours.


Quote:
 
Looking at it from a 50/50 point of view, there is no doubt that Alonso should have had a penalty for blocking Massa. Looking at the Monza incident, it was an appaling decision and I would say the same if it was Hamilton that benefited BUT the important thing was that the precedent was set. Now why isn't that followed through? Why is it a different matter when it's not a Ferrari involved? You have to admit it does look very very fishy


Sorry. Don’t buy that. Even when Lewis has been plainly guilty of an infraction, you have continually attacked those who call him out, even if you did add a quick statement about him being guilty, you continue to attack those who condemn Lewis as hypocrites, even those of us who have freely admitted Shumi is the dirtiest WDC ever (however Lewis might take that title before his career is over).

If we're bringing up old races, yes Monza 06 was the wrong decision, but if you choose to remember Alonso also got away with cutting the chicane coming out of the tunnel in Monaco 05 no less that 3 times, w/ 0 penalty, so it's not just Ferrari that benefits from calls, it is everyone, but you just choose to ignore it.


Quote:
 
And also, you keep telling me there is no conspiracy against me and you do not single me out but your making it hard for me not to believe that mate


I'm not responsible for what you think. I you feel things are hard on you maybe you should look at yourself rather than blaming everyone else. Simple fact is if there was a conspiracy against you, you'd be gone, you still post here, and so what does that say.
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stradlin24
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Yeah your right Rob. I did attack people who jumped on the anti-Lewis bandwagon but that was a while ago. I apologised and I have recently tried to make my contributions a lot more constructive but if I keep getting attacked by mods and they keep throwing things back in my face then I give up

Your attack was unprovoked and deliberately inflammatory, you were trying to get a rise out of me but if that’s how you chose to conduct yourself then fine. You chose to attack me and make it personal, I did not…

Although, no doubt when it’s all said and done I’ll turn out to be the bad guy. I really want to know why I’m subject to this constant hounding by mods. What have I done to upset you so much?
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everythingoes
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stradlin24,May 26 2009
01:51 PM
Yeah your right Rob. I did attack people who jumped on the anti-Lewis bandwagon but that was a while ago. I apologised and I have recently tried to make my contributions a lot more constructive but if I keep getting attacked by mods and they keep throwing things back in my face then I give up

Your attack was unprovoked and deliberately inflammatory, you were trying to get a rise out of me but if that’s how you chose to conduct yourself then fine. You chose to attack me and make it personal, I did not…

Although, no doubt when it’s all said and done I’ll turn out to be the bad guy. I really want to know why I’m subject to this constant hounding by mods. What have I done to upset you so much?

1) Robs comment was by no means an attack of any sort. It was a statement countering your assertion. You choose to look at it as an attack, so be it.

2) Your attempts at playing the victim time and again are getting tedious, to be frank. Worse, for your sake, nobody is buying it either. Give it up.

3) If you think that any of the staff are not going to voice an opinion that is opposed to you, merely because they are staff, then you're sadly mistaken. They will, because they are entitled to their opinion, as is any member of the board. Learn to deal with differences of opinion.

4) You're right about your recent contributions being more constructive, keep that up. But make room for the fact that in the face of your past behaviour, it will take time for everyone else to notice the difference. Don't allow things to get personal unnecessarily.
on top of that playing martyr doesn't help.

5) Ultimately, giving up or not, is your prerogative, use it wisely.
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John
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John,May 25 2009
12:30 AM
TheCompleteGuitarist,May 25 2009
12:25 AM
I don't know what is.

Seconded....

TCG... I was agreeing with you... <thumbsup> not that I noticed it much during the race but any driver persistently cutting corners will gain some advantage unless the kerbs damage the car in some way.
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Craze_b0i
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A lot of posters here have asserted that Massa gained time by cutting the chicane. But did he? To me this seems doubtful since the FIA would have been monitoring his lap times and any significant advantage would have been noticed.

No-one has actually produced a chart of Massa's lap times. To those who say Massa gained an advantage (2 tenths or whatever) I say you need to provide the evidence to prove it.

If he was gaining time on the lap fair enough. But a lot of drivers missed the chicane too and you need some allowance for human error.
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Monty,May 25 2009
12:34 AM
F1 drivers are paid to take every find every advantage possible, its the FIA's fault for having such pathetic kerbs at the swimming pool.

Why is there that chicane at the end of the tunnel? It's just about the only place that there ever might be a chance to overtake in what is otherwise the dullest race of the season.
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John
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Petra Lead,May 26 2009
02:30 AM
For example John and I used to knock heads quite agressively over all things Schumacher, Hill and Ferrari, starting on 606 and working it's way across several boards, which often descended into personal insults. It took a long time but in the end I think we worked out how to get our points across without needing to have a ruck.

Well, either that or I finally battered him into submission but to be honest if there is anyone even more stubborn than me it's him so I doubt that's the case!

LOL... Petra, you make such compelling arguments now it's harder to disagree quite as often these days

Stradlin is one of the most knowledgeable members when it comes to motorsports especially the US racing genre... but when it comes to F1... well we see what happens... we all have an achilles heel...

He was not alone in this as there was a time when we had a lot more members (mostly marshals) who also gave F1 a hard time, but over time they have moved on and so Stradlin now stands out more in his views... and this might be why he feels under attack but I doubt there is anything more sinister involving the forum mods.
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Craze_b0i
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,May 26 2009
09:56 AM
Monty,May 25 2009
12:34 AM
F1 drivers are paid to take every find every advantage possible, its the FIA's fault for having such pathetic kerbs at the swimming pool.

Why is there that chicane at the end of the tunnel? It's just about the only place that there ever might be a chance to overtake in what is otherwise the dullest race of the season.

Health and safety I guess. The tunnel is the only place in Monaco where the cars can go fast. I am guessing there is no room at the following corner to build a proper run-off area, hence the need for a mickey mouse chicane.
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everythingoes
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Craze_b0i,May 26 2009
03:32 PM
Alien_SAP_Fiend,May 26 2009
09:56 AM
Monty,May 25 2009
12:34 AM
F1 drivers are paid to take every find every advantage possible, its the FIA's fault for having such pathetic kerbs at the swimming pool.

Why is there that chicane at the end of the tunnel? It's just about the only place that there ever might be a chance to overtake in what is otherwise the dullest race of the season.

Health and safety I guess. The tunnel is the only place in Monaco where the cars can go fast. I am guessing there is no room at the following corner to build a proper run-off area, hence the need for a mickey mouse chicane.

You're most probably right. Thats also the reason, perhaps, why the chicane has such low kerbs. Otherwise the race would most likely end in a few laps because everybody would have broken their car going over the kerbs. Thats how often it happens.
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