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Who said there were no double standards in F1
Topic Started: May 24 2009, 10:51 PM (1,017 Views)
TheCompleteGuitarist
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Quote:
 
One Rule For Ferrari, One Rule For...
What offence did Felipe Massa commit, not once but at least twice, during the Monaco GP? Cutting the chicane to gain an advantage. And what was the exact crime laid against Lewis Hamilton by race stewards at last year's Belgian GP? 'Cutting the chicane to gain an advantage'.

That Massa escaped with a second warning was, regardless of the Hamilton comparison, somewhat baffling. When telling him to stop cutting the corner, Massa's race engineer expressly framed the directive from the stewards as "another warning". In that case, what exactly what was the first warning. 'Do it again and we'll tell you not to do it again?'. Hard-hitting stuff, to be sure.


http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3265_5346583,00.html

Ferrari should be worried. F1 is already a two tier series it seems!!!

Ferrari and everyone else.

<doh>
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stradlin24
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i noticed but didn't want to say in case it caused an uproar!

but there is clear proof of double standards
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Steelstallions
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http://uk.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/i...D30582820080913

Quote:
 
Formula One drivers have been told that if they gain a place by cutting a chicane, as Lewis Hamilton did in Belgium last weekend, they must hand it back and then wait at least one corner before overtaking.

Honda's Jenson Button told Reuters at the Italian Grand Prix on Saturday that the matter was discussed at the drivers' Friday briefing and a clarification given by race director Charlie Whiting.

A Ferrari spokesman said team managers had also been reminded of the position at their meeting on Thursday but stressed that the existing regulations remained unchanged.

Hamilton was stripped of victory by stewards in Belgium after he cut the Bus Stop chicane while battling Ferrari's Kimi Raikkonen for the lead.

The championship leader came out ahead of the Finn, ceded the position momentarily on the straight before emerging from his wake to overtake the Ferrari into the next corner.



Could you explain what place Massa gained and then didn't give back? Maybe then we can discuss these double standards you talk of.

Until then it's a non story as would have been the case with Hamilton last year had he not gained a place by doing it. Or did all the other corners that got cut by drivers at Monaco deserve punishment even when they didn't gain a place?



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TheCompleteGuitarist
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He managed to put in A LOT OF fastest laps while he was doing that, if that is not advantage gained then I don't know what is.
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John
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TheCompleteGuitarist,May 25 2009
12:25 AM
I don't know what is.

Seconded....
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Monty
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F1 drivers are paid to take every find every advantage possible, its the FIA's fault for having such pathetic kerbs at the swimming pool.
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Rob
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I may have to rewatch the race, but I'm pretty certain other drivers than just Massa were cutting chicanes. To my knowledge no one was punished for it.
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everythingoes
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TheCompleteGuitarist,May 25 2009
04:21 AM
Quote:
 
One Rule For Ferrari, One Rule For...
What offence did Felipe Massa commit, not once but at least twice, during the Monaco GP? Cutting the chicane to gain an advantage. And what was the exact crime laid against Lewis Hamilton by race stewards at last year's Belgian GP? 'Cutting the chicane to gain an advantage'.

That Massa escaped with a second warning was, regardless of the Hamilton comparison, somewhat baffling. When telling him to stop cutting the corner, Massa's race engineer expressly framed the directive from the stewards as "another warning". In that case, what exactly what was the first warning. 'Do it again and we'll tell you not to do it again?'. Hard-hitting stuff, to be sure.


http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3265_5346583,00.html

Ferrari should be worried. F1 is already a two tier series it seems!!!

Ferrari and everyone else.

<doh>

If you're using a PlanetF1 story as an example, then you might want to take a look at their overtaking Move of the Race. The time Massa actually gained an advantage by cutting the chicane was when he had a go at passing Vettel coming out of the tunnel. He then promptly backed off allowing Vettel past and Rosberg sneaked past too. He only passed them again a couple of laps later.

Any comparison with the Hamilton penalty in Belgium can only apply to exemplify how a driver ought to give back a place gained by cutting a chicane and wait a while before gaining it back. Any other comparison is straw-clutching, imo.
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mrr9
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The BBC said if you look at the lap times when the red cars had more than 3 wheels off the ground or totally cutting the corner they where running one second a lap slower than JB

so cutting the corner was in fact slower

if the race director/stewards saw that the times where faster than he might of given them a drive through penalty or some thing like that

Mark
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Red Andy
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I don't recall any occasion, ever, when a driver has been punished for cutting a chicane if he didn't gain a position (or avoid losing a position) for it. So this incident was judged totally consistently and fairly. If you want double standards, just look at the McLaren fans who believe that penalties should be handed out for every incident that ever takes place on the track, unless a McLaren driver is involved.

If there were points for fastest lap there might be a case for saying that Felipe gained an advantage. But fastest lap counts for no more than bragging rights anyway, so nothing was really gained.
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ELUSIVEJIM
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Sorry but we heard Massa being told to watch himself by the team as the stewards were watching both areas.

What more can the stewards do???

Just out of the tunnel Bourdais went straight on more than 4 times but because he is not in the Ferrari its not mentioned.

Every driver out there cut the kerbs on more than one lap but to stay within these boundries for 78 laps without making a mistake for me is impossible.

Give these guys a break i think it was amazing watching Massa and the other drivers pushing the cars to the limits.

We did not see Hamilton doing this as we never saw Lewis after Quali <sarcasm>


<peek>
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TheCompleteGuitarist
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So if the stewards had to mention then he must have been doing something wrong.

It was aired on TV.

BTW, I wasn't really trying to make any point other than to be annoyingly contentious.

Nice work there BTW John, are you in the media or a politician, I just love the way you manage to extract these little gems from peoples words.



<wub>
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everythingoes
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TheCompleteGuitarist,May 25 2009
02:49 PM
So if the stewards had to mention then he must have been doing something wrong.

Its not as if the Stewards get everything right every time either ... <whistle>

:P
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RJHSaints
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Complete and utter nonsense.

Yesterday Massa cut the chicane very slightly on two occasions, gaining little tangible advantage. Normally, drivers in that position are only punished if they do it deliberately and consistently.

Hamilton at Spa 2008 clearly and blatantly cut the chicane, missing the apex by a mile and obviously gaining an advantage by not having to slow down to avoid hitting Raikkonen. As a result, he was able to pass at the next turn.

Sorry, but the two situations have nothing in common and people who call double standards are just looking for reasons to attack Ferrari and Massa.
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stradlin24
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So why it Italy was Alonso given a penalty for 'blocking' Massa in quali (when he was no where near) but got away with a blatent block on Trulli at the weekend?

How does that work then? Where's the consistency? Oh I forgot! Trulli drives a Toyota, how silly of me

Massa DID cut the chicance, I saw it with my own eyes and he DID gain an advantage

Whether Ferrari fans chose to accept that is another matter, a matter of class and grace. Clearly both are in short supply
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