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| The Death of Formula One; it's beginning | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 13 2009, 01:50 PM (966 Views) | |
| Alien_SAP_Fiend | May 13 2009, 01:50 PM Post #1 |
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Chief Engineer
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Ferrari and Renault are both threatening to pull out of F1. FOTA vs FIA squabbling. Farce after farce as loopholes are left open until well into the season. Seems to me that Formula One is on its way out and a FOTA series is becoming a reality. What does it matter what it's called? As long as it's the best drivers in the world driving the most advanced cars at incredible speeds, I'll watch it. At the moment we have to watch talented drivers Alonso, Hamilton, Raikkonen, Massa, Kubica, Heidfeld struggle with substandard cars while other drivers walk away with the championship, mainly due to the fact that their teams gave up on the previous years cars while the other fought for the last world championship. 2009 is a disaster. Why bother watching races any more? I used to go nuts if I missed a race last year and in 2007, now I hardly care because Button's going to win every race (unless it's wet, in which case it'll be Vettel). Even if Mclaren, Ferrari and BMW do get their Mojo back, they'll still be too far behind to make any difference. Now with this budget cap row, there's no point in looking forward to 2010 because there'll be nobody worth watching. How are you going to get the best drivers in the world to risk their lives if you don't pay them and how are you going to make the best cars in the world if you can't pay the engineers and the rules prevent you from doing anything worthwhile. Am I wrong to be so depressed about this, the 'pinnacle of motorsport'? |
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| sportsman | May 13 2009, 02:23 PM Post #2 |
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Chief Engineer
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Drivers salaries are not included in the budget cap |
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| AndyW76 | May 13 2009, 02:23 PM Post #3 |
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Team Boss
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I don't think it is the death of F1. FOCA and FISA used to war all the time and only settled things by coming to the negotiating table. What I do see this as is may be the end of Mad Max. Bernie won't tolerate a mass exodus from F1 and unless a deal is reached I suspect that he will engineer a way to get rid of Max. |
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| Alien_SAP_Fiend | May 13 2009, 02:31 PM Post #4 |
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Chief Engineer
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Are they not? OK, that's a relief, but there's still the issue of major teams leaving and the teams who don't go for the cap being hobbled by the rules. It's like saying you can race thoroughbreds against shire horses, as long as the thoroughbreds have one leg shorter than the other (or something). Bad analogy, I know, but you get my gist. |
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| Norbert | May 13 2009, 02:33 PM Post #5 |
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I hope it's the end of Max. The budget cap is his baby, not Bernie's. Call Bernie what you like, but I still believe that he is actually good for the sport in some ways at least. Max has consistantly shown that he isn't, almost exclusively. Without Bernie, F1 would probably not have survived as long as it has, and now Max is seriously compromising it by imposing his will once more. Long-life engines and gearboxes are a joke, the two compound tyre rule is a joke, KERS is a joke, budget caps are a joke.... what next? |
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| mrr9 | May 13 2009, 02:56 PM Post #6 |
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Refueller
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I see all team pay - like driver are ATM - being excluded from the cap and the budget cap is just there to design and develop the car This not the death of F1 far from it every one throwing there toys around before they all sit down and agree terms with the red team getting the most money and veto rights Mark |
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| Red Andy | May 13 2009, 03:04 PM Post #7 |
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I thought we had agreed on "ass-whistle." ![]() Seriously, though, I agree with you. Bernie's the businessman who has built F1 into what it is now, Murray Walker said a similar thing the other week. No Bernie, no F1, basically. The problem he currently has is that he has to make as much money as possible for CVC who own the business, because if the revenues don't keep coming in then they won't be able to service the loans they took out to buy the commercial rights in the first place. Max, on the other hand, is getting more and more insane on a seemingly daily basis. |
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| TheCompleteGuitarist | May 13 2009, 03:42 PM Post #8 |
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Driver
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What I think about the budget cap. 1. It will allow more teams to enter F1. Everyone is always complaining about how there are not enough privateers in F1 and the on ething that is putting them off is the high cost to enter. The manufacturers have pushed the cost of F1 one up and are now threatening to leave for several reasons. The budget cap itself, the global climate, their lack of success etc. 2. It will allow a level playing field without insisting everyone use the same chassis/engine. Again people are complaining about the inequality in F1 and how the car is such a key factor in a drivers success and yet they resist any form of unification. The problem is that teams with reasonable unlimited budgets tend to be the ones that do better. OKay so this is not always the case as we saw with Honda, but had Honda stayed, Honda would currently be leading both titles. How is this after 2 years of dire failure? Money (and time). Give everyone a budget then we have a level playing field and not a case where the richest team wins. We are living in a world of limited resources. Oil is on its way out, and we are seriously damaging our climates and economies. In my opinion all talent is shown when limitations are imposed. This is what the rules are for. You are not allowed to cut a chicane, you can only build an engine x litres big, the minimum weight for the car is.... and so on. So why not limit the budget too to bring the sport in line with the current global climate. Talent can be shown by producing the best on limited resources, it's not impossible. I think the problem say with Ferrari is, we're so rich, we have the money, we should be able to spend it to make us look better than the guy with less money. OK you may say fine, let them spend it. But you'll end up with a series that has only Ferrari, Mclaren and say one of the other big spenders, but ultimately you are forcing out smaller teams and a potentially bring the series to a close. I'm not wrong. |
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| Norbert | May 13 2009, 03:59 PM Post #9 |
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Well, after 59 years of having no budget caps, we still have F1.....
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| TheCompleteGuitarist | May 13 2009, 04:11 PM Post #10 |
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Driver
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Not really, we have an activity that lines the pockets of Bernie and is now breaking up around the edges. The politics is now dominating the sport like it never has before and you can't say it isn't. It's like saying we've had F1 for 60 years and Ferrari are still in. (But will they be next year?) |
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| Steelstallions | May 13 2009, 05:15 PM Post #11 |
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Driver
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If they do not buckle down to the manufactures request to stop the two tier next season, F1 will be over. Manufactures will pull out and what's left will implode. The manufactures will go to other series and if they are as smart as i think they are, they will take over something like the A1GP franchise (as i read in a very interesting article) and make it their own. Dump the current format but take over the business as the new F1 with all the contracts for tracks, Hi Def media etc etc. Watch the sponsors and big money flock to the new GP1 as thats were the true pinnacle of sports cars will be racing. Don't forget that these manufactures are not just a car on the grid, they represent major investment in the series.VIP events, bringing in stands full of ultra rich clients to wine and dine. Where do you think the fans are going to go when its choice of seeing Ferrari, Mclaren Renault Red bull in less restricted cars or F1 with cosworth engines and out of the shed Lola's built with more standard parts than an airfix model. Don't think having a full grid of budget cars is F1. If the manufactures go then the series is dead, because its more than just the car and driver they bring to F1. |
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| Monty | May 13 2009, 05:22 PM Post #12 |
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Chief Engineer
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So say if we lose, Renault,Ferrari,Toyota and Redbull thats 4 of the 6 biggest teams gone straight away. I would much rather have a great teams like ferrari and Renault rather than a couple of joke GP2 teams with teenage drivers. F1 is the only sport that seems to shoot itself in the foot constantly, this will be the end of it if we lose these huge teams that attract the majority of the fans to the sport. Its such a shame Mosley didnt lose his job last year, he is such an arrogant fool he is killing F1. I mean a "two tier" championship, what is this touring cars?
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| TheCompleteGuitarist | May 13 2009, 05:31 PM Post #13 |
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I don't want to see two tier either, I want to see one big budget cap for everyone. |
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| Monty | May 13 2009, 05:38 PM Post #14 |
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Perhaps but then we will see a second GP2 series with better drivers. They should make the budget cap if they have to something like 100 million. |
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| TheCompleteGuitarist | May 13 2009, 05:46 PM Post #15 |
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Obviously it should be whatever keeps it the top formula otherwise you are right, it would be undermined by other formulas |
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