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GREAT NEWS FOR LEWIS; FERRARI
Topic Started: Sep 8 2008, 10:28 AM (505 Views)
PiquetFan
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AndyW76,Sep 8 2008
05:13 PM
Though if williams had heeded what had happened to rosberg's mclaren nd brought mansell in, then may be mansell would have beeen champion.

No question.

And the only reason Prost didn't have to make a late precautionary stop for tyres was that he had a puncture much earlier in the race. On these small margins championships are won and lost :D
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AndyW76
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No wonder they called him the professor.
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Why put all your eggs in one basket? Let Massa and Kimi race each other and each get as many points as they can until it's mathematically impossible for one of them to win the WDC.
What if Massa and Lewis both DNF at Monza and Kimi wins? Unlikely, but not impossible. Lewis could have another puncture, Massa could spin in the wet, Kimi could win and then he's 9 points behind Lewis and 7 behind Massa with 4 races to go.

There are still 5 races to go and it doesn't look like Lewis has learned from his mistakes last year. He's still pulling banzai moves when he doesn't have to, risking a DNF for two points. Kimi would have beaten Massa on Sunday, had he not had his cage rattled by Lewis (not blaming Lewis, he races hard and fair, just saying that Kimi wasn't entirely to blame for his prang), so it's still too early to be imposing Team Orders, which Ferrari are not allowed to do, in any case.
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AndyW76
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Well, it is down to how confident ferrari feel. The fact is that, while the ferrari drivers are battling each other they can take points off each other, which is what Alonso and Lewis did to each other last year. It is always more difficult to allow 2 drivers to fight for the title that supporting just one.
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dazzerjp
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,Sep 9 2008
12:37 AM
Why put all your eggs in one basket?  Let Massa and Kimi race each other and each get as many points as they can until it's mathematically impossible for one of them to win the WDC. 
What if Massa and Lewis both DNF at Monza and Kimi wins?  Unlikely, but not impossible.  Lewis could have another puncture, Massa could spin in the wet, Kimi could win and then he's 9 points behind Lewis and 7 behind Massa with 4 races to go. 

There are still 5 races to go and it doesn't look like Lewis has learned from his mistakes last year.  He's still pulling banzai moves when he doesn't have to, risking a DNF for two points.  Kimi would have beaten Massa on Sunday, had he not had his cage rattled by Lewis (not blaming Lewis, he races hard and fair, just saying that Kimi wasn't entirely to blame for his prang), so it's still too early to be imposing Team Orders, which Ferrari are not allowed to do, in any case.

I'd agree. Massa and Lewis could take each other out first corner at monza.


As agree about Lewis. Whilst the penalty was unjust, Lewis really should have waited until the straight. It was a mistake, a small one, lesser than those before.

He is learning. Just ironing out the final creases.
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Bear
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,Sep 8 2008
03:37 PM
Why put all your eggs in one basket? Let Massa and Kimi race each other and each get as many points as they can until it's mathematically impossible for one of them to win the WDC.
What if Massa and Lewis both DNF at Monza and Kimi wins? Unlikely, but not impossible. Lewis could have another puncture, Massa could spin in the wet, Kimi could win and then he's 9 points behind Lewis and 7 behind Massa with 4 races to go.

There are still 5 races to go and it doesn't look like Lewis has learned from his mistakes last year. He's still pulling banzai moves when he doesn't have to, risking a DNF for two points. Kimi would have beaten Massa on Sunday, had he not had his cage rattled by Lewis (not blaming Lewis, he races hard and fair, just saying that Kimi wasn't entirely to blame for his prang), so it's still too early to be imposing Team Orders, which Ferrari are not allowed to do, in any case.

Save for the rain at the end, the race was really won and lost in the first lap and a tiny bit of the second lap. If it had stayed dry, Kimi would have won.

Massa said afterwards that he was too cautious off the start line because he thought it was wetter than it actually was.

Think Massa was playing the long game all day - something we have never really seen him do before ... and in the end he won through over both Lewis and Kimi. If he had been more aggressive off the start line, could he have overtaken Lewis and stayed ahead of Kimi and then gone on to win the race from the front as Kimi in the dry was destined to do? We'll never know for sure. All race he was fairly close to the front two and I am pretty sure Smedders and Ferrari had thought it best to play for points rather than risk the engine or a crash.

So I'm not really sure we saw great racing from Kimi or Lewis - just a better start and then some rash moves, off track excursions, and mistakes.

Massa has more race wins now this season that any other driver and has more top 3 finishes than any other driver. But for a rash start to the season and some bad luck in Hungary, he would be fairly and squarely leading the championship by now.

Think that if he can maintain composure over the last races and has dry and reliable races, he will win the title.

Lewis has only beaten the Ferraris once in the dry this season (without them having reliability problems) and it will be very unlucky for Ferrari if all the remaining races of the season are wet.

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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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I don't understand this taking points off each other thing. How are they taking points off each other?
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AndyW76
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Say if the monza result was LH, KR, PM, then in kimi beating Massa, massa would lose out to Lewis more then if Kimi had yielded to Massa and let him finish in second.
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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What if Massa is slower than Kimi in the race, even if he qualifies better?

Could happen ;)
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Steelstallions
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Quote:
 
Ferrari have no intention of rushing into a decision to support Felipe Massa despite the Brazilian having a hefty advantage over Kimi Raikkonen in the standings.


Never thought i would see the day Ferrari are criticised for NOT having team orders :s
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AndyW76
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Well technically, team order are not permitted, though I think the rules are unenforcable and besides, what is wrong with team orders. It was only a couple of silly incidents that upset the apple cart. Surely the FIA could have issued a code of conduct concerning team orders instead of a blanket ban, such as how not to make the race look blatantly fixed.
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AndyW76
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Steelstallions,Sep 8 2008
04:24 PM
Quote:
 
Ferrari have no intention of rushing into a decision to support Felipe Massa despite the Brazilian having a hefty advantage over Kimi Raikkonen in the standings.


Never thought i would see the day Ferrari are criticised for NOT having team orders :s

Well, to be fair, I wouldn't blame them for having team orders now. The previous objection was that they employed team orders unnecessarily, though I guess that that is their perogative. If I ran an F1 team in the same situation, I'd probably do the same. The only time I objected to their team orders was when the made a total pigs ear of it and embarrassed the whole of F1 in Austria 2002. In that case, may be they should have beenmore discrete or may be been a tad more honest with Rubens over the nature of his position in the team.
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John
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AndyW76,Sep 8 2008
05:29 PM
The previous objection was that they employed team orders unnecessarily...

Indeed that is how I saw the backlash.... the Ferrari fine was for the podium antics...not the team orders.

and the outcry prompted a revision to the rules...
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ELUSIVEJIM
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AndyW76,Sep 8 2008
02:59 PM
This reminds me of 1986 where the williames battled away and prost snuck in and won the title at the last race, complements of a 200MPH blowout, and the fact that williams didn't use team play to wrap up the title early.

<clap> Yes mate

Ferrari have a real chance of messing this up like Williams.

Remember it was Lewis losing the plot that gave Kimi the chance in 2007.

Saying that maybe the FIA shot Mansells tyre with a sniper gun <think>
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AndyW76
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John,Sep 8 2008
04:31 PM
AndyW76,Sep 8 2008
05:29 PM
The previous objection was that they employed team orders unnecessarily...

Indeed that is how I saw the backlash.... the Ferrari fine was for the podium antics...not the team orders.

and the outcry prompted a revision to the rules...

Unfortunately, there was a huge overreaction that has screwed up the rules for every body. I just wish the FIA could have taken a step back and got things into perspective and seen that the only harm done was a couple bruised egos.
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