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MASSA AND KIMI; COST FERRARI???
Topic Started: May 12 2008, 08:09 AM (991 Views)
ELUSIVEJIM
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<wtf>

What was Massa doing when Lewis past him???

Sorry but Massa was impressive over the weekend but he will never be a World Champion in my view after seeing his pathic attempt to keep Lewis behind him.

WHY did Massa not make Lewis go around the long way to attempt the pass?

Any driver must surely know if you give someone the room to pass in the inside you have no hope of stopping them.

As a result of Massa letting Lewis past this in the end cost Ferrari a 1-2 in my view.

As for KIMI what was his race weekend all about???

Even when he had the chance to catch Lewis with 10 laps to go he still was not good enough.

Ok he has a Championship lead but in two races in a row he has been below par.

Not one of the Ferrari drivers are good enough to take over M Schumacher seat in my view and Ferrari need to really think about Alonso as a replacement.

The power difference between the Renault and the Ferrari was shocking before anyone says Alonso let Kimi through easily.

If Mclaren continue to progress and get closer to Ferrari i can only see Lewis being Champion this season.
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Massa was told by his race engineer that Lewis was 3 stopping and that Lewis was MUCH faster than him, so being passed was inevitable. He did the mature thing and bided his time for the win, which he did.

Kimi's car was damaged, he knew that. What he did not know was how much it was damaged. Did the touch with Heikki weaken the wing so that putting too much load on it would cause the whole thing to disintergrate, especially in the wash of a car he's trying to overtake? He played it safe and took 6 points instead of 8. Another mature action.

Kimi was seriously compromised by the Mclaren strategy of getting Heikki to box Kimi in at the start and let Lewis past (obvious, when you consider that Heikki was carrying a lot more fuel than Lewis and would have held him up in any case). Unfortunately for both Finns, this 'stooge' role cost Heikki a podium and the team a lot of points.

I think you'll find that the mighty M Schumi would have done the same thing - listened to what his team were telling him to do and taken the maximum points.

Of course, Schumi might have made the correct tyre choice, which is the thing that both Ferrari drivers were lamenting... but isn't Schumi still a member of the Ferrari team? Why was he not at the race, to give this sort of advice?
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everythingoes
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I suppose Massa played the safety first approach, rather than risking a coming together with Lewis, he let him through knowing Lewis was going to make an additional pit-stop.
Kimi, probably never had the car right this weekend, even so, in the second stint he had the chance of putting in the fast laps to overhaul Lewis, but he claimed his second set of softs did not work as well, so he couldn't go faster :s
All in all, I don't think Ferrari or Kimi will be complaining too much. They are clear leaders in he constructors table, one and joint second in the drivers, I guess they will take it.
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everythingoes
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Alien_SAP_Fiend,May 12 2008
02:05 PM
Of course, Schumi might have made the correct tyre choice, which is the thing that both Ferrari drivers were lamenting... but isn't Schumi still a member of the Ferrari team? Why was he not at the race, to give this sort of advice?

Last season the theory was that Kimi can't win if Scumi is present in the Ferrari pits. This year Barcelona shot that down. Maybe the new one should be that Kimi needs Schumi around to win? <think>
:P
Both drivers found that through all the practice sessions and quali, the softer option was better, somehow in the race it turned out the opposite <huh>. So the tire choice can be called wrong only in retrospect, they had no factual reason to think otherwise before that.
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Brave_Lee_Flea
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I have to say that right up until the moment that Lewis passed Massa I had thought that the obvious thing was for Massa to slow Lewis down and prevent his being able to make enough time to finish ahead of Kimi.

Maybe it shows a shift in the way Ferrari are thinking (compared to years gone by); the cautious approach was better for Massa but not so good for Ferrari.

My thinking is this; had Massa managed to back Lewis up Ferrari could have had a one-two. Had Massa and Lewis had an accident Kimi and Ferrari would have extended their leads in both championships - the onus would have been on Lewis not to risk a collision.

In years gone by Ferrari would (IMO) have preferred the option which most benefited their chances of winning the WDC.

But then again, in years gone by it was not often that their points-leading driver was behind the other in the race.
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Norbert
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I seem to recall Alonso not bothering to fight a much faster car too, but that isn't mentioned. There was no point in Massa fighting Hamilton, he was way quicker, and if they'd collided, Ferrari would have lost 8 or 10 points because Hamilton would have won if he'd not been damaged, and Kimi would have finished second. I think a 1-3 is better than a single 2nd, don't you? I'm certain that if they'd been on the same strategy, then it would have been the widest Ferrari ever built....
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John
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As I understand it Schumacher has a specific role in the team now (unlike last season) that role involves test driving and promoting the team... I do not think it stretches to sitting on the pit wall dictating strategy to the drivers... although I'm sure if he wanted to he could.



<topic>

I think is pointless to criticise Massa & Kimi... Ferrari left Turkey with Pole (Massa), Won the race (Massa) with two podium finishes (1 & 3) and got Fastest lap (Kimi 1.26.506)


So apart from Kimi only making up one place off the grid instead of two it was a Ferrari, Massa & Kimi weekend...

I don't know about you bit I've seen them both have far worse races than the one they raced yesterday <think>
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Brave_Lee_Flea
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Fair.
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ELUSIVEJIM
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Norbert,May 12 2008
08:45 AM
I seem to recall Alonso not bothering to fight a much faster car too, but that isn't mentioned. There was no point in Massa fighting Hamilton, he was way quicker, and if they'd collided, Ferrari would have lost 8 or 10 points because Hamilton would have won if he'd not been damaged, and Kimi would have finished second. I think a 1-3 is better than a single 2nd, don't you? I'm certain that if they'd been on the same strategy, then it would have been the widest Ferrari ever built....

Think you will find i did mention Alonso <whistle> <roflmao>
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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Petra Lead,May 12 2008
08:43 AM
I have to say that right up until the moment that Lewis passed Massa I had thought that the obvious thing was for Massa to slow Lewis down and prevent his being able to make enough time to finish ahead of Kimi.

Maybe it shows a shift in the way Ferrari are thinking (compared to years gone by); the cautious approach was better for Massa but not so good for Ferrari.

One of the ITV commentators mentioned that Massa would be happier to have Hamilton finish behind him than Kimi, because that would close the gap between him and Kimi, hence the lack of an attempt to slow Lewis down (and risk a prang).

I wonder what his reaction would have been if it had been his previous team mate in third place?

Massa is not good at defending his position. We saw this in his tussle with Alonso last year. But he could have made a bit more of an effort to help Kimi get past... which goes to show that Kimi is leading the season thanks to his own efforts and doesn't need a tame team mate like some other World Champions <devil>
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Red Andy
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The Ferrari drivers appear to be fighting one another for the world championship as well as Lewis. They will no doubt know that their car is much quicker than the McLaren on most circuits, and therefore the title fight is really just between the two of them. With this in mind, Massa not wishing to help out Kimi is understandable - Ferrari are likely to win the WCC one way or the other anyway, so it's best to let the drivers decide among themselves which one is top dog.
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John
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
 

a lot of WUM crap...


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Alien_SAP_Fiend
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ELUSIVEJIM,May 12 2008
08:09 AM
As for KIMI what was his race weekend all about???

Even when he had the chance to catch Lewis with 10 laps to go he still was not good enough.

Ok he has a Championship lead but in two races in a row he has been below par.

He won Barcalona and came third yesterday.

What do you want him to do? Walk on water? Sorry, only Schumi can do that.
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John
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Alien_SAP_Fiend
 

a little bit more WUM crap...


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Brave_Lee_Flea
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John,May 12 2008
09:52 AM
Alien_SAP_Fiend
 

a little bit more WUM crap...

a whole load of WUM crap ....

<smartarse>
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