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| Trump UN Speech | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 19 2017, 03:17 PM (1,250 Views) | |
| KlavierBauer | Sep 20 2017, 02:14 PM Post #51 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Historically, passive resistance has a nearly 100% success rate, while violent resistance has an abysmal rate of success past the first 20 years. Maybe we can hope that the people will begin to change their country from the inside - but given that they are basically prisoners, some outside help would definitely go a long way. |
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| Mikhailoh | Sep 20 2017, 02:15 PM Post #52 |
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
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You mean like vaporizing the country's military and political command structure?
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Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball | |
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| Catseye3 | Sep 20 2017, 02:19 PM Post #53 |
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Fulla-Carp
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Why not? Heck, let's just do it. Screw 'em all. In fact, if we hurry we can flatten the whole country by the weekend, then kick back! Never mind. Fuck it. We'll all get what we ask for. That's it for me for today. Ima go listen to Jimmy Cliff sing I Can See Clearly Now. It always cheers me up when I get too much reminding of the assholery of the human race. |
| "I shall now begin to speak of purple, which exceeds all the colors that have so far been mentioned both in costliness and in the superiority of its delightful effect." -- Vitruvius, De architectura, 1st century BC. | |
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| Jolly | Sep 20 2017, 02:21 PM Post #54 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Weekend? One Boomer could probably do the job in a half hour. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Renauda | Sep 20 2017, 02:50 PM Post #55 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Less than thirty years ago western intelligence agencies including the CIA thought it inconceivable that the East European communist regimes would be replaced and the USSR would collapse on itself. In fact when it became undeniably apparent that the latter could evaporate and break apart, it was not welcomed at all by the US or other NATO members. The West did not at the time realize the extent to which modem technology had the hand of reformers such as Gorbachev in opening up what had previously been a model post Stalinist totalitarian state. Despite the Stalinist aspects of North Korea, what it is facing is in today's age of hyper tecnology is no different. Taiwan Girl is spot on when she states North Koreans are catching on regardless of whether its leadership is willing, capable of, or even sufficiently courageous to initiate reform of its own totalitarian governance model. I am sure that Kaiser Trumpf's ongoing bluster and sabre rattling does nothing in moving the NK towards anything other than more reaction. |
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| Jolly | Sep 20 2017, 02:59 PM Post #56 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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OK, since Mr. Kim is busy shooting missiles over our allies, what do you want us to do? |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Larry | Sep 20 2017, 03:01 PM Post #57 |
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
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I'd be interested in hearing about where "passive resistance" has defeated anyone. Jesus. |
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Of the Pokatwat Tribe | |
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| Jolly | Sep 20 2017, 03:24 PM Post #58 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Kaiser Clinton? https://spectator.org/when-bill-clinton-threatened-to-end-north-korea/ |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| George K | Sep 20 2017, 03:36 PM Post #59 |
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Finally
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http://s10.zetaboards.com/The_New_Coffee_Room/single/?p=11082121&t=9034238 |
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A guide to GKSR: Click "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08 Nothing is as effective as homeopathy. I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles. - Klaus, 4/29/18 | |
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| Renauda | Sep 20 2017, 03:37 PM Post #60 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Sit down with the Chinese and Russians who share a border with NK, are nuclear powers and along with the USA are the major powers of the Pacific region and work out an agreement on the North Korean question acceptable to all three of you. A return to pre WWI sphere of influence diplomacy is in order here. Just be aware the US may not be able to call all the plays in this game of high stakes. In fact, it may have to accept a co starring role in this production. |
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| Jolly | Sep 20 2017, 03:39 PM Post #61 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Perhaps Russia, but we've about chewed China's ear off. Chinese banks are STILL bankrolling the NORKS. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Renauda | Sep 20 2017, 03:39 PM Post #62 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Yes George, I already read that. Bill Clinton was no Kaiser despite being a Willy. |
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| Renauda | Sep 20 2017, 03:42 PM Post #63 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Then start talking and chewing on the other ear. |
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| George K | Sep 20 2017, 05:36 PM Post #64 |
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Finally
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Seen on the web:
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A guide to GKSR: Click "Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08 Nothing is as effective as homeopathy. I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles. - Klaus, 4/29/18 | |
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| Copper | Sep 20 2017, 08:17 PM Post #65 |
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Shortstop
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What he wants is to kill everyone in America. That would leave very few people to carry on in tncr. |
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The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy | |
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| Rainman | Sep 20 2017, 08:29 PM Post #66 |
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Fulla-Carp
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I don't know, Copper. Seems to me he does not necessarily want to kill everyone in America. He wants it to appear that he could, if, and only IF, he wanted to. Or at least, that's what he knows his own people believe, and hopes the rest of the world will fall for it. At some point, given the trajectory, he will need to prove it once the "testing" convinces the world he is indeed capable. Ramping up and bluffing will only work for so long. The only thing he needs to come up with other than propaganda, is some sort of answer to "why?" - both before and after the carnage begins, regardless of how it all starts. |
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| KlavierBauer | Sep 20 2017, 09:14 PM Post #67 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Larry - there are *many* examples ranging from smaller movements shifting societal norms (often leading to larger movements), to full blown revolutions... Tiananmen Square beginning a huge political and economical shift in China, Martin Luther King Jr. and the Civil Rights movement in the U.S., Ghandi attaining self rule for India, the downfall of Slobodan Milošević in Serbia, Bolivia in 2005, the downfall of communism across the Eastern Block in 1989 ... the list goes on and on. If you're genuinely curious, there's a great TED talk on this by a local professor who cites studies going back over a century on this subject. The data are pretty clear actually, that non-violent resistance is incredibly more successful than violent resistance - especially in terms of long-term viability. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJSehRlU34w Edited by KlavierBauer, Sep 20 2017, 09:14 PM.
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| Horace | Sep 20 2017, 09:26 PM Post #68 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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You'd have to define "historically". I'm pretty sure that for most reasonable definitions of "historically", any resistance meaningful enough that the more powerful aggressors noticed it, ended in death. |
| As a good person, I implore you to do as I, a good person, do. Be good. Do NOT be bad. If you see bad, end bad. End it in yourself, and end it in others. By any means necessary, the good must conquer the bad. Good people know this. Do you know this? Are you good? | |
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| Klaus | Sep 20 2017, 10:15 PM Post #69 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I don't have a magic bullet. I'd try to keep the situation stable, put just enough pressure on NK that they don't expand their power but won't start a nuclear war, try to get the best possible intelligence out of NK to understand what is going on, and try to find an opportunity to get rid of this regime with minimal loss of human life. |
| Trifonov Fleisher Klaus Sokolov Zimmerman | |
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| Horace | Sep 20 2017, 10:28 PM Post #70 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I suspect that the world can probably wait out the NK thing, even if it hurts a bit and for a while. I love the idea to bombard the country with information and technology. (Via information technology bombardments.) A war of idea attrition. The issue is when terrorist cells, rather than nation states, attain nukes. Of course we're all screwed then. |
| As a good person, I implore you to do as I, a good person, do. Be good. Do NOT be bad. If you see bad, end bad. End it in yourself, and end it in others. By any means necessary, the good must conquer the bad. Good people know this. Do you know this? Are you good? | |
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| KlavierBauer | Sep 20 2017, 10:29 PM Post #71 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Fair point - we can limit the scope to the last 150 years or so. It does seem counterintuitive, but long lasting changes have worked better through non-violence. America is an anomaly in this regard. While our Revolution started as a non-violent resistance, it of course became a full fledged war. What's anomalous is that we've been able to retain that independence, as most times such uprisings don't stay stable very long past the initial revolt. |
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| Horace | Sep 20 2017, 10:31 PM Post #72 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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That seems mostly about the technology of violence. The days of superior numbers trumping superior technology are over... though they probably lasted a really really long time. We've reached now an equilibrium where numbers and technology are about the same. Because the numbers have the technology. And only because of that. |
| As a good person, I implore you to do as I, a good person, do. Be good. Do NOT be bad. If you see bad, end bad. End it in yourself, and end it in others. By any means necessary, the good must conquer the bad. Good people know this. Do you know this? Are you good? | |
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| KlavierBauer | Sep 20 2017, 10:36 PM Post #73 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I think this is a good point. NK isn't really interested in world domination, because it isn't a movement or ideology bent on expansion - it is a single person with a few close associations who help keep the charade going, who've imprisoned an entire nation. The posturing we're seeing now is very similar to what we've seen for a long time from them, and from what I've read from folks much more well versed on the subject - this just that - posturing. I think it's valid that a violent ideology attaining the same power is a much different situation, and possibly even warrants consideration of first-strike. I agree with Sam Harris on a great many things - but this one thing (that he's taken so much flack for) in particular. I think we have a bit of a responsibility to wait out the NK thing as long as we possibly can, due to the prisoners we risk killing to get to the warden. I don't think NK will strike anyone - but I'm also not naive enough to think such a thing is impossible. I just hope we don't jump the gun with an impulsive, seemingly unreasoned captain at the helm. |
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| Jolly | Sep 21 2017, 12:33 AM Post #74 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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One million people died during Ghandi's movement in India. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Jolly | Sep 21 2017, 12:40 AM Post #75 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Shooting missiles over American allies is provocation, not simply posturing. I've said repeatedly if I was North Korea, and especially if I was China, the last thing I want in that part of the world is a pissed-off and militarized Japan. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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