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Progressive multiculturalism is no match for Islamic fundamentalism.
Topic Started: Jun 14 2012, 05:30 PM (1,214 Views)
Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
http://times247.com/articles/06madonna-and-the-death-of-the-west4
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
This guy is so hopelessly old and square. I'm pretty old and square and Madonna hasn't shocked me since about 1980.

Let's face it, Madonna is freaking old and square!
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
Madonna never really shocked me. She just made me scratch my head when she wore her underwear on the outside.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
JBryan
Jun 15 2012, 05:56 AM
She just made me scratch my head when she wore her underwear on the outside.
I seem to think that's what a lot of teenage boys did.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
JBryan
Jun 15 2012, 05:56 AM
She just made me scratch my head when she wore her underwear on the outside.
Does Superman or any of his associates in the Justice League have similarly effect on you?
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Copper
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Shortstop
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 04:02 AM
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.

I thought he demonstrated a decent knowledge of American pop culture. Saying he "obviously knows nothing" is a real stretch.

You may or may not like "drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism", but there really isn't much question that these activities are well represented in American pop culture.

All those activities make up a good percentage of the posts on this forum although I can't remember a good thread on cannibalism recently.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
Quote:
 
Does Superman or any of his associates in the Justice League have similarly effect on you?


I have never seen them with panties, a corset and garter belt worn on the outside. They may have them under their clothes but I wouldn't know.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
Copper
Jun 15 2012, 06:11 AM
... I can't remember a good thread on cannibalism recently.
There you go ...

http://s10.zetaboards.com/The_New_Coffee_Room/topic/7401957/1/
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Copper
Jun 15 2012, 06:11 AM
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 04:02 AM
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.

I thought he demonstrated a decent knowledge of American pop culture. Saying he "obviously knows nothing" is a real stretch.

You may or may not like "drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism", but there really isn't much question that these activities are well represented in American pop culture.

All those activities make up a good percentage of the posts on this forum although I can't remember a good thread on cannibalism recently.
By saying that pop culture "celebrates" these things is largely incorrect. But then the point of his article isn't about our culture. He just wants to use it as fuel for his political opinion. Given the ignorance demonstrated by his premise, it makes me wonder about the rest of his piece.

But you are correct. I exaggerated. He probably doesn't know "nothing" about our popular culture. He's probably looked at some pictures and read the names of some song titles. But he clearly has not achieved anything approaching an understanding of the material. If he did, he could not make such ridiculous comments and expect anyone to take him seriously.
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 06:26 AM
... If he did, he could not make such ridiculous comments and expect anyone to take him seriously.
Copper seems to take him seriously. :shrug:
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
Our pop culture also celebrates this:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/14/bristol-palin-levi-johnston_n_1598256.html
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Axtremus
Jun 15 2012, 06:27 AM
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 06:26 AM
... If he did, he could not make such ridiculous comments and expect anyone to take him seriously.
Copper seems to take him seriously. :shrug:
Are you making a separate point? If so, it is surely unrelated to mine made in the very sentence you quoted, which has nothing to do with Copper.

Look at it this way: There's a reason writing teachers say, "write what you know." In this case, the writer opined about something he doesn't know very well, using his uninformed opinion as the premise of his article, and he ends up looking like a proper fool.

As for Copper, he either ignored or didn't catch the part that set me off -- the supposed celebration of evil by our popular culture. But the sentence you quote has nothing to do with Copper.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 06:40 AM
Look at it this way: There's a reason writing teachers say, "write what you know." In this case, the writer opined about something he doesn't know very well, using his uninformed opinion as the premise of his article, and he ends up looking like a proper fool.
To be fair—and this has nothing to do with anything, I just saw the comment and thought I'd cherry-pick—I don't think writing teachers have in mind op-ed pieces when they give that advice, and the advice itself has a much more slippery meaning.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Quote:
 
By saying that pop culture "celebrates" these things is largely incorrect. But then the point of his article isn't about our culture. He just wants to use it as fuel for his political opinion. Given the ignorance demonstrated by his premise, it makes me wonder about the rest of his piece.


How odd a statement, Dave. So far, neither you nor anyone else has addressed the actual point of his article, and where you get the idea it's about his political opinions is beyond me. No offense, but he's not the one displaying ignorance.

Perhaps you haven't paid any attention to the difference in song lyrics of today and oh, even ten years ago, Dave. Songs used to talk about loving women - today they talk about making the "bitch suck my dick" and "kill de bitch", stuff like that. You don't see a change there?

The point of the article Dave, is that the degradation of pop culture is fueled by multiculturalism, something that is destroying the fabric of American society. That's right Dave, multiculturalism is a BAD thing. But that's not the main issue. The main point of the article is that Islamic fundamentalism does not suffer from being hampered by the whining, foolish Left who thinks multiculturalism is good, or that it's ok for society to degrade itself to the point that its pop stars walk around flipping their tits out on stage, or sticking their bare ass out at the audience, or singing songs about the kind of crap much of today's popular music sings about. He makes the point - a very valid one by the way - that we are exporting this kind of sh!t to areas of the world whose religious fundamentalism is just as shocking and unacceptable to us as the crap we call entertainment is to them.

Like he says - let's see one of these "entertainers" tattoo a picture of Mohammed on their bare ass and shove it in their faces from the stage and see how long that lasts..

The point Dave, is that we ARE suffering from a lack of values in this country, and it's going to bite us in the ass one day before long.

If you see any political ideology being included in that Dave, it's because political ideology is suffering too, evidenced by the fact that the modern Liberal Left in this country has aligned itself with a mindset that sees no problem with the very things that are dysfunctional in our society, and demonizes those who see the problem and what's behind it.

So yes Dave, much of today's pop culture fits his description of it to a tee.
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Quote:
 
The point of the article Dave, is that the degradation of pop culture is fueled by multiculturalism, something that is destroying the fabric of American society. That's right Dave, multiculturalism is a BAD thing.


Without looking at the tie-in to popular culture (I hate pop culture for entirely different reasons, but I'd vilify it more than Larry would I think), I also agree with Larry's general sentiment. Multiculturalism as practiced today doesn't achieve what it implies, and I also think it's forcing itself upon areas at a faster pace than what would be comfortable.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 04:02 AM
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.
I think what you are missing, David, is the whole point of the article. He could praise Madonna as our generation's Madame Tetrazzini with staging and theatrics that put the Baroque musical spectacles to shame and musical mastery of Tomás Luis de Victoria, and the point about multiculturalism vs Islamic fundamentalism would remain the same.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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KlavierBauer
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HOLY CARP!!!
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 04:02 AM
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.
Can't believe I'm about to say this - but I agree with you 100% David.
"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper
"He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple

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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
To be honest, he sounds a bit like an Islamicist himself.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Jolly
Jun 14 2012, 05:30 PM
The sooner the American 18 Brumaire the better.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
In an effort to assist you left leaning folks as you navigate your way through this article, I offer you the following:

Take this test: What do you see?
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Here are some hints to help you:


This is sh!t:
Posted Image


This is Shinola:
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Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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JBryan
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I am the grey one
Sheep sh!t and putty is another good test.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Quote:
 
the degradation of pop culture is fueled by multiculturalism

Larry: Pop culture has always been fueled by multiculturalism. How do you think jazz, blues, R&B and rock & roll developed? Back in the day, Louis XIV got ballet off the ground, then the Italians, Russians, Danes and English made important contributions. Pablo Picasso, a Spaniard living and working in France, was influenced by many cultures, including by the oriental vogue in Europe in the 1880s and 90s that also influenced folks like Debussy and Ravel. Pop culture is fueled in every way, both for good and bad, by multiculturalism and always has been.

When people make statements that are demonstrably wrong, it calls into question any conclusions that might be derived from such statements.
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
ivorythumper
Jun 15 2012, 08:32 AM
Dave Spelvin
Jun 15 2012, 04:02 AM
Here is the first paragraph of the article:

Quote:
 
American popular culture is a moral sewer. It celebrates drugs, pornography, abortion, mindless violence, street thugs, sexual promiscuity, homosexuality, hedonism and even cannibalism. For the past 25 years, one of its cultural icons has been Madonna. The singer has limited talent. The key to Madonna’s success has not been her voice or the beauty of her songs; rather, it is her willingness to push the envelope, to shock the public with acts of lewdness and vulgarity.

He is wrong on each and every statement, and obviously knows nothing about American popular culture, Madonna, music or art, for that matter. What a loser.
I think what you are missing, David, is the whole point of the article. He could praise Madonna as our generation's Madame Tetrazzini with staging and theatrics that put the Baroque musical spectacles to shame and musical mastery of Tomás Luis de Victoria, and the point about multiculturalism vs Islamic fundamentalism would remain the same.
What exactly is the point of the article? I get something about how Madonna is more harmful than George W. Bush was as an instigator of Islamic violence against us. That our values, whatever they are supposed to have been, have eroded and -- what? It sounds to me like he's blaming America for the aggression of Islamic extremists. But that can't be it, can it? He'd have to be a liberal to suffer from such delusions, and I don't mistake him for a liberal. We may be stupid, but we're not stupid enough to blame the problems of the world on a pop singer or even the entire entertainment industry. Maybe the writer is working for the Onion or Stephen Colbert now.
Edited by Dave Spelvin, Jun 15 2012, 10:33 AM.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Quote:
 
Larry: Pop culture has always been fueled by multiculturalism. How do you think jazz, blues, R&B and rock & roll developed?



Dave, like most liberals today, you don't seem to understand the meaning of "multiculturalism".

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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