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John Galt Returns?
Topic Started: Apr 2 2012, 11:35 AM (651 Views)
George K
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Finally
Dubious Donations

Quote:
 
DUBIOUS DONATIONS (2012 EDITION)

Barack Obama has proved the greatest campaign fund-raiser of all time by a long shot. In 2008 his campaign raised more than $750 million. The Obama campaign even went the extra mile to raise campaign funds by failing to adopt standard protections against fraudulent and illegal giving. Federal law prohibits foreign contributions and requires the disclosure of identifying information for contributions in excess of $200. Campaigns must accordingly keep running totals for each donor and report them once they exceed $200.

As we and others noted, the 2008 Obama campaign’s records revealed big contributors with names like “Doodad Pro” (employer: “Loving,” profession: “You”) and “Good Will” (same employer and profession). Both donated via credit card. I believe it was Pamela Geller who reported that some donations came from overseas — raising the question of whether Obama was accepting donations from foreigners.

All of which prompted an enterprising reader to test the controls put in place to enforce compliance with federal campaign law by the Obama and McCain campaigns. He decided to conduct an experiment. He went to the Obama campaign Web site and made a donation under the name “John Galt” (the hero of Ayn Rand’s novel Atlas Shrugged). He provided the equally fictitious address “1957 Ayn Rand Lane, Galts Gulch, CO 99999.” He checked the box next to $15 and entered his actual credit-card number and expiration date. He was then taken to the next page and notified that his donation had been processed. Others repeated “John Galt’s” experiment, giving to Obama under such fictitious names as Della Ware, Joe Plumber, Idiot Savant, Ima BadDonation (with a Canadian bank card) and Fake Donor.

The Obama campaign was able to take these donations because it had turned off the standard Address Verification System that screens credit-card charges for matching names and addresses. (It can also screen cards issued by foreign banks.) The McCain campaign used AVS and provided a searchable database of all donors, including those who fell below the $200 threshold. The Obama campaign chose not to use the AVS system to screen donations. (The McCain campaign rejected such donations through the use of the AVS system.) You can find a good description of the AVS and CVV fraud prevention devices here.

I wrote about this in the New York Post column “Dubious donations.” The Post subhead observed: “Bam’s Web site invites fraud.” The Washington Post reported on the matter two days later in the story “Obama accepting untraceable donations,” by Matthew Mosk. Mosk quotes Obama campaign officials on their practices. According to them, everything was copascetic.

Urgent Agenda reader Adrian Murray wondered if the Obama campaign has become any more compliant this time around than it was last time. He conducted the necessary experiment and wrote Urgent Agenda proprietor Bill Katz:

Quote:
 
If you go here you will note that credit card donations to the Obama election campaign do not require the credit card security code [i.e., the CVV code]. What they have done is disable the Address Verification System (AVS) which prevents credit card fraud. Yesterday, just to see what would happen, I submitted a donation and filled out the form as follows:

Name – Adolph Hitler
Address – 123 Nuremburg Way, Berlin, Germany
Occupation – Dictator
Employer – Nazi Party

After submitting, I received an email that began, “Dear Adolph, thank you for your generous donation….”

I then went to the Romney and Santorum websites and tried the same thing. Both rejected the donations with a message that the address could not be verified as belonging to the card holder.

Try it. Make up a name and an address and donate to Obama. Then try it with the other two. Only Obama will accept the donation.

Why is this important? Federal law prohibits any foreign nationals from financially contributing to any election in the United States. It’s on the FEC website and is one of our most important safeguards against foreign influence in our elections. But anybody in the world can contribute to Obama. Not only that, but they can do so anonymously. Not only that, they can contribute an unlimited amount since there is no record of who made the donation. I could contribute $49 every day for the rest of my life by just changing names every time I reach $2,500 and no one would be the wiser.


I haven’t repeated Mr. Murray’s experiment, but I believe the situation is as described in the words of the Talking Heads: “Same as it ever was.”
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Der Fuhrer
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Junior Carp
Shoood ein getzig mein crrrrrredit cards cancelledsheit?

Iffen ein findze zis frrrrrraudulent felon, he vill meeten mein German sheperd Boopsie! Und Boopsie takenszie nein crrrrrrredit!
miss me yet?
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somebody else's sock
Middle Aged Carp
Somehow this seems like a big yawner. Doesn't seem likely that some rich guy is going to sit around and make up fake names in order to exceed the donation limits.

They'll just use a Super PAC like this: http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/02/01/416238/romney-donors-evade-contribution-limits/?mobile=nc

And I'm sure Obama supporters can and will do the same if they aren't already.

Face it, we're screwed. The rich guys rule the roost.
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George K
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Finally
somebody else's sock
Apr 2 2012, 01:13 PM
Somehow this seems like a big yawner.
Perhaps. But it opens the door for illegalities. How much effort is it for one person to make a $2499 donation, and then, the next day, do it again, using a different name? In 10 days, you're up to a cool 25 grand. As the article says, several of the donations were traced to foreign sources. Get ten people doing it for ten days, now you're talking a quarter million.

Besides, I still want my money back.
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"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
But then you'd have to figure out how to get the Obama/Biden bumper sticker off your car so you could send it back.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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somebody else's sock
Middle Aged Carp
Heck, they even tell you on Obama's donation page a (presumably legal) way to get around the limit:

Quote:
 
Already hit your limit? If you've given the maximum of $2,500 for the primary and $2,500 for the general election to Obama for America, you can still give to the Obama Victory Fund 2012, our joint fundraising committee with the Democratic National Committee and the State Democratic Parties in the following states: CO, FL, IA, NV, NH, NC, OH, PA, VA, and WI., by clicking here.


The weak verification you posted about initially seems to open a theoretical door, but I guess I'm looking at two things.

First, "why bother to do it the slow and tedious way when you can do it legally and much faster way" via Super PACs, lobbyists and heavens knows how many other ways. Maybe you're right, and given some thought it could generate significant bucks, but I still go back to the second thing...

It's all about power, and the folks with money have the power. If one door closes, they'll just figure out how to frame up a new one and use it. And it doesn't matter what side of the political spectrum they are on. These guys (and I mean both sides) make the rules and play the game. We peons can argue about who is breaking what rule, but we're just bystanders watching the game unfold.

BTW, I'm curious. How did you explain this to Discover and Visa when you asked for the refund? (You can plead the Fifth if you prefer.) :whome:
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George K
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Finally
somebody else's sock
Apr 2 2012, 02:46 PM
How did you explain this to Discover and Visa when you asked for the refund? (You can plead the Fifth if you prefer.) :whome:
I didn't ask.

Discover just credited my account with the exorbitant amount that I contributed ($10, I think). The charge was reversed on my statement as a credit. Unfortunately, I don't have that statement handy, and Discover won't let you search more than two years in the past.

Visa just accepted the charge and let it go. I did nothing more.
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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somebody else's sock
Middle Aged Carp
So while the donation went through the Obama site, Discover figured out it shouldn't have without you alerting them?

Interesting commentary on how good Visa's systems are. I always thought Discover was better about monitoring for fraud.

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George K
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Finally
The transaction went through to both sites, but Discover issued a credit.

Back then, I was able to make *two* contributions Obama using the same Visa card with two different names. Neither was refunded.
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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George K
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Finally
Lots of links to the donation sites, a video, and a link to the donation page for (koff, koff) Americans living outside the US.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/04/02/video-obama-campaign-disables-credit-card-verification-accepts-donation-from-nidal-hasan/
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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somebody else's sock
Middle Aged Carp
This worries me way more than the credit card loophole

And a snapshot of who the really big players are
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George K
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Finally
somebody else's sock
Apr 2 2012, 06:09 PM
Nah, they're all pikers.

You wanna see a the *really* big players?

Click.
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
I don't understand what there is to complain about here.

This year the federal government removed the cap on campaign donations. The sky is the limit for special interests if they want to buy a candidate's loyalty and we're worried about John Galt and his mysterious donation of under a thousand dollars. We're terrified of foreign donations but we let domestic branches of a multinational corporation throw as much money into the war chest as they want. Insanity.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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somebody else's sock
Middle Aged Carp
Just a few more ways to look at who legally contributes:

Foreign-connected PACs: http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/foreign.php

Leadership PACs: http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/industry.php?txt=Q03&cycle=2012

Top 20 PAC contributors to candidates: http://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/toppacs.php


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Riley
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HOLY CARP!!!
Funny they have to make laws to stop people from giving too much money away to politicians :lol2:
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Riley
Apr 2 2012, 07:08 PM
Funny they have to make laws to stop people from giving too much money away to politicians :lol2:
Did you check out the link George provided?

It's not people who are the concern.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Aqua Letifer
Apr 2 2012, 07:17 PM
Did you check out the link George provided?

It's not people who are the concern.
You're misinterpreting that link. Those are not donations from those organizations. They are donations from people who work at those organizations.

Big difference.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
jon-nyc
Apr 3 2012, 01:19 AM
Aqua Letifer
Apr 2 2012, 07:17 PM
Did you check out the link George provided?

It's not people who are the concern.
You're misinterpreting that link. Those are not donations from those organizations. They are donations from people who work at those organizations.

Big difference.
Where do you personally draw the line between the two?
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Well, a donation by a corporation (and a corporation can have a pac, funded by its employees) is directed per the will of the organizations' leadership.

The donation of an individual is done without even the knowledge of the corporation. Certainly in some organizations the correlation between the views of the leadership and the average employee might be high (some unions, oil companies). But in others there would be little correlation at all.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
jon-nyc
Apr 3 2012, 01:58 AM
Well, a donation by a corporation (and a corporation can have a pac, funded by its employees) is directed per the will of the organizations' leadership.

The donation of an individual is done without even the knowledge of the corporation. Certainly in some organizations the correlation between the views of the leadership and the average employee might be high (some unions, oil companies). But in others there would be little correlation at all.
Sounds to me then like it'd be more accurate to say the difference is big to negligible, depending on separate circumstances.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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apple
one of the angels
if you are the uber conservative type you might want to check out Imprimis, with speeches delivered at Hillsdale College.. one can even get a subscription for free. some of the speeches included in the newsletters are excellent. If you wanted one of your kids to be a Republican senator or rep.. Hillsdale would be a great place to go. Anyway, i suspect they know of many legal ways to contribute.

Kim gets this.. he loves it.. i do too sometimes altho i have no need to read since he memorizes, practically the speeches and practices on me.
it behooves me to behold
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George K
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Finally
Obama campaign updates security - somewhat.

Quote:
 
President Barack Obama has redesigned his online donations system to reject some anonymous donations, although his website still accepts donations made with bogus names.

In 2008, reporters discovered that Obama’s campaign website was configured to accept donations from unidentifiable donors, including donors overseas.

But in a test April 4, Obama’s site rejected donations from unidentifiable donors.

Numerous bloggers have decried Obama’s site in the last few days because it does not ask donors to submit the three-digit anti-fraud “CVV” code number when donors are using credit-cards to make online donations.

However, Obama’s campaign is not legally obliged to ask for the CVV numbers, as they are merely required to use only their “best effort” to validate the name, occupation and location of the donor. The CVV number is typically used only to verify that the card is in the card-owner’s physical possession.

The identity of legitimate donors can be verified by comparing the credit card’s main number to the data held by the credit card’s issuer. This ensures that campaigns know the real names of donors, even when donors type fake names into the campaign’s online donation page.

Gov. Mitt Romney’s website does ask for the CVV number.

“That’s good practice,” said Peter Pasi, the executive vice president at Arlington, Va.-based emotive LLC, which raises funds online for many GOP politicians, including Sen. Rick Santorum.

At the Obama campaign, “somebody actively made the decision to turn [the CVV request] off,” said Pasi.

“Why would they do that? I don’t know… [but] they probably did it to get an increased response,” he said.

The Obama campaign did not respond to The Daily Caller.

A Daily Caller reporter tested Obama’s donation system April 4 by donating cash via a pre-paid Visa gift card and an Internet proxy server. The Visa card was bought with untraceable cash, and the proxy server hid TheDC’s online identity.

Even though the identity of the donor was technically unverifiable, TheDC fully complied with federal laws, and provided accurate information to the Obama website.

The Obama website rejected the contribution because the Visa gift-card did not have a known address that could be used to verify the donor’s identity.

That’s much different from 2008, when Obama’s campaign accepted unverifiable donations made via American Express gift cards and identity-hiding proxy servers.

In October, 2008, Obama’s top campaign aides excused their decision to automatically accept unverified donations with the claim that they would subsequently use manual checks to verify identities.

“We do a very strong job, both with the technology we use and with this very heavy commitment to comprehensive back-end review,” Robert Bauer, general counsel for the Obama campaign, told National Journal, which broke the story.

However, Obama’s campaign also claimed to have had 6.5 million online donors in 2008, who collectively donated $500 million.

The campaign downplayed the scandal before and after the election, even though data released by the campaign showed numerous suspicious donations from overseas, and at least one case where $174,800 was donated via a credit card under the name of a retired person in Manchester, Mo.
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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George K
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Finally
Foreign Donors?
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
Hey George, look at this $1 MILLION donation from a wholly owned subsidiary of a foreign corporation:

http://www.publicintegrity.org/2012/10/05/11148/canadian-owned-firms-mega-donation-super-pac-raises-legal-red-flags

Frankly, I am more suspicious about $1 MILLION donation from one entity than I do about $100 donations from 10,000 individuals.
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
George K
Oct 8 2012, 06:52 AM
It's a website that collects e-mail addresses, George ... can you explain to me how you figure Romney's website would be any better at screening out "foreign national" from subscribing to its e-mail communications, and how the Mitt Romney campaign's e-mail communications team would be any better at figuring out which subscribers are "foreign nationals" and hence NOT sending out any plea for contribution to their e-mail addresses?
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