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| Woman denied Communion because she's a lesbian | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Mar 1 2012, 08:38 AM (4,048 Views) | |
| Copper | Mar 1 2012, 06:58 PM Post #51 |
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Shortstop
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Yes, but they didn't have Obama death panels back then. The reps will be back sooner or later and they will take advantage of the new tools. |
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The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy | |
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| John D'Oh | Mar 1 2012, 07:08 PM Post #52 |
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MAMIL
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Christianity would have been completely f*cked up if he had. They'd have needed to find some other poor stooge to fulfill the prophecy. Anyway, once you've committed the sin in your heart, haven't you as good as committed it in the real world? |
| What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket? | |
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| jon-nyc | Mar 1 2012, 07:10 PM Post #53 |
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Cheers
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And refuse to fulfill the prophesy of your lord and savior? I don't think that was a realistic option. It would have required Jesus to be wrong, no? |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| Jolly | Mar 1 2012, 07:18 PM Post #54 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Have to have our resident theologians weigh in, but did Judas have Free Will, or not? |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Dewey | Mar 1 2012, 07:35 PM Post #55 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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The church is within its rights as an institution to establish and enforce its own rules. That said, I think the decision to withhold the Lord's Supper to this woman was at best wrong, and at worst stupid and contrary to Christ's teaching. And the decision of the priest to walk out on the funeral was unthinkable and disgusting, and evidence of such a complete lack of pastoral ability that he should receive serious sanction and discipline, possibly even removal from a pastoral role entirely for at least some length of time. This woman would have received the Lord's Supper in my tradition. We believe that the sacrament is open to any baptized believer, flawed and imperfect, and even if they carry some doubts - "all those who trust in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ," as I say at the beginning of the sacrament. We believe that the sacrament should be entered into prayerfully and with seriousness, but ultimately, only the person himself or herself my determine, consistent with their own conscience, whether they should participate in the meal or not - the minister will not stop someone from participating. |
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"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685. "Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous "Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011 I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14 | |
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| John D'Oh | Mar 1 2012, 07:50 PM Post #56 |
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MAMIL
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Who knows? Maybe he'd agreed his actions with Jesus beforehand - like Snape and Dumbledore. |
| What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket? | |
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| jon-nyc | Mar 1 2012, 07:52 PM Post #57 |
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Cheers
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That's a question for the philosophers. Are you trying to avoid answering mine? |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| Jolly | Mar 1 2012, 08:01 PM Post #58 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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Not a bit. Jesus was not wrong. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| jon-nyc | Mar 1 2012, 08:04 PM Post #59 |
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Cheers
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Could he have been wrong? |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| Jolly | Mar 1 2012, 08:14 PM Post #60 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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No. Which makes it so fascinating. |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| jon-nyc | Mar 1 2012, 08:16 PM Post #61 |
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Cheers
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Well then I'd say Judas took one for the team. The lord's work, as I said. |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| ivorythumper | Mar 1 2012, 08:52 PM Post #62 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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People give up free will all the time and enslave themselves to all sorts of things. It wasn't Jesus who compelled him or coerced him, and it wasn't even a prophecy to be fulfilled that mandate Judas do it (see Luke 22:3 & John 13:27). Nothing remarkable about any of this. Had Judas repented after betraying Christ, the Church would celebrate the Feast of St. Judas Iscariot. |
| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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| apple | Mar 2 2012, 04:03 AM Post #63 |
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one of the angels
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orly |
| it behooves me to behold | |
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| The 89th Key | Mar 2 2012, 04:04 AM Post #64 |
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The odds that we are going to agree on this topic = the odds the fire will be put out this way:
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| John D'Oh | Mar 2 2012, 04:10 AM Post #65 |
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MAMIL
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Nobody knows whether he repented. He obviously felt pretty bad about it afterwards. I've always thought Judas was a bit maligned. His motivations aren't clear - I've heard people say that he wanted Jesus to be pushed into finally declaring himself, and take on the Romans. Completely missing the point, as so many have done since. |
| What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket? | |
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| Dave Spelvin | Mar 2 2012, 04:35 AM Post #66 |
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Fulla-Carp
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At the time of the funeral, didn't Ms. Lesbian still have the ability not to commit homosexual acts? |
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| Jolly | Mar 2 2012, 04:45 AM Post #67 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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She had the ability, but did she have the will to repent? |
| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| John D'Oh | Mar 2 2012, 05:13 AM Post #68 |
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MAMIL
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Who knows? If Jesus felt there was hope for Judas, surely the priest could have given her the benefit of the doubt at her own mother's funeral. Walking out on a funeral like that is the act of an asshole - someone who has put doctrine in front of humanity. |
| What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket? | |
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| apple | Mar 2 2012, 05:53 AM Post #69 |
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one of the angels
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that's a sin |
| it behooves me to behold | |
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| Dewey | Mar 2 2012, 06:16 AM Post #70 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Word. And the Word actually had more than a few words to say about that. |
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"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685. "Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous "Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011 I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14 | |
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| Axtremus | Mar 2 2012, 06:37 AM Post #71 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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No need for theologian. "Free will" and "omniscience" are mutually exclusive. |
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| Axtremus | Mar 2 2012, 06:40 AM Post #72 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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See, same as what I said, same exact words, even.
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| Copper | Mar 2 2012, 06:51 AM Post #73 |
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Shortstop
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There seems to be general agreement that the priest in question made a mistake. The church and archdiosese clearly agree as the apology shows. The difference seems to be between those who celebrate this event and those who don't. |
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The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy | |
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| Dewey | Mar 2 2012, 06:54 AM Post #74 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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No, I think there have been several who celebrate this event - and even one who officiates it - who has criticized the priest's refusal to allow her to participate in it. |
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"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685. "Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous "Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011 I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14 | |
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| ivorythumper | Mar 2 2012, 07:29 AM Post #75 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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So Dewey -- on what grounds if any is someone subject to excommunication from your congregation? Only public apostasy? Say Dr X, an abortionist who you know also occasionally beats his wife, shows up drunk to your service and approaches the table. You remind of the injunction in 1 Cor 11, but he insists: "Just give me the *(&^%$^& Jesus cookie". Do you communicate him? He obviously believes in some respect that is the Body of Christ... Are you not also a sort of "guardian" of communion? |
| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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