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| Is this a crime? | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 15 2012, 10:26 PM (412 Views) | |
| kenny | Feb 15 2012, 10:26 PM Post #1 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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http://news.yahoo.com/video/miamicbs4-15750840/lauderdale-rolex-thief-caught-on-camera-28307768.html IMHO, this is different than stealing the watch by force or by pickpocketing. The owner was negligent and lost it, then this guy found it. It happened in a public place, not in the owner's home. That only seconds elapsed between the lost and the found events, that the owner was the person in front of him and very possibly still visible, that the location was an airport so it was captured on video which is now broadcast for all of us to see changes nothing besides converting it into a tantalizing news story. I'm not saying it's right for him to keep it, (I wouldn't) but I don't think what he did was a crime. IMHO the ethical thing for him to do is to run ahead and return the watch to the owner if he recognizes him/her, or turn it in to lost and found, but I suspect he may be within his legal rights to keep what he found. Ethics and law are not the same thing. Are there laws that require you to turn in something found if it is over a certain value? |
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| ivorythumper | Feb 15 2012, 10:45 PM Post #2 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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Here's what the Florida law says: 705.102. Reporting lost or abandoned property (1) Whenever any person finds any lost or abandoned property, such person shall report the description and location of the property to a law enforcement officer. (2) The law enforcement officer taking the report shall ascertain whether the person reporting the property wishes to make a claim to it if the rightful owner cannot be identified or located. If the person does wish to make such claim, he or she shall deposit with the law enforcement agency a reasonable sum sufficient to cover the agency's cost for transportation, storage, and publication of notice. This sum shall be reimbursed to the finder by the rightful owner should he or she identify and reclaim the property. (3) It is unlawful for any person who finds any lost or abandoned property to appropriate the same to his or her own use or to refuse to deliver the same when required. (4) Any person who unlawfully appropriates such lost or abandoned property to his or her own use or refuses to deliver such property when required commits theft as defined in s. 812.014, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084. CREDIT(S) Laws 1987, c. 87-82, § 2. Amended by Laws 1992, c. 92-79, § 4, eff. Oct. 1, 1992; Laws 1997, c. 97-102, § 790, eff. July 1, 1997. |
| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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| kenny | Feb 15 2012, 10:54 PM Post #3 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Thanks. So it may vary by state? |
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| AndyD | Feb 15 2012, 11:33 PM Post #4 |
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Senior Carp
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If it's worth your picking it up, it ought to be reported, watch, wallet whatever. Only exception I'd make is for cash...find a 20 blowing along the pavement and there's no point taking it to the local station. Of course if you see someone drop it, you pick it up and give it back. To me there is little difference between ethics and the law, they define us and our society. Ethics are a conduct choice often done in secret, whereas laws are enforced rules of ethical conduct imposed to ensure society functions and with punishment for transgression. |
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Every morning the soul is once again as good as new, and again one offers it to one's brothers & sisters in life. | |
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| jon-nyc | Feb 16 2012, 01:51 AM Post #5 |
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Cheers
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Looked like a crime to me. |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| JBryan | Feb 16 2012, 04:00 AM Post #6 |
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I am the grey one
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Free watch! Cool! Uh, no. |
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"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it". Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody. Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore. From The Lion in Winter. | |
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| apple | Feb 16 2012, 04:16 AM Post #7 |
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one of the angels
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too bad he was filmed. My dad lost part of his paycheck back in the 60's - an envelope with about 200 bucks in it. It took a while, a few days perhaps, but a guy showed up with it.. a black man who said.. 'I just had to be sure it was you' or something to that effect. I remember my dad crumpling to the floor, kissing his hands... i was absolutely floored! times must have been tight and that was our grocery and gas money for the month. They'll have a list of people on that flight. |
| it behooves me to behold | |
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| Improviso | Feb 16 2012, 04:53 AM Post #8 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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"The true test of a man's character is what he does when no one is watching. What a sleazeball. |
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Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism. We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences. | |
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| The 89th Key | Feb 16 2012, 05:02 AM Post #9 |
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It looks like he was "watching".
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| The 89th Key | Feb 16 2012, 05:06 AM Post #10 |
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Kenny - IMO, if someone has a reasonable chance at returning a lost item to the original owner, it's wrong if they don't do so. This includes leaving something in the lost and found section. Of course, if I found something on the sidewalk and really had no way of tracking the owner down, I think at some point you can just pocket it... But in this situation, it's pretty clear this guy didn't do the right (nor legal) thing. |
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| John D'Oh | Feb 16 2012, 05:08 AM Post #11 |
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MAMIL
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I once found a thousand dollars that had been abandoned. I tried very hard to figure out who it belonged to, but eventually kept the money. Why someone would leave all that money inside a hotel safe during a fire drill is completely beyond me. |
| What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket? | |
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| blondie | Feb 16 2012, 05:12 AM Post #12 |
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Bull-Carp
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So true x2 |
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| Nobody's Sock | Feb 16 2012, 05:42 AM Post #13 |
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Fulla-Carp
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only if he gets caught. right now it's only a half crime since he hasn't been caught but they got his pretty face on film. |
| "Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known." | |
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| blondie | Feb 16 2012, 05:55 AM Post #14 |
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Bull-Carp
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If I were his mommy seeing this clip, he'd be in big trouble. |
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| Chris Aher | Feb 16 2012, 05:59 AM Post #15 |
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Middle Aged Carp
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When I was working for Lincoln Center in NYC about 40 years ago, I found a gem on the floor under a seat in one of the concert halls after a concert. Since it was a subscription series (Chamber Music Society of Lincoln Center IIRC) I was able, with a little bit of detective work with the box office and the subscription dept. to find the owner. It turned out that is had fallen out of a very valuable family heirloom. The owner was extremely grateful and a week later I received a check for ten percent of the value of the gem as a thank you. It was more that a month's wages at the time. |
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Regards, Chris | |
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| The 89th Key | Feb 16 2012, 06:05 AM Post #16 |
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Cool, story Chris! |
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| Kincaid | Feb 16 2012, 08:58 AM Post #17 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Legally wrong (at least in Florida) and ethically wrong - unless the guy marched right over to lost and found to turn it in. If I found that watch in such a situation and I wasn't sure whose it was, I'd have notified one of the security people and just given it to them. My roomate in college, Jim, had a similar experience when he was in high school. He was at a debate tournament that was being held at the downtown university. He found a wallet in the restroom that had over $300 in it. It had all the guy's ID (an Asian student). He took it to the front desk of the building and gave it to the student clerk working there. That person was so blase about it that Jim was worried the clerk was just going to pocket the money and throw out the rest. Jim gave his info to the clerk and grilled him on what his procedure was. A few days later he got a call from the very grateful student telling him that the cash was meant to pay for his books that term. |
| Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006. | |
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| jon-nyc | Feb 16 2012, 09:07 AM Post #18 |
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Cheers
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WHo most likely would look around, and if no one was looking, slip it into his pocket. |
| In my defense, I was left unsupervised. | |
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| Kincaid | Feb 16 2012, 09:09 AM Post #19 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Ah, but then the TSA agent would be on video ha ha! |
| Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006. | |
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| Aqua Letifer | Feb 16 2012, 09:23 AM Post #20 |
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ZOOOOOM!
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I may have posted about the wallet I found at Subway once. I felt guilty going through it, but it was the only way to find an address. It was an Indian guy's wallet. He had pictures of loved ones inside (who were obviously back home in India), a community college access card and something else pertaining to his job. I went to the post office that afternoon and sent it back to him express. Just a couple weeks ago, when I was getting on the bus here I saw someone drop a fiver. Well I didn't actually see the person dropping it but it had to have come from someone in front of me, only there was absolutely no telling who it really came from. And just how would you figure that out anyway, when you're the only one who noticed? Ask, "whose five bucks is this?" I think not. The situation was also made worse by the fact that a couple guys saw the five bucks on the ground too, saw me look at it and stared at me, curious about what I would do. I figured this old Chinese woman was the most likely culprit; she was fumbling through her wallet to pull out her bus ticket at the time. I tried to give the money to her but she spoke no English and had absolutely no idea what the hell I was trying to do. Other folks turned around from the line and it was obvious they didn't recognize the five bucks, so I basically forced the old woman to take it. She took it, but stared at me like I was a crazy person for the rest of the trip into town. What a ****ty bus ride that was. |
| I cite irreconcilable differences. | |
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| JBryan | Feb 16 2012, 09:33 AM Post #21 |
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I am the grey one
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She was probably pissed because you seemed to think she was only worth a fiver. You are fortunate you didn't ask her for change. |
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"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it". Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody. Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore. From The Lion in Winter. | |
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| kenny | Feb 16 2012, 09:36 AM Post #22 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I totally agree. Keeping it is wrong, and I would not keep it either. The issue I was curious about is the legal question. |
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| kenny | Feb 16 2012, 09:36 AM Post #23 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Nyuck Nyuck Nyuck. |
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| kenny | Feb 16 2012, 09:40 AM Post #24 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I think when turning in something of value I'd be sure to insist that 3 or more employees witness the return. |
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| AndyD | Feb 16 2012, 01:14 PM Post #25 |
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Senior Carp
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Kenny, should you visit England, the law says you cannot assume rights of ownership over something you find. There was a lottery ticket case a few years back... I have taken things to the local police station, seems simplest to let them deal with things. They log 'it' and your details in a duty book. However friends I know have returned items directly. Incidentally, London transport has a quite famous lost property office, something like 200 thousand items a year! |
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Every morning the soul is once again as good as new, and again one offers it to one's brothers & sisters in life. | |
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12:53 AM Jul 11