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| Proposition 8 ruled "unconstitutional"; ...sets up Supreme Court battle | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Feb 7 2012, 10:09 AM (2,430 Views) | |
| ivorythumper | Feb 15 2012, 03:58 PM Post #201 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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Perhaps I can clarify this way, using Jon's words as the base:
The Church presumes all marriages to be valid. It does so despite divorce, until there has been an examination of the evidence and it judges the marriage to be invalid. That is what I have been saying all along. I don't see that as a non point or a tautology. It also shows how Jon reframed my position. The point I have been making consistently is that regardless of divorce the Church still considers the marriage valid. I made this point in #159, when I noted to you that your statement was not my point. |
| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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| KlavierBauer | Feb 15 2012, 04:25 PM Post #202 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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The original point was:
I made the point that since the Church doesn't care about the State's definition of marriage, what the church will consider to be a marriage (valid or not) will be based on the Church's definition of marriage, which doesn't include gay marriage. So naturally the Church views all marriages as valid without evidence to the contrary, since they define what marriage is - so where Ax criticized you for saying "All" I was backing up your point, in that it is true within the definition of what the Church considers marriage to be. And Jon didn't reframe anything - after I first called it a tautology, he agreed, adding a re-wording that essentially said the same thing that I made in my original point (without addressing what you said, or your point, at all, but rather my interpretation of it). And since then you've been defending why the statement isn't tautological. OK - fine.
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| ivorythumper | Feb 15 2012, 04:32 PM Post #203 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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These are not even the same propositionally. I don't know how you cannot call that reframing. But OK - fine.
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| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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| KlavierBauer | Feb 15 2012, 04:41 PM Post #204 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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*facepalm* He reframed my assertion that it was tautological. My point originally, when I first called it a tautology, was that the church *does* accept all marriages, contrary to Ax's words, since the church doesn't consider marriages which it doesn't accept to be marriages at all, since they have the luxury of defining the term. That's what Jon reworded. What about this is so difficult? I think you're still thinking that Jon's the one who called this a tautology... |
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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| KlavierBauer | Feb 15 2012, 05:06 PM Post #205 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Look - I'm sorry IT - I'm obviously not speaking well or communicating what I mean to communicate, and my goal wasn't to argue with you. So I'm sorry... |
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"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper "He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple | |
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