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How much does life define the songwriter?; A P!nk thread...somewhat...
Topic Started: Jul 30 2011, 09:44 AM (333 Views)
Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
A current female artist I do like:

http://www.pinkspage.com/us/home

Writes a lot of her own stuff, handles some adult themes plus some catchy dance tunes. Plus, compared to GaGa, I think she might be tougher to live with, but she'd be a lot more fun.

Back to the thread title...P!nk and her husband recently had their first child, and one of her interview quotes afterward made me wonder about her songwriting...she said, "Now, I know what love means". Since many of her songs are about relationships, does that change the nature of her songwriting?

Does the songwriter define life, or does life define the songwriter?

The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Eh, both, I think.

In terms of writing generally:

A lady in one of my writing classes was a Bosnian communist. (Well, communist in the sense that she supported the only local politician who was willing to actually try and fix her village after the recent nastiness, who claimed that he was a communist.)

She had a Jewish friend of hers who was successful in escaping Germany and arriving in America just prior to WW2.

Could I write a story about that? Course I could. I'd have to do a lot of research but it might come out okay, it might be some pretty good work. It might be very true to history.

But it would never be real in the way that her friend could make it real, had he written it instead. Some things can't be researched or approximated.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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apple
one of the angels
think of Amy Winehouse - her life totally defined her songwriting. I've listened to just about everything she wrote.. what a blippo she was, to be so tormented - perhaps because of the environment she grew up in.
it behooves me to behold
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
I'll take your word for it, apple. Not at all familiar with her songs.

But not everyone is an "I sing about what I see" songwriter. The guys in Sonata Arctica sing about werewolves and Norse Mythology. So did many classical composers, before anyone goes discrediting anyone not a pop superstar.

You can get your inspiration from anywhere, personal experiences or otherwise.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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blondie
Bull-Carp
Good questions Jolly.
I had to give them some thought.
To me, for me, it boils down to visuals, affect, and emotion.
Pink is expressive. I see it and hear it. Pure emotion (and a range of emotion) comes through in words, voice, and facial expression. I guess I look for this and see honesty in that.
When I see Gaga, I don't. She's static, almost plastic. I don't know anything of Amy Winehouse. Avril Lavigne is an artist I never warmed up to. Lots of good lyrics, good music, but seeing her? Nope, there's this static fixed facial expression. So she doesn't speak to me.
Talking of performances Ray Charles had great visual expression, and that combined with his voice, music + lyrics is almost like butter melting on oven fresh bread.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
I think for Jackson Browne his life defines his songs. When great things or bad things happen to him he makes great music, otherwise its just ok.

Warren Zevon was another like that.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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blondie
Bull-Carp
I guess some artists write for the sake of writing. Others don't. Some suck when they've nothing to write about.

People love Michael Jackson. Well, many do. To me he seemed always on stage, always staging himself. I couldn't perceive real emotions. I don't like that. But then again, I'm not into fake people. I see right through that. I want people to be real with me.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
I'm no songwriter, but I think my writing improves with anger or sadness.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
It also depends on the genre. Blues is almost totally emotion and life experience. That doesn't mean someone can't write blues songs unless they've experienced the "blues" or that many weren't written that way, however. Some forms of modern music are based on a combination of other forms of music. Each form and each new genre produces variants as time goes on.

Most Rock music, a genre that has so many variants that it is now more of an "umbrella" term than a single genre, has little to do with emotions. Most of it is what is called "formula writing". When I listen to people like Pink, I hear "formula" but with a little bit of self reflection in the music. Not much, but some. When I hear people like that ditzy blonde who used to be a Disney kid (what IS her name..) all I hear is formula.

Also, some songs tell a story, some just repeat a sentence or two over and over again. I think just about anyone could write the lyrics to a rock song that just repeats itself over and over again, if they learn the "formula" for writing the music - something that isn't that hard to do, actually...

But if you want to tell a story, tell it well, and get that story to tug at the listener's emotions within 3:52 minutes...... you'd better have some talent........
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
And what about the guys who can write and sing? Or can knock out those great line which need no explanation?

When I think of great lines in a song, I think of something like Whiskey Lullaby which talks about the guy drinking himself to death: He put the bottle to his head and pulled the trigger...

The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Yes. Those are the poets. Very few poets in pop or rock, several in the country genre. There used to be, but not lately..
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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sue
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HOLY CARP!!!
ivorythumper
Jul 30 2011, 11:38 PM
I think for Jackson Browne his life defines his songs. When great things or bad things happen to him he makes great music, otherwise its just ok.

Warren Zevon was another like that.
:thumb: :thumb:
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blondie
Bull-Carp
I like this thread.
Haven't thought this about a thread in a long while.
Good comments from Larry and Jolly. Kind of makes me rethink country music, of the lyrics and emotion.
Perhaps country artists are more 'complete' if this makes sense.
Always thought of doing that musical marathon in Nashville. For the music. Maybe I might.
A good ballad is a fine thing. No matter what kind of music it is.
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sue
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HOLY CARP!!!
I agree, it is an interesting question. By chance, I turned on the tv last night and caught a performance by John Mann. Hadn't thought about him in some time, but it made me think of this thread.

This is what I like: good songwriting (yes, it's personal, was written at the end of a relationship), a real singing voice, and clearly someone comfortable in their own skin. I first heard this in the 80's (with the rest of Spirit of the West), loved it then, and it still moves me. That's a good song, imo. And a talented musician.
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blondie
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Well hey Sue. I heard something new today. And yeah hey, I do really like him.
From Vancouver too. Cool!

Funny how certain artists speak to us at different points in our lives, eh?
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Jolly
Jul 31 2011, 03:43 AM
I'm no songwriter, but I think my writing improves with anger or sadness.
That's no accident.

You have to give a crap about what you're doing to write something worth any quality. It requires so much energy. It's not like other forms of work. You for example might be a teacher because you enjoy educating and enriching the lives of children. You fix the fence out back or build a shed, because the fence needs fixing and the shed needs building.

Writing isn't like that. Nobody cares what you're doing behind that closed door, except maybe for you. There are no external pressures to get any writing done. And considering how much effort on your part is required, it's little wonder why so many writers excel in procrastination.

Strong emotions, positive or negative, are a great benefit for writers because they can provide the required energy one can channel into their work.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
A well worded contract with a sizable check does a lot to motivate one also... hehe
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Larry
Jul 31 2011, 11:25 PM
A well worded contract with a sizable check does a lot to motivate one also... hehe
^_^
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
:D

Pay me enough, and I can do whatever mood you want....


although come to think of it.. sweet and sappy does require a bit more percentage....
Edited by Larry, Jul 31 2011, 11:32 PM.
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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brenda
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..............
Aqua Letifer
Jul 31 2011, 09:35 PM
Jolly
Jul 31 2011, 03:43 AM
I'm no songwriter, but I think my writing improves with anger or sadness.
That's no accident.

You have to give a crap about what you're doing to hook something worth any quality. It requires so much energy. It's not like other forms of work. You for example might be a teacher because you enjoy educating and enriching the lives of children. You fix the fence out back or build a shed, because the fence needs fixing and the shed needs building.

Hooking isn't like that. Nobody cares what you're doing behind that closed door, except maybe for you. There are no external pressures to get any hooking done. And considering how much effort on your part is required, it's little wonder why so many hookers excel in procrastination.

Strong emotions, positive or negative, are a great benefit for hookers because they can provide the required energy one can channel into their work.
True from a rug hooker's perspective, too.
“Weeds are flowers, too, once you get to know them.”
~A.A. Milne
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