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If the rapture really happens tomorrow . . .; AKA . . . the Good Bye Thread
Topic Started: May 20 2011, 01:21 PM (12,116 Views)
Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
IT, really - is it worth it?






"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Larry
May 24 2011, 10:01 AM
I think it is fair that you state what the Catholic view concerning baptism is, because I do not intend to continue shooting at moving targets.

There is no moving target. This is your chance to prove that the Catholic Church is wrong. I trust that you really do understand what the Catholic Church actually teaches if you can already know that it is wrong.

So go ahead and start.

If you are mistaken about what the Church actually teaches, I will use only the bible to clarify things, since you do not accept what the Catholic Church teaches anyway and it would be meaningless for me to quote the Catechism or any saints or theologians.

This is only about the bible, and only about the validity or invalidity of infant baptism and whether the Eucharist is just a symbol or really the Body and Blood of Jesus.

You can start when you are ready.
Edited by ivorythumper, May 24 2011, 10:09 AM.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Dewey
May 24 2011, 10:06 AM
IT, really - is it worth it?






I dunno, Dewey. I don't think it is possible using scripture to disprove the validity of infant baptism or to show that the Eucharist really isn't the Body and Blood of Jesus. But I am interested to see what he comes up with.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Well, if you're not sure of what you believe, or if you doubt the Catholic teaching on baptism, that's fine with me.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Larry
May 24 2011, 10:11 AM
Well, if you're not sure of what you believe, or if you doubt the Catholic teaching on baptism, that's fine with me.

I know what I believe, and I have no doubts.

But this is not about me. It is about your chance to disprove the Catholic teachings using the bible.

You can start when you are ready.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
"Well, I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition"
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
OH NOES it's da' Renaissance Men!

This time with a heavenly host of angelos dancing tarantellas on the head of a railroad spike.
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blondie
Bull-Carp
I see it's playtime now with the brains ..
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
I've I think we've all seen this scene before:

Posted Image
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Axtremus
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HOLY CARP!!!
blondie
May 24 2011, 09:49 AM
Okay, there are a few swimsuit pics there if you dig deep enough.
Those are very nice pictures, blondie.

Sorry it took me a while to come back and comment. I had lots of tissue paper to flush down because of all the nose bleeding.
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Chris Aher
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Middle Aged Carp
John D'Oh
May 24 2011, 10:14 AM
"Well, I wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition"
Another DEP (D'Oh Exclusion Principle) in the road!

As opposed to a DIP in the road:

Posted Image
Edited by Chris Aher, May 24 2011, 10:26 AM.
Regards,
Chris
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Quote:
 
But this is not about me. It is about your chance to disprove the Catholic teachings using the bible.


Then as a Catholic, for the record, state what those teachings are. Please use the Bible to do so.

Thank you.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
ivorythumper
May 24 2011, 10:11 AM
Dewey
May 24 2011, 10:06 AM
IT, really - is it worth it?






I dunno, Dewey. I don't think it is possible using scripture to disprove the validity of infant baptism or to show that the Eucharist really isn't the Body and Blood of Jesus. But I am interested to see what he comes up with.
I guess I'm just saying, even disregarding how you and I would read the same scriptures and interpret them differently to reach our own admittedly different views of the Eucharist - just looking at everything else, once an environment becomes so target-rich, it's just, I don't know... unseemly to go after it. If a mouse with a hardon is floating down the river on his back, and yelling downstream "Raise the Drawbridge!" one can either try to correct the mouse's delusion, or just chuckle and keep walking.
"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
:lol2:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Larry
May 24 2011, 10:26 AM
Quote:
 
But this is not about me. It is about your chance to disprove the Catholic teachings using the bible.


Then as a Catholic, for the record, state what those teachings are. Please use the Bible to do so.

Thank you.

Larry, you must already know what the teachings are if you know them to be wrong.

So just make your case using the bible.

You can start when you are ready.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
That's kind of mean, Dewey.

Plus, I've found this thread to be somewhat enlightening. It's helping me personally in my own studies.
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Dewey
May 24 2011, 10:27 AM
If a mouse with a hardon is floating down the river on his back, and yelling downstream "Raise the Drawbridge!" one can either try to correct the mouse's delusion, or just chuckle and keep walking.
I can't believe it! A talking mouse! :lol2: :lol2: :lol2:
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
If all you're here to do is make fun Dewey, shut up. You have accused me of not knowing what I'm talking about theologically, even though I have yet to get to any theology and speak about it. Seems to me I'm dealing with two guys with a chip on their shoulders who are more interested in "trapping" me than you are in discussing anything.

The debate over Protestantism vs Catholicism is not new, nothing I have said is out of step with most protestant thought. I know IT doesn't accept that, who in the hell knows what it is you believe any more, Dewey.

IT wants me to explain why infant baptism is not biblical. For me to do that, I need him to state for the record just what the Catholic Church teaches about baptism - what the purpose of baptism is, and where in the Bible the Church draws its views. If you knew half as much as you think you do Dewey, you would understand that getting a Catholic to state what he thinks the purpose of baptism is is quite important to any discussion of the subject.



Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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kluurs
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Fulla-Carp
Using all those painful doctrinal lessons back in the day, infants were baptized so that they might enter the kingdom of heaven. Children who perish before baptism are SOL (salvation out of luck). Baptism is the necessary antecedent to gaining salvation. It was(is) the responsibility of the parents and godparents to answer for the infant and see to it that he/she makes a go of it.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Dewey, I do take Larry seriously. If he thinks he can show that the Catholic Church is wrong about infant baptism and the Eucharist, using only the bible to do so, I'd like to see it.

Already though he has appealed to simple unsupported declarative statements, such as "They were included in the Septuagint for their historical value only, and were not considered to be scripture." -- he bases this on whether they were ever quoted by others, which is meaningless on the face of it since other texts that were quoted are not in the canon.

I doubt he can ever prove from the texts themselves which are and are not "divinely inspired", and he has no solid immovable ground for deciding what is or is not to be included in the Bible (other than presumably his present the King James version -- which to weaken that point first did include these other books until the last half of the 17th century).
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
Quote:
 
Seems to me I'm dealing with two guys with a chip on their shoulders


Seems to me I'm dealing with a mouse with a hardon.

Float on, man. :lol2:



"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
kluurs
May 24 2011, 10:45 AM
Using all those painful doctrinal lessons back in the day, infants were baptized so that they might enter the kingdom of heaven. Children who perish before baptism are SOL (salvation out of luck). Baptism is the necessary antecedent to gaining salvation. It was(is) the responsibility of the parents and godparents to answer for the infant and see to it that he/she makes a go of it.
This has been my understanding of it too, Kluurs. I'm not sure I agree or disagree, but since I'm not Catholic, it has never really been much of an issue to me.
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Larry
 
who in the hell knows what it is you believe any more, Dewey.


Bouyant and sexually aroused talking mice?
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
Wasn't the idea of Limbo introduced as a way to take care of the problem of infants who died prior to being baptised - so they were innocent of personal sin, but guilty of original sin? A rather ludicrous concept, in my admittedly uneducated opinion - but rather a good example of the way theologians seem to tie themselves in knots, and then have to invent things to untie themselves and make everybody feel better about the world. I must admit, I have vaguely similar feelings about these sub-atomic particles that physicists seem to invent on a regular basis to explain some otherwise inexplicable phenomenon, but that's just my heretical inner voice speaking.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Ivorythumper: Dec 12 2005
12:02 PM
Limbo is, and always has been, a "theological opinion" -- not a teaching, doctrine or dogma. It was a medieval construct to solve a problem -- but even so it was deemed to be "a place of perfect natural happiness" -- hardly a bad place and much better than our own temporal existences. Hardly cruel -- quite the opposite. A place of mercy.
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