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Here come the knee jerk reactions to the tragedy
Topic Started: Jan 9 2011, 09:21 PM (670 Views)
KlavierBauer
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HOLY CARP!!!
I didn't have time to add to my post as I was walking out the door - but while I agree that it would be interesting to know that Apple, I don't think it would change anything. It would also be "interesting" to know how many people are criminally carrying in general.

My point originally, was that it already is illegal for the mentally ill to own a firearm, and making it illegal doesn't change the fact (obviously) that they still have them, which was to demonstrate my point that more control isn't the answer (at least in my opinion).
"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper
"He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple

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Mark
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HOLY CARP!!!
The anti-gun crowd wants the impossible.

Just like the anti-drug crowd.

Punish all of us for the actions of a extremely tiny minority all in the name of making the world a safe place.

Impossible, pipe dreams of utopia.
___.___
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o 0
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
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Improviso
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HOLY CARP!!!
Mark
Jan 10 2011, 03:44 PM
Punish all of us for the actions of a extremely tiny minority all in the name of making the world a safe place.
No need to bring Big Sis and the TSA into this. :D
Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments
and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism.

We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
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KlavierBauer
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HOLY CARP!!!
Mark: Not to mention all of the enormous number of positive stories, in which a gun stops, or prevents a crime entirely.
These number in the thousands each year, and go largely unreported (ignored), simply because they don't paint quite the same picture as does a political extremist with a mental disorder shooting a girl born on 9/11, and a politician.

"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper
"He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple

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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
Mark
Jan 10 2011, 03:44 PM
The anti-gun crowd wants the impossible.

Just like the anti-drug crowd.

Punish all of us for the actions of a extremely tiny minority all in the name of making the world a safe place.

Impossible, pipe dreams of utopia.
I see what you did there...
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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KlavierBauer
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HOLY CARP!!!
pipe dreams? :) Mark has lots of those.
"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper
"He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple

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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
apple
Jan 10 2011, 01:55 PM
KB it would be interesting to know the percentage of mentally ill that have not been adjudicated to be mentally defective or involuntarily committed. Only those would show up on radar.
First, define mentally defective.

Is it someone who has seen a psychiatrist? Psychologist? Counselor of some type?

Sure you want to take away Constitutional rights based on such a silly whim?

You might...the Clinton Administration manged to write into law a way to take your rights away without Due Process (at least in my opinion). All I have to do is get restraining order against you for domestic violence...not a particularly hard thing to do...and you will never pass another NICs.

But don't take my word for it, read the ATF4473 for yourself:

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473.pdf
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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apple
one of the angels
as it stands now.. i think, if one has been involuntarily committed or legally declared incompetent if legally recorded.

how is mentally defective defined..and when is it recorded?

I fight for the rights of the mentally ill, at least i have in the past... Jolly and Mark.
it behooves me to behold
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
apple
Jan 10 2011, 06:47 PM
as it stands now.. i think, if one has been involuntarily committed or legally declared incompetent if legally recorded.

how is mentally defective defined..and when is it recorded?

I fight for the rights of the mentally ill, at least i have in the past... Jolly and Mark.
Read the damn form instead of shooting from the hip. That's why I linked it.

I was a gun dealer for over 20 years...in the case of a 4473, I know what I'm talking about.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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KlavierBauer
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HOLY CARP!!!
Jolly, In Apple's defense, she's referring to my quoting of the Gun Act of 1968, where the rules for mentally defective use the same verbiage as the ATF's form you quote, but don't describe so completely the other qualifiers (everything within the parenthesis).
It makes it somewhat unclear as to what "mentally ill" is - especially if terms like "mentally unstable" are used, which could refer to anyone with anything in the DSM-IV like bi-polar disorder or similar.
The form at least specifies that you're a danger to self and others, and unable to manage your own affairs, which more clearly describes what mentally ill means.
Thanks for posting it - it also proves the point that indeed, it IS illegal for someone in this predicament to own a weapon, and at least makes plain, why some (me) would think that simply making it more illegal isn't going to solve anything.
"I realize you want him to touch you all over and give you babies, but his handling of the PR side really did screw the pooch." - Ivory Thumper
"He said sleepily: "Don't worry mom, my dick is like hot logs in the morning." - Apple

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RosemaryTwo
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HOLY CARP!!!
apple
Jan 10 2011, 06:47 PM
as it stands now.. i think, if one has been involuntarily committed or legally declared incompetent if legally recorded.

how is mentally defective defined..and when is it recorded?

I fight for the rights of the mentally ill, at least i have in the past... Jolly and Mark.
FWIW, I had a manic-depressive rocket-scientist uncle who owned guns.

They were all taken away from him on court order when it was deemed in court that he was a danger to himself and others.

He later committed suicide with a bee-bee gun.
"Perhaps the thing to do is just to let stupid run its course." Aqua
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Mark
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HOLY CARP!!!
The right to keep and bear arms is absolute.

We need to amend the constitution to change that.

Same with speech.

Stop ignoring the law!
___.___
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o 0
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
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