Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to The New Coffee Room. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
For Jon-Nyc
Topic Started: Mar 13 2010, 01:27 PM (270 Views)
Big John
Member Avatar
Senior Carp
Isn't it amazing , once you find yourself being a father, how totally p.o'd this whole clergy thing can make you? When you look at your son and then you think of a full-grown man, representing himself to be a representative of Christ himself, authorized by the Pope, exploiting him, it just makes your blood boil doesn't it?

Being entrusted with the care and protection of children is a huge responsibility. I think it's one of the main reasons we men exist and why we are larger and stronger etc. I am glad I had the experience. So are my kids. It's sad that so many clergypeople take this huge human responsibility and pervert it into an OPPORTUNITY.

Have your views on this matter come into sharper focus since you've become a Dad?






Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Copper
Member Avatar
Shortstop
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 01:27 PM

Have your views on this matter come into sharper focus since you've become a Dad?


Why limit this to Catholic priests?

Do you know of any other groups that might take advantage?

Let's talk about them too.

This is one of the main reasons you exist. Let's get all the sexually perverse.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ivorythumper
Member Avatar
I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
It has nothing to do with fatherhood. I think all clergy who abuse children should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law as well. So should teachers and truck drivers and bankers.

But it is more odious for a priest to do so.
Edited by ivorythumper, Mar 13 2010, 01:38 PM.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
jon-nyc
Member Avatar
Cheers
Yeah, I don't think being a father has changed things. At least no yet. I've always thought that child molesters and those who protect them should be given no quarter, whether they are a parish preist or the holy see.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Big John
Member Avatar
Senior Carp
Copper: The old "hey everyone else does it so why pick on them" excuse is as old as dirt.





Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
It's not an excuse. It is an observation that there are some who like to single out the church as if they have a monopoly on molestation.

No one here has made excuses for clergy in any way.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Copper
Member Avatar
Shortstop
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 01:53 PM
Copper: The old "hey everyone else does it so why pick on them" excuse is as old as dirt.

You got it backward.

I mean let's pick on them all.

Not just the one's you have singled out.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Big John
Member Avatar
Senior Carp
I don't have the time or the energy or the interest to go after every child molester. If you are a parent and you're DUMB ENOUGH in 2010 to put your child in the care of people who are all over the news for being child molesters, then you are dumb.
Edited by Big John, Mar 13 2010, 03:19 PM.





Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quagmire
Member Avatar
Senior Carp
Mikhailoh
Mar 13 2010, 01:55 PM
It's not an excuse. It is an observation that there are some who like to single out the church as if they have a monopoly on molestation.

No one here has made excuses for clergy in any way.
I agree, Mik, that there's other avenue's exploited as well. School teachers, boy scout leaders, etc. However, those are not organizations that presume to be the moral compass of society. So there's the gross hypocrisy element. And also, those organizations do not have a known history of covering up the violations and protecting the perps. So there does seem to be a different element at play with the church than other offenders.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
I agree to some point that a clergyman who molests could be considered some small degree more heinous simply because of their public profession of faith. But all adults who ask to be put put in a position of trust with others' children make an implied representation of good moral character.

All of them molest children. That is the common thread, at which point we have to ask ourselves which is the greater offense, molesting children or breaking one's faith. The answer to that one is obvious.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Quagmire
Member Avatar
Senior Carp
Mikhailoh
Mar 13 2010, 03:38 PM
I agree to some point that a clergyman who molests could be considered some small degree more heinous simply because of their public profession of faith. But all adults who ask to be put put in a position of trust with others' children make an implied representation of good moral character.
Agreed.

Quote:
 
All of them molest children. That is the common thread, at which point we have to ask ourselves which is the greater offense, molesting children or breaking one's faith. The answer to that one is obvious.


I'm not sure I understand how you're modeling this choice here. But my point is the systemic coverup within the church sets it apart from other examples. One can argue that its motivated by not compromising the church rather than protecting criminals, but the bottom line is the church has aided and abetted. You cant say that about the school system or boy scouts.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
I'm sure there are examples of covering up in all those organizations. I'm fairly sure I have read about it in regard to scouting.

It is in the character of groups to see the group mission as more important than the individual.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Copper
Member Avatar
Shortstop
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 03:17 PM
I don't have the time or the energy or the interest to go after every child molester. If you are a parent and you're DUMB ENOUGH in 2010 to put your child in the care of people who are all over the news for being child molesters, then you are dumb.

I agree.

Fortunately your characterization doesn't describe the Catholic Church.

Despite your hateful spewing.

The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
jon-nyc
Member Avatar
Cheers
ivorythumper
Mar 13 2010, 01:37 PM
So should teachers and truck drivers and bankers.
Just a couple of weeks ago a Merrill Lynch broker was caught with a 9 year old.


BofA/ML sent him to the Munich office fired him within the hour.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
Wholly different environment today than in 1980.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Luke's Dad
Member Avatar
Emperor Pengin
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 03:17 PM
I don't have the time or the energy or the interest to go after every child molester. If you are a parent and you're DUMB ENOUGH in 2010 to put your child in the care of people who are all over the news for being child molesters, then you are dumb.
I agree. Keep them away from church, school, scouts, sports, music, drama, grandparents, uncles and aunts, and their own parents.
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Renauda
Member Avatar
HOLY CARP!!!
Copper
Mar 13 2010, 03:49 PM
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 03:17 PM
I don't have the time or the energy or the interest to go after every child molester. If you are a parent and you're DUMB ENOUGH in 2010 to put your child in the care of people who are all over the news for being child molesters, then you are dumb.

I agree.

Fortunately your characterization doesn't describe the Catholic Church.

Despite your hateful spewing.

He may have been exposed to Jansenism as a tot, cut him some slack.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Phlebas
Member Avatar
Bull-Carp
jon-nyc
Mar 13 2010, 05:10 PM
ivorythumper
Mar 13 2010, 01:37 PM
So should teachers and truck drivers and bankers.
Just a couple of weeks ago a Merrill Lynch broker was caught with a 9 year old.


BofA/ML sent him to the Munich office fired him within the hour.
I thought this was the 9 year old he was caught with.
Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML

The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D


Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Luke's Dad
Member Avatar
Emperor Pengin
http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/104376/
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Phlebas
Member Avatar
Bull-Carp
Big John
Mar 13 2010, 01:27 PM
Isn't it amazing , once you find yourself being a father, how totally p.o'd this whole clergy thing can make you? When you look at your son and then you think of a full-grown man, representing himself to be a representative of Christ himself, authorized by the Pope, exploiting him, it just makes your blood boil doesn't it?

Being entrusted with the care and protection of children is a huge responsibility. I think it's one of the main reasons we men exist and why we are larger and stronger etc. I am glad I had the experience. So are my kids. It's sad that so many clergypeople take this huge human responsibility and pervert it into an OPPORTUNITY.

Have your views on this matter come into sharper focus since you've become a Dad?

I didn't realize you had kids.
How old are they? How many do you have? What is your role in their life now?
Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML

The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D


Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
jon-nyc
Member Avatar
Cheers
jon-nyc
Mar 13 2010, 01:45 PM
Yeah, I don't think being a father has changed things. At least not yet.
Thinking more about this, I don't think being a father of an infant has changed things. I can imagine it being a more burning consideration when my son is of the age where he's forming independent relationships with adults that he looks up to and trusts (coach, teacher, whatever).
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Free Forums with no limits on posts or members.
« Previous Topic · The New Coffee Room · Next Topic »
Add Reply