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San Diego Man drives his Prius at 90 MPH with a stuck accelerator; Can a Prius really go 90?
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Topic Started: Mar 8 2010, 05:10 PM (861 Views)
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kenny
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Mar 9 2010, 04:13 PM
Post #26
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Here's an opinion piece suggesting this is all a bunch of media hooey.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-fumento9-2010mar09,0,3126393.story
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Kincaid
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Mar 9 2010, 04:14 PM
Post #27
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I found this enlightening thing on a message board:
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PRIUS OWNER HERE
Sorry to yell, but there's a lot of speculation in this thread, so I would like to post my relative experience.
1. Shifting to neutral at any speed works. I've tested it. You must hold the shift lever in the neutral position for one second while traveling over 7MPH. It is electronic, there is no mechanical linkage to the transmission. (The Prius doesn't even have a transmission, in the traditional sense... it has a Power Split Device [eahart.com])
2. Pressing the "Park" button while traveling at speed will also put the vehicle into neutral.
3. To completely cut off the car while driving you must hold the power button down for three seconds. I have tested this only at low speeds.
4. The Prius has three safety systems that override user controls. These can be alarming if you are unfamiliar.
A) ABS: Antilock Braking System Pulses the brakes when skidding is detected. This can be set off by braking on gravel, or going over a pothole while braking, often alarming inexperienced drivers.
B)Traction Control: Cuts power when tires are "spinning out". If you try to gun the engine from stop on a slick (wet) road this will cut power, this can be alarming if you are trying to cut into a small space in oncoming traffic.
C) Vehicle Stability Control: If the car detects a loss of control such as fishtailing around a corner this system cuts power or applies braking to selective wheels to keep the car pointed in the direction the driver is steering, even if the front tires are not able to do so on thier own. These pictures explain it better. [iihs.org] If you are trying to "drift" in your Prius this would be a problem, but if you are trying to drift in a Prius you probably have bigger problems.
6. On the Prius if you press the brakes and gas at the same time the engine revs, but the car slows down. The brakes don't fight the engine in this situation, instead the power is transferred to the electric generator to charge the battery, not transfered to the drive train. Unfortunately this is NOT the case on non-hybrid Toyota drive-by-wire (and conventional) vehicles. They will allow throttle to be transfered to the drive train while the brakes are engaged, but the Prius doesn't.
5. Somone here asserted the San Diego lexus that killed it's occupants had the recalled matts in the trunk. This is not accurate, it was a loaner car, and the dealer had the incorrect matts installed. Here is the official NTSB Crash Report [safetyresearch.net]
It's my opinion that many of the recent stories are just opportunistic people taking advantage of media hype. This story sounds very fishy. (ie, you don't pull on prius emergency brakes, you push them)
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Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006.
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Improviso
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Mar 9 2010, 04:32 PM
Post #28
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- Kincaid
- Mar 9 2010, 04:07 PM
But strangely, everything works fine later. What... you've never heard of the Prius Blue Screen of Death?
Reboot... everything is fine. Just like MS Windows.
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Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism. We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
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Improviso
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Mar 9 2010, 04:57 PM
Post #29
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- kenny
- Mar 9 2010, 04:13 PM
Here's an opinion piece suggesting this is all a bunch of media hooey. Careful now Kenny. This sudden acceleration thing may turn out to be just like alien abductions.
Nobody believes it until it happens to them.
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Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism. We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
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Big John
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Mar 9 2010, 05:03 PM
Post #30
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it's so hard to have news of the wierd anymore. It's ALL wierd!!!
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Improviso
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Mar 9 2010, 05:06 PM
Post #31
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- Big John
- Mar 9 2010, 05:03 PM
it's so hard to have news of the wierd anymore. It's ALL wierd!!! A friends FB status says:
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[So and so] wonders why in the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird. Now the world is weird and people take Prozac to make it normal.
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Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism. We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
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Luke's Dad
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Mar 9 2010, 06:02 PM
Post #32
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- Improviso
- Mar 9 2010, 05:06 PM
- Big John
- Mar 9 2010, 05:03 PM
it's so hard to have news of the wierd anymore. It's ALL wierd!!!
A friends FB status says: - Quote:
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[So and so] wonders why in the 60's, people took acid to make the world weird. Now the world is weird and people take Prozac to make it normal.
I am so stealing that.
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The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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1hp
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Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
Post #33
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but the newer Toyotas do not have a direct mechanical connection from the gear shift to the transmission, that it's a CPU, and that whatever is frying these accelerators is also frying the CPU for the transmission.
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well.
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There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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Riley
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Mar 9 2010, 08:21 PM
Post #34
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- kenny
- Mar 9 2010, 08:17 AM
Look on the bright side.
He got better MPG than all the other runaway Toyotas around him doing 90.
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Luke's Dad
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Mar 10 2010, 06:27 AM
Post #35
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- 1hp
- Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
- Quote:
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but the newer Toyotas do not have a direct mechanical connection from the gear shift to the transmission, that it's a CPU, and that whatever is frying these accelerators is also frying the CPU for the transmission.
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well. Therein lies the problem. No, most people don't realize it. I'm not a luddite that's going to rail against it, as mechanical linkages fail too and maybe even less reliable as they would require more maintenance and care. However, when you do start having issues with one area, it has to raise issues with the entire system, as overall the components for the various systems are sourced from the same companies and often from the same batches.
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The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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Quagmire
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Mar 10 2010, 06:32 AM
Post #36
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- 1hp
- Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well.
Not arguing, just curious. I have a 2003 Acura standard transmission. There is clearly a mechanical linkage from my gear shift lever. I can feel it grind in my hand if I mistime the shift. I cant imagine a 2003 Acura would be 'old school'.
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Big John
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Mar 10 2010, 06:43 AM
Post #37
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I predict a rash of "boy bands" being formed called "Runaway Prius."
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George K
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Mar 10 2010, 06:44 AM
Post #38
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Clicky (and turn your speakers down*)
*it's not a Rick Roll - that's so last decade
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A guide to GKSR: Click
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.
I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles. - Klaus, 4/29/18
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Improviso
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Mar 10 2010, 10:23 AM
Post #39
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- George K
- Mar 10 2010, 06:44 AM
Clicky (and turn your speakers down*) *it's not a Rick Roll - that's so last decade Excellent.
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Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism. We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
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ivorythumper
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Mar 10 2010, 10:31 AM
Post #40
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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- Quagmire
- Mar 10 2010, 06:32 AM
- 1hp
- Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well.
Not arguing, just curious. I have a 2003 Acura standard transmission. There is clearly a mechanical linkage from my gear shift lever. I can feel it grind in my hand if I mistime the shift. I cant imagine a 2003 Acura would be 'old school'. They put a dynamic shake module and a small speaker in that model to give you a feeling that you really are grinding the gears.
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The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Piano*Dad
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Mar 10 2010, 11:29 AM
Post #41
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- ivorythumper
- Mar 10 2010, 10:31 AM
- Quagmire
- Mar 10 2010, 06:32 AM
- 1hp
- Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well.
Not arguing, just curious. I have a 2003 Acura standard transmission. There is clearly a mechanical linkage from my gear shift lever. I can feel it grind in my hand if I mistime the shift. I cant imagine a 2003 Acura would be 'old school'.
They put a dynamic shake module and a small speaker in that model to give you a feeling that you really are grinding the gears.
. . .
You are kidding, right?
. . . .
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Piano*Dad
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Mar 10 2010, 11:31 AM
Post #42
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- Luke's Dad
- Mar 10 2010, 06:27 AM
- 1hp
- Mar 9 2010, 08:08 PM
- Quote:
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but the newer Toyotas do not have a direct mechanical connection from the gear shift to the transmission, that it's a CPU, and that whatever is frying these accelerators is also frying the CPU for the transmission.
Do people not realise that most modern cars are "fly by wire" with no mechanical linkage from the gas peddle or transmission? (Not sure is brake pedal still has a mechanical linkage). No doubt the steering wheel will soon be disconnected as well.
Therein lies the problem. No, most people don't realize it. I'm not a luddite that's going to rail against it, as mechanical linkages fail too and maybe even less reliable as they would require more maintenance and care. However, when you do start having issues with one area, it has to raise issues with the entire system, as overall the components for the various systems are sourced from the same companies and often from the same batches. Well, I'm not a luddite either. And I'm not a complete techno-idiot. But I too am way behind on understanding the evolution of these systems. I'm sort of lost back there in the fuel injection days when the carburetor was replaced.
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George K
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Mar 13 2010, 06:01 AM
Post #43
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Hoax
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Virtually every aspect of Sikes's story as told to reporters makes no sense. His claim that he'd tried to yank up the accelerator could be falsified, with his help, in half a minute. And now we even have an explanation for why he'd pull such a stunt, beyond the all-American desire to have 15 minutes of fame (recall the "Balloon Boy Hoax" from October) and the aching need to be perceived as a victim.
The lack of skepticism from the beginning was stunning. I combed through haystacks of articles without producing such needles as the words "alleges" or "claims." When Sikes said he brought his car to a Toyota ( TM - news - people ) dealer two weeks earlier, recall notice in hand, and they just turned him away, the media bought that, too. In Sikes We Trust. Then the pundits deluged us with a tsunami of an anti-Toyota sanctimony .
Where to begin?
Well, the patrol car didn't slow down the Prius; the bumpers never touched. The officers used a loudspeaker to tell Sikes to use the brakes and emergency brake together. He did; the car slowed to about 55 mph. Sikes turned off the engine and coasted to a halt. He stopped the car on his own.
There wasn't anything wrong with the transmission or the Prius engine button either.
Over a 23-minute period the 911 dispatcher repeatedly pleaded with Sikes to shift into neutral. He simply refused and then essentially stopped talking to her except to say that he thought he could smell his brakes burning.
"I thought about" shifting into neutral, Sikes said at a televised press conference the day after the incident. But "I had never played with this kind of a transmission, especially when you're driving and I was actually afraid to do that." Sikes, who has driven the car for two years, also said "I figured if I knocked it over [the gear knob] the car might flip." ...
Then there are the brakes.
Sikes said his brakes had just been checked out a few weeks earlier, but during the incident he "was laying on the brakes. It was not slowing down."
Others have made similar claims, so Car & Driver magazine recently put them to the test. They found a V-6 Camry at full throttle could be stopped at 435 feet. But to really test the claim, they used a powerful 540-horsepower supercharged Roush Stage 3 Mustang. It took 903 feet, but stop it did. By comparison the Prius can only muster 110 anemic ponies. Further, as Newton's Second Law reminds us, weight is inherently a factor in slowing a moving object. The Prius weighs about two-thirds of what the Roush does.
But while these other cars were brought to full stop, Sikes says he couldn't even reduce his speed. A video on the Web also demonstrates a 2008 Prius easily slowed to a stop with the accelerator fully depressed.
...
Now here's the potential smoking gun: Sikes told the reporters that "I was reaching down and trying to pull up on the gas pedal. It didn't move at all; it was stationary." That's awfully daring for somebody who insisted he didn't even want to take a hand off his steering wheel, notwithstanding that he did so to hold his phone.
I tried to imitate Sikes' alleged effort in a 2008 Prius. From the front bottom of the steering wheel to the front bottom of the accelerator in up position it's 28.5 inches; while fully deployed it's 2.5 inches farther away. I have average-length arms (33-inch shirt sleeve) and no gut. But even though the steering wheel was as flush to the dashboard as it goes, it prevented me from all but touching the accelerator in the up position.
To reach behind a deployed accelerator and get any kind of a grip you'd have to add at least three more inches. In my case, it required squashing my face against the radio and completely removing my eyes from the road. Only the tallest men could physically do what Sikes claimed he did and no press accounts refer his being exceptionally tall. But to settle this issue (albeit not the others), Sikes would simply have to sit in his Prius and show he could reach behind the pedal while it was fully depressed. Why has nobody asked him to do so? Moreover, even for an orangutan it would be an incredibly awkward move for somebody afraid to pop a car into neutral or hit the ignition button.
So why did he do it? Sleuth work at the Web sites Jalopnik.com and Gawker.com reveals that Sikes and his wife Patty in 2008 filed for bankruptcy and are over $700,000 in debt. Among their creditors is Toyota Financial Services for a lease on a 2008 Toyota Prius, with value at time of bankruptcy of $20,494. The Jalopnik Web site shows a copy of Toyota's secured claims form, though when Jalopnik questioned Sikes by e-mail he denied being behind on his Prius payments.
Sikes also has a history of filing insurance claims for allegedly stolen items that are slowly coming to light. In 2001 he filed a police report with the Merced County Sheriff's Department for $58,000 in stolen property, including jewelry, a prosumer mini-DV camera and gear, and $24,000 in cash, according to Fox40 in Sacramento. His bankruptcy documents show a 2008 payment of $7,400 for an allegedly stolen saxophone and clothes.
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A guide to GKSR: Click
"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... " - Mik, 6/14/08
Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.
I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles. - Klaus, 4/29/18
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Big John
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Mar 13 2010, 06:41 AM
Post #44
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interesting. . .
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Kincaid
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Mar 13 2010, 07:31 PM
Post #45
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and illuminating.
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Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006.
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Copper
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Mar 13 2010, 07:47 PM
Post #46
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msm is foul
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The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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John D'Oh
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Mar 14 2010, 06:30 AM
Post #47
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Never trust a Toyota driving saxophone player.
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What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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1hp
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Mar 14 2010, 03:59 PM
Post #48
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Well, I'm not a luddite either. And I'm not a complete techno-idiot. But I too am way behind on understanding the evolution of these systems.
It's pretty simple really. 30 years ago, when you typed on your keyboard, there was a mechanical linkage to a hammer, which impacted the paper and left a letter of the alphabet. These days, when you type on your keyboard.........................................
Or, I could use an old mechanical calculator as an example......................................
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There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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1hp
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Mar 14 2010, 04:03 PM
Post #49
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I have a 2003 Acura standard transmission. There is clearly a mechanical linkage from my gear shift lever. I can feel it grind in my hand if I mistime the shift. I cant imagine a 2003 Acura would be 'old school'.
Yeah.....I was referring to automatic transmissions - I should have clarified that.
[edit: looks like you bought the right choice. A search on 2003 Acura transmission brings up tons of complaints on defective automatic transmissions failing, and a lawsuit with Honda]
Edited by 1hp, Mar 14 2010, 04:06 PM.
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There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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