Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Welcome to The New Coffee Room. We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
President Surrenders the Moon to China & Russia
Topic Started: Feb 1 2010, 10:35 AM (406 Views)
Copper
Member Avatar
Shortstop

http://www.cnn.com/2010/TECH/space/02/01/nasa.budget.moon/

Quote:
 

Obama budget would cut moon exploration program

By John D. Sutter, CNN
February 1, 2010 1:26 p.m. EST

(CNN) -- American astronauts will not return to the moon as planned if Congress passes President Obama's proposed budget.

Obama's budget -- which aims to tighten the nation's purse strings in certain areas while increasing money used to create jobs -- would cancel NASA's Constellation Program, which had sought to send astronauts back to the moon by 2020.

Constellation also intended to study the idea of establishing a moon colony. The program was set to follow the U.S. space agency's shuttle missions, which are due to end in September.

On its Web site, the White House Budget Office says the program to send astronauts to the moon is behind schedule, over budget and overall less important than other space investments.

"Using a broad range of criteria, an independent review panel determined that even if fully funded, NASA's program to repeat many of the achievements of the Apollo era, 50 years later, was the least attractive approach to space exploration as compared to potential alternatives," the site says.

"Furthermore, NASA's attempts to pursue its moon goals, while inadequate to that task, had drawn funding away from other NASA programs, including robotic space exploration, science, and Earth observations."

Overall, Obama's proposed budget increases the National Aeronautics and Space Administration's budget by $6 billion over the next five years. The president's budget would give NASA a $19 billion budget in 2011, compared to its $18.3 billion budget this year.

Congress has to approve the federal budget, and a final ruling may not happen for months.

The budget changes will not prevent NASA from returning astronauts to the moon and exploring the rest of the solar system, NASA Administrator Charlie Bolden said in a conference call with reporters on Monday.

"Imagine trips to Mars that take weeks instead of nearly a year; people fanning out across the inner solar system, exploring the Moon, asteroids and Mars nearly simultaneously in a steady stream of firsts ... That is what the president's plan for NASA will enable, once we develop the new capabilities to make it a reality," Bolden said.

The NASA administrator emphasized the fact that the president's budget would increase NASA funding overall and said the Constellation program was behind schedule and over-budget anyway.

"The truth is we were not on a sustainable path to get back to the moon's surface, and as we focused most of our efforts and funding on getting back to the moon we were neglecting investment in key technologies to get us beyond," he said.

Sen. Bill Nelson, a Democrat from Florida, criticized the president for slashing NASA's moon-mission program from his suggested budget.

The move could cause the U.S. to fall behind other countries in space exploration, he said.

"If they don't push hard now for research and development of the new big rocket that'll take us out of low-Earth orbit and let us explore the heavens, then we are going to be falling behind China and Russia, and that's something I don't think will sit well with the American people," he said in an interview with CNN.

Louis Friedman, executive director of The Planetary Society, called that assertion "ridiculous," and said he's hopeful the end of Constellation would lead to the U.S. returning to the moon more quickly.

Friedman believes that Constellation is a flawed and bloated program, which should be replaced with a new program that would get the U.S. back to the moon more efficiently.

Constellation was behind schedule, and a new program offers a fresh start and puts needed emphasis on space exploration beyond the moon, he said.

"I think the Constellation program probably fell on its own weight as opposed to any major policy change," he said.

Others questioned what will happen to the money NASA has already spent on its program to return to the moon.

"I think that some of the things they're working on could be used regardless of what the program is," said John Pike, director of GlobalSecurity.org and a space policy expert. "Some of it however, I think is just going to end up on the cutting room floor."

About $250 million in federal stimulus money has paid for investments in the Constellation Program, according to a CNN report. NASA's current budget gives Constellation $3.47 billion in funding, according to the White House Budget Office.

NASA says the Constellation research and technology would be useful in other space endeavors.

NASA first sent astronauts to the moon in 1969, and the space agency's Apollo program sent astronauts to the moon at total of six times.


The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
QuirtEvans
Member Avatar
I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Well, at least we know the part of the budget Copper wouldn't cut.

I'm sure he'll be happy to see an increase in his taxes to fund this program.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
That ****ing sucks. :(
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
QuirtEvans
Feb 1 2010, 10:36 AM
Well, at least we know the part of the budget Copper wouldn't cut.

I'm sure he'll be happy to see an increase in his taxes to fund this program.
Actually, yes, I think the space program is a freaking fantastic long term fix for the economy.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
QuirtEvans
Member Avatar
I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Aqua Letifer
Feb 1 2010, 10:37 AM
QuirtEvans
Feb 1 2010, 10:36 AM
Well, at least we know the part of the budget Copper wouldn't cut.

I'm sure he'll be happy to see an increase in his taxes to fund this program.
Actually, yes, I think the space program is a freaking fantastic long term fix for the economy.
Me too, but some people don't believe in government R&D. Let the private sector do it, they say.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
I disagree. As much as I support the exploration of space, I'd like to see it done smartly, efficiently. I'm not at all sure what good a moon colony would do us. I suppose it would teach us how to set a colony up, but we are a long wayfrom the travel technology to allow us to do so anywhere else of any value.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
Mikhailoh
Feb 1 2010, 10:39 AM
I disagree. As much as I support the exploration of space, I'd like to see it done smartly, efficiently. I'm not at all sure what good a moon colony would do us. I suppose it would teach us how to set a colony up, but we are a long wayfrom the travel technology to allow us to do so anywhere else of any value.
I'm certain that at least nine out of ten daily household items we all use that came from the space race were things nobody thought we'd get from the space race. Especially the folks who said "I'm not sure what good going to the moon would do us."

And about that technology... if we wanted to land humans on Mars, right now, starting A.S.A.P., we could do it. No problem. We just don't want to spend the money, it has nothing to do with our technological limitations. We even have our pick of different methods to get us there.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
QuirtEvans
Feb 1 2010, 10:38 AM
Me too, but some people don't believe in government R&D. Let the private sector do it, they say.
If they actually did, that wouldn't be a problem.

The problem is that the truly fantastic innovations came out of the space race by accident, from an "anything goes" kind of R&D mentality. The private sector's too "goals up front" oriented for that sort of thing.

Private R&D is just fine but I think as far as space is concerned, the gummint has the potential to do it better.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Copper
Member Avatar
Shortstop
Mikhailoh
Feb 1 2010, 10:39 AM
I disagree. As much as I support the exploration of space, I'd like to see it done smartly, efficiently. I'm not at all sure what good a moon colony would do us. I suppose it would teach us how to set a colony up, but we are a long wayfrom the travel technology to allow us to do so anywhere else of any value.

Sure that's just as true today as it was 50 years ago.

But since we took the leap 50 years ago we have reaped the benefits politically and economically many times over since then.

Give me a tax increase and make it a big one.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
Aqua Letifer
Feb 1 2010, 10:44 AM
Mikhailoh
Feb 1 2010, 10:39 AM
I disagree. As much as I support the exploration of space, I'd like to see it done smartly, efficiently. I'm not at all sure what good a moon colony would do us. I suppose it would teach us how to set a colony up, but we are a long wayfrom the travel technology to allow us to do so anywhere else of any value.
I'm certain that at least nine out of ten daily household items we all use that came from the space race were things nobody thought we'd get from the space race. Especially the folks who said "I'm not sure what good going to the moon would do us."

And about that technology... if we wanted to land humans on Mars, right now, starting A.S.A.P., we could do it. No problem. We just don't want to spend the money, it has nothing to do with our technological limitations. We even have our pick of different methods to get us there.
There is also no particular reason to go to Mars, other than we can. I'd prefer they try a moon colony to a Mars one.

Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ivorythumper
Member Avatar
I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Aqua Letifer
Feb 1 2010, 10:44 AM
Mikhailoh
Feb 1 2010, 10:39 AM
I disagree. As much as I support the exploration of space, I'd like to see it done smartly, efficiently. I'm not at all sure what good a moon colony would do us. I suppose it would teach us how to set a colony up, but we are a long wayfrom the travel technology to allow us to do so anywhere else of any value.
I'm certain that at least nine out of ten daily household items we all use that came from the space race were things nobody thought we'd get from the space race. Especially the folks who said "I'm not sure what good going to the moon would do us."

And about that technology... if we wanted to land humans on Mars, right now, starting A.S.A.P., we could do it. No problem. We just don't want to spend the money, it has nothing to do with our technological limitations. We even have our pick of different methods to get us there.
I don't see that argument as persuasive for future investment. We have basically mastered that technology, and presumably the major breakthroughs have been accomplished. Sure we can continue to tweak things -- I'd like better tasting Tang and Space Food Sticks -- but I think the law of diminishing returns needs to be considered if you are arguing on the basis of return on investment.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Luke's Dad
Member Avatar
Emperor Pengin
I don't believe we actually could develop better technology to allow us to travel without a permanent facility on the moon.
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
Mikhailoh
Feb 1 2010, 10:48 AM
There is also no particular reason to go to Mars, other than we can.
Cold War motivations aside, that was our public relations reason for going to the moon.

And directly due to that endeavor we now have aero bike wheels, cheap but effective fire fighter equipment, cordless power tools, ear thermometers, enriched baby food, failsafe flaghlights, invisible braces, medical imagers, satellite dishes, scratch-resistant glasses, smoke detectors and a hundred other things. You wanna talk about American innovation, we cannot in our wildest dreams imagine the advancements (and money) we can make from going to Mars.

C'mon man, imagine some. ^_^
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
ivorythumper
Feb 1 2010, 10:49 AM
I don't see that argument as persuasive for future investment. We have basically mastered that technology, and presumably the major breakthroughs have been accomplished. Sure we can continue to tweak things -- I'd like better tasting Tang and Space Food Sticks -- but I think the law of diminishing returns needs to be considered if you are arguing on the basis of return on investment.
Wholly different ballgame, going to Mars.

Mark my words, we go visit the Red Planet in person and we're going to be the world leader in biotech and agroscience before the astronauts make it home.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ivorythumper
Member Avatar
I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
aren't we already? :shrug:

just askin'
The dogma lives loudly within me.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Aqua Letifer
Member Avatar
ZOOOOOM!
ivorythumper
Feb 1 2010, 11:02 AM
aren't we already? :shrug:

just askin'
Eh, depends on certain areas. I wouldn't say we sweep the board. (This is 2004 knowledge I'm going off, who knows, things might have really changed since then.) Never hurts to get more ahead though, eh?

Seriously, those two fields are where I really think a Mars mission would have a lot to offer us, on top of everything else.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Improviso
Member Avatar
HOLY CARP!!!
Copper
Feb 1 2010, 10:44 AM
Give me a tax increase and make it a big one.
I'm not agreeing to a tax increase unless I get a Landspeeder out of the deal. :whome:

Posted Image
Identifying narcissists isn't difficult. Just look for the person who is constantly fishing for compliments
and admiration while breaking down over even the slightest bit of criticism.

We have the freedom to choose our actions, but we do not get to choose our consequences.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Frank_W
Member Avatar
Resident Misanthrope
We have a surplus of astronauts at Guantanamo Bay. "Should your mission be successful, you will be set free..." :devilgrin:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mark
Member Avatar
HOLY CARP!!!
If we were not out there playing TEAM AMERICA FVCK YEAH! in almost every country on the planet

Maybe we could afford to do the things that really make this or any country great.

Like exploration.
___.___
(_]===*
o 0
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ivorythumper
Member Avatar
I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
TAFY!!!! :lol2:
The dogma lives loudly within me.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Mikhailoh
Member Avatar
If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
TA FTW.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
Online Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Luke's Dad
Member Avatar
Emperor Pengin
Coming again, to save the mother f*&$ing day yeah,

The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Free Forums. Reliable service with over 8 years of experience.
« Previous Topic · The New Coffee Room · Next Topic »
Add Reply