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Elections Have Consequences
Topic Started: Apr 24 2009, 04:09 PM (333 Views)
Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124061268797954397.html
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
All in all a decent piece, although I don't personally think the public option will crowd out the private ones.

I find it funny that he thinks a single-payer system would introduce rationing. Maybe if you've spent most of your life on the Senate's healthcare plan you could end up believing there's no rationing in the system today.


Also, his two concerns seem to be somewhat at odds - if the public option were to have really heavy-handed rationing, many people (indeed all those who could) would stay with their private plan, no?
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Jeff
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jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
I don't personally think the public option will crowd out the private ones.
Why not? It will be set up that way.
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Jeff
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jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
if the public option were to have really heavy-handed rationing, many people (indeed all those who could) would stay with their private plan, no?
Assuming the private ones will be allowed to function. You trust Pelosi and Frank and Reid to allow this?
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Pianolicious
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Of course the option here is to do what I did: get healthy. Give up sugar, smoking, excess fat, caffeine and alcohol, work out, be active, get plenty of rest, get outside, pray/meditate and do thorough research on any prescription the doctor writes before taking it. Nearly three years after all that, my food costs are a fraction of what they once were, I don't take ANY prescriptions, and I don't even know where my aspirin bottle is.

Hopefully that kind of thinking will begin to take hold. I feel younger and stronger now than I've ever felt in my whole life.
Sit tibi vita longa et omnia bona!!! -- Dr. Spock
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
Quote:
 
Hopefully that kind of thinking will begin to take hold. I feel younger and stronger now than I've ever felt in my whole life.


And you're still gonna die...
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
And get sick in the process, likely as not.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Jeff
Apr 25 2009, 05:32 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
if the public option were to have really heavy-handed rationing, many people (indeed all those who could) would stay with their private plan, no?
Assuming the private ones will be allowed to function. You trust Pelosi and Frank and Reid to allow this?
Not if they had their way, but they don't. IMO (sorry, IT, i've no proof of this either) Obama and his advisors have internalized the lessons of 1993.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Jeff
Apr 25 2009, 05:31 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
I don't personally think the public option will crowd out the private ones.
Why not? It will be set up that way.
I suspect it will be inferior to many of the private plans out there, and the private plans will of course change to differentiate their services.

It could end up taking in much of the working class over time. But I think we'll remain with a mixed system, like the UK but with more of it in the private sector.

THat solution, by the way, is perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Jeff
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I admit I need to learn more about how UK private insurance works.

I am not ok with Pelosi et al determining how medical care gets delivered in this country.
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
All in all a decent piece, although I don't personally think the public option will crowd out the private ones.

The only way the public option could work would be by crowding out the private. Economy of scale, and all that.

I've often endorsed emergency and major illness insurance only, with medical saving plans for casual twice a year checkups, colds, flus, etc..
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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Copper
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Shortstop
Luke's Dad
Apr 25 2009, 06:58 AM

The only way the public option could work would be by crowding out the private. Economy of scale, and all that.


Exactly.

The economy of scale will diminish for private plans.

And this will lead to an even wider divide between the haves and have-nots as the cost of private plans increases.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 05:59 AM
Jeff
Apr 25 2009, 05:31 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 04:37 AM
I don't personally think the public option will crowd out the private ones.
Why not? It will be set up that way.
I suspect it will be inferior to many of the private plans out there, and the private plans will of course change to differentiate their services.

It could end up taking in much of the working class over time. But I think we'll remain with a mixed system, like the UK but with more of it in the private sector.

THat solution, by the way, is perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned.
I agree.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
I presume both Jon and Quirt are planning to pay for private medical care?

Let them eat cake!
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
I'll probably do a little of each, IT, over the course of my life.

In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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1hp
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Fulla-Carp

Quote:
 
It could end up taking in much of the working class over time. But I think we'll remain with a mixed system, like the UK but with more of it in the private sector.

THat solution, by the way, is perfectly fine as far as I'm concerned.


Perhaps that's because you don't actually live in the UK. I've been told nightmare stories from people living in the UK.
There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
You can find nightmare stories here, too.


The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Copper
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Shortstop
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 10:42 AM
You can find nightmare stories here, too.


The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.

There is the problem in a nutshell.

I know this solution will be good for others.

But of course not for me.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Copper
Apr 25 2009, 10:47 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 10:42 AM
You can find nightmare stories here, too.


The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.

There is the problem in a nutshell.

I know this solution will be good for others.

But of course not for me.
I'm altruistic enough not to prefer the system that's best for me.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Copper
Apr 25 2009, 10:47 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 10:42 AM
You can find nightmare stories here, too.


The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.

There is the problem in a nutshell.

I know this solution will be good for others.

But of course not for me.
What a strange thing to say. We have tens of millions of people with very limited access to healthcare. I'm a proponent of a solution for them that doesn't change things for those who are happy with what they have.





In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Copper
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Shortstop
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 11:32 AM

a solution for them that doesn't change things for those who are happy with what they have.

Making everyone happy is a good idea.

In fact, ideas like that get people elected.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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1hp
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Fulla-Carp

Quote:
 
The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.


And therein lies the problem - all the rhetoric and money, and that's still all they'll have - "limited access to healthcare services".
There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 10:34 AM
I'll probably do a little of each, IT, over the course of my life.

So might I, Jon, freecare for anything that I wasn't really concerned about but private for anything of consequence. (Although, have you ever visited a free clinic? They can be scary. It might be worthwhile just to leave all that to the proles.)
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 11:32 AM
Copper
Apr 25 2009, 10:47 AM
jon-nyc
Apr 25 2009, 10:42 AM
You can find nightmare stories here, too.


The NHS, for all its faults, would be a huge uptick for the tens of millions of americans who have limited access to healthcare services.

There is the problem in a nutshell.

I know this solution will be good for others.

But of course not for me.
What a strange thing to say. We have tens of millions of people with very limited access to healthcare. I'm a proponent of a solution for them that doesn't change things for those who are happy with what they have.





And yet....an emerging trend in healthcare is telling Uncle Sam to go away. The government payment for many services does not equal the cost of providing the service, therefore it is foolish for a business to to provide those services.

And Medicine is a business, is it not?
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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