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A Politician Larry Can Love
Topic Started: Mar 27 2009, 10:46 AM (836 Views)
QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Calling for "revolution" in America. Less than five months after a landslide election, barely more than two months after Inauguration Day.

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/03/bachmann-blasts-obamas-economic-marxism-calls-for-revolution-to-save-freedom.php

I guess she didn't get the memo about how democracy works ... you actually have to get more votes than the other guy.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Red Rice
HOLY CARP!!!
QuirtEvans
Mar 27 2009, 10:46 AM
I guess she didn't get the memo about how democracy works ... you actually have to get more votes than the other guy.
Please, not another Electoral College debate. :hide:
Civilisation, I vaguely realized then - and subsequent observation has confirmed the view - could not progress that way. It must have a greater guiding principle to survive. To treat it as a carcase off which each man tears as much as he can for himself, is to stand convicted a brute, fit for nothing better than a jungle existence, which is a death-struggle, leading nowhither. I did not believe that was the human destiny, for Man individually was sane and reasonable, only collectively a fool.

I hope the gunner of that Hun two-seater shot him clean, bullet to heart, and that his plane, on fire, fell like a meteor through the sky he loved. Since he had to end, I hope he ended so. But, oh, the waste! The loss!

- Cecil Lewis
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
The woman is right. The damage that's being done as we speak is going to alter this country in ways that can never be corrected later. And we as a nation are still playing politics. Just because Obama got the most votes doesn't mean that he's right, it doesn't mean we have to just sit back and let him ruin the country. But to correct the problem we've got to stop being cheerleaders for a political party and start putting our country first. We have a right to protect this country from enemies "foreign and domestic". Obama is a domestic enemy - a threat to the country. If it takes a revolution to fix the problem, so be it.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Red Rice
HOLY CARP!!!
Then it's up to the Republicans (and some moderate Democrats) to make their case to the public and propose alternatives, rather than agitating for revolution. I take would-be revolutionaries even less seriously than I take the "impeach Bush" crowd.
Civilisation, I vaguely realized then - and subsequent observation has confirmed the view - could not progress that way. It must have a greater guiding principle to survive. To treat it as a carcase off which each man tears as much as he can for himself, is to stand convicted a brute, fit for nothing better than a jungle existence, which is a death-struggle, leading nowhither. I did not believe that was the human destiny, for Man individually was sane and reasonable, only collectively a fool.

I hope the gunner of that Hun two-seater shot him clean, bullet to heart, and that his plane, on fire, fell like a meteor through the sky he loved. Since he had to end, I hope he ended so. But, oh, the waste! The loss!

- Cecil Lewis
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
[Response to Larry, because I agree with Red Rice]

At the end of the day, it's a democracy. We are a nation of laws, and of rules.

You and others felt this way before the election, and you screamed it at the top of your lungs. The majority felt otherwise, and elected Obama, despite your concerns. It's awfully hard to square your views about "domestic enemies" with a democracy ... I could just as easily have said that I felt Dick Cheney was a domestic enemy. At some point, the one who wins a validly-held election can't be treated as a domestic enemy.

Either we respect our system of government, or we don't. If we don't, I wonder if anyone will like the next form better.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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George K
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Finally
QuirtEvans
Mar 27 2009, 11:23 AM
I could just as easily have said that I felt Dick Cheney was a domestic enemy.
And of course, you didn't. He was the Prince of Fcuking Darkness. A huge difference.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
How does one go about having an 'orderly' revolution anyway? No shouting? No shooting? No disorderly behaviour? That's not a freaking revolution, you daft cow, that's a day trip.

As Mrs. D'Oh once said to me, 'not much of an uprising, was it?'

I'm kind of hoping she was talking about the home-baked bread.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Red Rice
HOLY CARP!!!
John D'Oh
Mar 27 2009, 11:30 AM
As Mrs. D'Oh once said to me, 'not much of an uprising, was it?'

I'm kind of hoping she was talking about the home-baked bread.
:lol2:
Civilisation, I vaguely realized then - and subsequent observation has confirmed the view - could not progress that way. It must have a greater guiding principle to survive. To treat it as a carcase off which each man tears as much as he can for himself, is to stand convicted a brute, fit for nothing better than a jungle existence, which is a death-struggle, leading nowhither. I did not believe that was the human destiny, for Man individually was sane and reasonable, only collectively a fool.

I hope the gunner of that Hun two-seater shot him clean, bullet to heart, and that his plane, on fire, fell like a meteor through the sky he loved. Since he had to end, I hope he ended so. But, oh, the waste! The loss!

- Cecil Lewis
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Red Rice
HOLY CARP!!!
John D'Oh
Mar 27 2009, 11:30 AM
No shouting? No shooting? No disorderly behaviour? That's not a freaking revolution, you daft cow, that's a day trip.

A day trip without children, that is.
Civilisation, I vaguely realized then - and subsequent observation has confirmed the view - could not progress that way. It must have a greater guiding principle to survive. To treat it as a carcase off which each man tears as much as he can for himself, is to stand convicted a brute, fit for nothing better than a jungle existence, which is a death-struggle, leading nowhither. I did not believe that was the human destiny, for Man individually was sane and reasonable, only collectively a fool.

I hope the gunner of that Hun two-seater shot him clean, bullet to heart, and that his plane, on fire, fell like a meteor through the sky he loved. Since he had to end, I hope he ended so. But, oh, the waste! The loss!

- Cecil Lewis
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
You're missing the point.

If our founding fathers could come back and see what's going on, they'd be leading the revolution. Obama didn't get the most votes because we're a nation of deep thinkers who weighed things out on an intellectual level and decided they wanted to go where Obama is taking us - he got elected because we have become a nation filled with idiots. He got elected because the balance has tipped from the productive to the takers, filled with morons who think it's all just another reality TV show.

Our nation is sliding off the cliff. I don't give a damn about party politics. Neither party is worth sh!t. A lot of those laws you cherish so much shouldn't be on the books, and it's time we stop holding the "rule of law" above the good of the nation.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
The good of the nation must come first. As things unfold, if indeed, it looks like a revolution is what is for the best, I will be on the front line.

I do think there is another civil war, or something else really big, that's on the way. I can't shake this feeling of foreboding that I've had....
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
Finally! It's about damn time! Let me go get changed, and I'll be ready to go!

And to think M&M's thought I was crazy for buying all of this stuff!


Ok, I'm ready!

Posted Image

Damn, these tights are riding up!

The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
George K
Mar 27 2009, 11:30 AM
QuirtEvans
Mar 27 2009, 11:23 AM
I could just as easily have said that I felt Dick Cheney was a domestic enemy.
And of course, you didn't. He was the Prince of Fcuking Darkness. A huge difference.
There is a difference in that I wasn't advocating revolution.

Evil, but entitled to his office.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Larry
Mar 27 2009, 11:36 AM
You're missing the point.

If our founding fathers could come back and see what's going on, they'd be leading the revolution. Obama didn't get the most votes because we're a nation of deep thinkers who weighed things out on an intellectual level and decided they wanted to go where Obama is taking us - he got elected because we have become a nation filled with idiots. He got elected because the balance has tipped from the productive to the takers, filled with morons who think it's all just another reality TV show.

Our nation is sliding off the cliff. I don't give a damn about party politics. Neither party is worth sh!t. A lot of those laws you cherish so much shouldn't be on the books, and it's time we stop holding the "rule of law" above the good of the nation.

They believed in principles, Larry, and the first and foremost principle was democracy. The majority of the governed get to decide who is permitted to govern.

Whether they would like, or dislike, the current state of affairs is wholly beside the point. I feel quite confident that they would say, this is the result of the system we developed, if you respect the system you have to respect the result.

I'm not sure how it's possible to love or respect your country if you don't respect its basic principles. And there is no principle more fundamental to our country than democracy.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
Luke's Dad
Mar 27 2009, 12:32 PM
Finally! It's about damn time! Let me go get changed, and I'll be ready to go!

And to think M&M's thought I was crazy for buying all of this stuff!


Ok, I'm ready!

Posted Image

Damn, these tights are riding up!

Nice "toe"

:lol2: :lol2:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Quote:
 
Whether they would like, or dislike, the current state of affairs is wholly beside the point.


No offense intended, but it's only beside the point if your purpose is to debate for the purpose of debating. If your concern is the current state of affairs, it is entirely the point. Our founding fathers would be appalled at what we have done to the country they fought so hard to establish.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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kluurs
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Fulla-Carp
This country will always be a mess...and that is part of our strength. You can't get four people to agree on the same toppings for a pizza let alone get 350 million to agree on just about anything. We're forever doomed to move this big boat forward with different hands at the wheel steering in a zig zag way towards an ever changing destination. No reason to assume it will ever be different.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Larry
Mar 27 2009, 12:46 PM
Quote:
 
Whether they would like, or dislike, the current state of affairs is wholly beside the point.


No offense intended, but it's only beside the point if your purpose is to debate for the purpose of debating. If your concern is the current state of affairs, it is entirely the point. Our founding fathers would be appalled at what we have done to the country they fought so hard to establish.

You missed the sentence that followed that one, apparently. Here, let's put them together again.

Quote:
 
Whether they would like, or dislike, the current state of affairs is wholly beside the point. I feel quite confident that they would say, this is the result of the system we developed, if you respect the system you have to respect the result.


The reason it's beside the point is because they would have respected the outcome of a democratic process, and would not have been agitating for revolution.

Again, I'm not sure how it's possible to love or respect your country if you don't respect the basic principle of democracy.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Well kluurs, there was a time when even the lawyers understood that a contract is a contract, not a "living document". Now we live in a time when lawyers and politicians try to tell us the Constitution - a social contract between the government and the governed, is not a contract any more, but is a "living document" to be reinterpreted as they see fit. Once you do that to a contract, it ceases to have any meaning.

We have gotten so far away from what our founding fathers set up that there is no way back to it, short of dividing this country. I'm ready for it.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Quote:
 
I feel quite confident that they would say, this is the result of the system we developed, if you respect the system you have to respect the result.



This is where you run off the rails, Quirt. I don't have to respect a damned thing that results from a bastardization of the system. I don't have the slightest bit of respect for the "system we have set up". I respect the system that was *originally* set up. The one we have now is nothing like that, and is an abomination. You can follow it like a sheep to the slaughter if you want, but not me.

And they would NOT say what you have stated - they'd say overthrow the mess that has taken the place of what we once had as a government and go back to what they set up.
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
The voting system hasn't really changed, Larry, except to add women to the mix, and I'm pretty sure that's not what you're talking about.

The voting system today is pretty much the same voting system that existed when the Constitution was written, and there hasn't been any bastardization of that.

So the question remains ... how can you love the country if you refuse to honor the basic principle of democracy? If you aren't willing to respect the democratic process, what is it that you think you love? Because it isn't America, it isn't even an idealized version of America. America, from the beginning and ever since, has always been about democracy, first and foremost.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
I'm not talking about the voting system. I'm talking about the f*cked up mess that passes for government today.

Quote:
 
So the question remains ... how can you love the country if you refuse to honor the basic principle of democracy?


You seem to have forgotten that part of the democratic process, in fact the underlying foundation of it - is that its purpose is to serve the PEOPLE, not the other way around, and that if it ceases to serve the people, then the people have a right to overthrow that government.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
The people elected that government. If they didn't think it was serving them, they could have elected a different one. This is the government the PEOPLE chose. That choice has to be respected.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Nobody's Sock
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Fulla-Carp
Luke's Dad
Mar 27 2009, 12:32 PM
Finally! It's about damn time! Let me go get changed, and I'll be ready to go!

And to think M&M's thought I was crazy for buying all of this stuff!


Ok, I'm ready!

Posted Image

Damn, these tights are riding up!

Man, you could take out a whole row of zombies with one shot!

Better have backup though, they bullrush you, you're a gonner.

"Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known."
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
That's silly, simple minded thinking Quirt, and you're capable of better. Yes, we elected him. We can choose to remove him also. You seem to be of the opinion that no matter what happens, we have to accept it. That's not democracy, and your line of logic is silly.
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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