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Kenny's screwed.
Topic Started: Feb 20 2009, 07:08 AM (352 Views)
Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
Taxed by the mile
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Quote:
 
Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood says he wants to consider taxing motorists based on how many miles they drive rather than how much gasoline they burn


That is absolutely appalling. Why??
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Aqua Letifer
Feb 20 2009, 07:13 AM
Quote:
 
Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood says he wants to consider taxing motorists based on how many miles they drive rather than how much gasoline they burn


That is absolutely appalling. Why??
Because the amount of road you use doesn't depend on how much gasoline you burn.

(Not that I agree, but there is at least a plausible rationale.)
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
So we're going to add yet another layer of complexity to taxes? Great. Let the odometer rollbacks begin.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Mikhailoh
Feb 20 2009, 08:10 AM
So we're going to add yet another layer of complexity to taxes? Great. Let the odometer rollbacks begin.
In Massachusetts, the discussion has been to use monitoring technology to calculate road use ... you know, like the EZ-Pass for the turnpike, but installed everywhere. So, you can stop Googling odometer rollbacks for the moment, because it might not help.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
I read that they are contemplating using GPS technolgy which gets us to where the monitor not only how far we drive but where.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
QuirtEvans
Feb 20 2009, 08:16 AM
Mikhailoh
Feb 20 2009, 08:10 AM
So we're going to add yet another layer of complexity to taxes? Great. Let the odometer rollbacks begin.
In Massachusetts, the discussion has been to use monitoring technology to calculate road use ... you know, like the EZ-Pass for the turnpike, but installed everywhere. So, you can stop Googling odometer rollbacks for the moment, because it might not help.
Yeah okay. What about the folks who drive 100+ miles a day in a 5-mile radius? Delivery personnel is what I'm getting at. Even if they use available technology to screw them over, why would you want to do that?
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
The other drawback here is that, while you might argue (and I believe incorrectly) that road usage is more fair than fuel consumption, taxation based on miles driven does nothing to encourage fuel-efficient vehicles.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
That's right. My 320 HP Mustang is driven only about 30 miles a day on weekdays. Less on weekends.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Mikhailoh
Feb 20 2009, 08:26 AM
The other drawback here is that, while you might argue (and I believe incorrectly) that road usage is more fair than fuel consumption, taxation based on miles driven does nothing to encourage fuel-efficient vehicles.
It would be different is this could somehow persuade others to use alternative means of transportation but in a lot of areas, that simply isn't an option. All this does is screw over the guy who has to drive for a living, or has a longer commute than most because what do you know! -- our infrastructure is such that our work locations are often times many miles away from home!

This is stupid on so many levels.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Article
 
The system would require all cars and trucks be equipped with global satellite positioning technology, a transponder, a clock and other equipment to record how many miles a vehicle was driven, whether it was driven on highways or secondary roads, and even whether it was driven during peak traffic periods or off-peak hours.

The device would tally how much tax motorists owed depending upon their road use. Motorists would pay the amount owed when it was downloaded, probably at gas stations at first, but an alternative eventually would be needed.


In other words, every vehicle will have to be equipped with a meter of sorts. Who owns the meter? Who pays for the installation and maintenance in older vehicles?

Ain't gonna work. It's a hairbrained stupid idea.
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QuirtEvans
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Renauda
Feb 20 2009, 08:33 AM
Article
 
The system would require all cars and trucks be equipped with global satellite positioning technology, a transponder, a clock and other equipment to record how many miles a vehicle was driven, whether it was driven on highways or secondary roads, and even whether it was driven during peak traffic periods or off-peak hours.

The device would tally how much tax motorists owed depending upon their road use. Motorists would pay the amount owed when it was downloaded, probably at gas stations at first, but an alternative eventually would be needed.


In other words, every vehicle will have to be equipped with a meter of sorts. Who owns the meter? Who pays for the installation and maintenance in older vehicles?

Ain't gonna work. It's a hairbrained stupid idea.
The meter is priced into the price of the car, of course.

For existing cars ... maybe it's like catalytic converters. Only required on new models.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Luke's Dad
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Mikhailoh
Feb 20 2009, 08:26 AM
The other drawback here is that, while you might argue (and I believe incorrectly) that road usage is more fair than fuel consumption, taxation based on miles driven does nothing to encourage fuel-efficient vehicles.
Hence the title of the thread.
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
QuirtEvans
Feb 20 2009, 08:34 AM
Renauda
Feb 20 2009, 08:33 AM
Article
 
The system would require all cars and trucks be equipped with global satellite positioning technology, a transponder, a clock and other equipment to record how many miles a vehicle was driven, whether it was driven on highways or secondary roads, and even whether it was driven during peak traffic periods or off-peak hours.

The device would tally how much tax motorists owed depending upon their road use. Motorists would pay the amount owed when it was downloaded, probably at gas stations at first, but an alternative eventually would be needed.


In other words, every vehicle will have to be equipped with a meter of sorts. Who owns the meter? Who pays for the installation and maintenance in older vehicles?

Ain't gonna work. It's a hairbrained stupid idea.
The meter is priced into the price of the car, of course.

For existing cars ... maybe it's like catalytic converters. Only required on new models.
I'm so disabling mine if it ever comes to this. Either that or permanently affix it to my parking lot.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Sorry but a simple per gallon levy on fuel collected and administered by individual states makes more sense. Pay as you go across the board. No one's exempted, even tourists from north of the 49th.
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
QuirtEvans
Feb 20 2009, 08:34 AM
Renauda
Feb 20 2009, 08:33 AM
Article
 
The system would require all cars and trucks be equipped with global satellite positioning technology, a transponder, a clock and other equipment to record how many miles a vehicle was driven, whether it was driven on highways or secondary roads, and even whether it was driven during peak traffic periods or off-peak hours.

The device would tally how much tax motorists owed depending upon their road use. Motorists would pay the amount owed when it was downloaded, probably at gas stations at first, but an alternative eventually would be needed.


In other words, every vehicle will have to be equipped with a meter of sorts. Who owns the meter? Who pays for the installation and maintenance in older vehicles?

Ain't gonna work. It's a hairbrained stupid idea.
The meter is priced into the price of the car, of course.

For existing cars ... maybe it's like catalytic converters. Only required on new models.
That would REALLY be the kiss of death for the auto industry. Make it financially undesirable to buy a new car.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
Of course it would put a crimp in auto theft.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
But the purpose of the GPS gizmo is not to stop auto theft, its to log mileage so that the registered owner can be charged a mileage/road use tax. Wouldn't make a hill of difference to thieves.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
What you're seeing is a plan to get around a little tax problem they see coming down the road - how do you collect taxes on cars that don't use gasoline?

For instance, in a world where half the cars run off electricity or something other than fossil fuels, fuel consumption drops by roughly half, taxes collected drop by roughly half, yet the same number of vehicles are traveling the roads.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Renauda
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HOLY CARP!!!
Larry, I think you're on to something there
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Larry
Feb 20 2009, 09:04 AM
What you're seeing is a plan to get around a little tax problem they see coming down the road - how do you collect taxes on cars that don't use gasoline?

For instance, in a world where half the cars run off electricity or something other than fossil fuels, fuel consumption drops by roughly half, taxes collected drop by roughly half, yet the same number of vehicles are traveling the roads.

An interesting point.

It sounds like the downside of anti-smoking campaigns ... tobacco tax revenues go down.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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1hp
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Fulla-Carp

I don't think it is such a dumb idea. I do not believe that it is the Government's job to try and persuade people to buy certain types of car, whether it be based on better mpg, paint colour, or made in America. I do believe it is the Governments job to provide and maintain infrastructure such as roads and bridges. Any vehicle, regardless of gas mileage, benefits from any road provided. A Prius requires pretty much the same 20 feet of road as a Chevy truck, and does not alleviate rush hour traffic. Friction, wear and tear, etc.... all cause maintenance on the road. So as far as the cost of maintaining existing infrastructure, and building new infrastructure - the more you use, the more you pay. This is pretty much how you pay for everything else whether it be be netflix, or cell phones.

My 2 cents.
There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
I've got a friend that is absolutely convinced that car, oil, and energy companies have all the technology developed to implement renewable energy sources, hydrogen cell vehicles, energy efficient homes, and the like; but they aren't putting them out there because they can't figure out how to continue to make the same amount of money they have been.
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Luke's Dad
Feb 20 2009, 08:39 AM
Mikhailoh
Feb 20 2009, 08:26 AM
The other drawback here is that, while you might argue (and I believe incorrectly) that road usage is more fair than fuel consumption, taxation based on miles driven does nothing to encourage fuel-efficient vehicles.
Hence the title of the thread.
It would be easy enough to set up a tiered system where the per mile tax rates are based on the fuel efficiency of the vehicle. That's what I'd do if I were a totalitarian, centralizing, socialist, leftist, environmentalist whacko, power grubbing, freedom hating, market controlling, big spending, Democratic politician.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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1hp
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Fulla-Carp

Sheesh, what next, personal income taxes escalating on how much food each family member consumes? :smokin:
There are 10 kinds of people in this world, those that understand binary and................
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