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The End of Conservatism?
Topic Started: Oct 5 2008, 09:44 AM (615 Views)
kathyk
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Pisa-Carp
This article, The Fall of America, Inc. by Francis Fukuyama has bowled me over, just about as much as his earlier retraction of the PNAC theories he helped formulate and that led to the invasion of Iraq

This summation from the earlier article on Iraq:

"We do not know what outcome we will face in Iraq. We do know that four years after 9/11, our whole foreign policy seems destined to rise or fall on the outcome of a war only marginally related to the source of what befell us on that day. There was nothing inevitable about this. There is everything to be regretted about it."

And this now on Reaganomics:

"Yet even as Americans ask why they're having to pay such mind-bending sums to prevent the economy from imploding, few are discussing a more intangible, yet potentially much greater cost to the United States—the damage that the financial meltdown is doing to America's "brand."
. . . .
Many commentators have noted that the Wall Street meltdown marks the end of the Reagan era. In this they are doubtless right, even if McCain manages to get elected president in November."

--------

And who has been talking about out of touch elitists? So, much for Fukuyama's high minded theories. At least he has the decency to admit how very wrong he was.
Blogging in Palestine: http://kksjournal.com/
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George K
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Finally
kathyk
Oct 5 2008, 12:44 PM
And who has been talking about out of touch elitists. So, much for Fukuyama's high minded theories. At least he has the decency to admit how very wrong he was.

At least he has the decency to admit how very wrong he thinks he was.

This time.

(I fixed it for you :lol: )
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- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

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kathyk
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He was once squarely in your camp George. And he's no dimwit.

Edit: Although I do get a little embarrassed when I try to pronounce his name.
Blogging in Palestine: http://kksjournal.com/
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apple
one of the angels
kathyk
Oct 5 2008, 12:47 PM
And he's no dimwit.


an understatement if there ever was one.

Great article Kathy
it behooves me to behold
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Falstaff
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Junior Carp
Europe would beg to differ that conservatism is over. Look at the latest elections. US is just behind the 8ball.
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kathyk
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It all goes in cycles, doesn't it. I think that the writing is on the wall: The conservative era in the US, as represented by free wheeling Reaganomics, PNAC and Rovian below the belt politics (just threw that one in - doesn't hurt to hope, does it?) is over. It's the end of the cycle - halleluja!
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Horace
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HOLY CARP!!!
Interesting article, thanks Kathy. Cherry picking it for things that affirm my own notions, I noticed that he blamed the financial sector for being destructive to the economy, and considers that sector to be a 'special case' of capitalism which needs to be closely regulated (while most other parts of a capitalistic economy do genuinely flourish with less regulation).
As a good person, I implore you to do as I, a good person, do. Be good. Do NOT be bad. If you see bad, end bad. End it in yourself, and end it in others. By any means necessary, the good must conquer the bad. Good people know this. Do you know this? Are you good?
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
They had a great 8-year cycle.

America, and the whole world, is so peachy now.

I'm sure Americans will prolong this wonderful cycle and elect McCain.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
40% of Americans are essentially conservative.

Obama will have to produce, and produce quick. But he won't have any money to do so. He might have enough of a majority in Congress to pass some otherwise un-passable legislation, but I think he will be eventually torn into ribbons.

Many have endured years of seeing everything bad that ever happened to anybody attributed to George Bush.

It's time for our pound of flesh...and there's more of us...I may enjoy this immensely...
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
What everyone seems to be missing is that George W Bush isn't a conservative.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
John D'Oh
Oct 5 2008, 01:59 PM
What everyone seems to be missing is that George W Bush isn't a conservative.

True, but we had some high hopes, for awhile...
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 04:02 PM
John D'Oh
Oct 5 2008, 01:59 PM
What everyone seems to be missing is that George W Bush isn't a conservative.

True, but we had some high hopes, for awhile...

That's pretty much what the liberals will be saying 2 years from now.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Copper
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Shortstop
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 03:58 PM

Many have endured years of seeing everything bad that ever happened to anybody attributed to George Bush.

It's time for our pound of flesh...and there's more of us...I may enjoy this immensely...


If he gets elected, who would blame Mr. Obama for anything bad that happens?

Oprah? The view girls? Katie Couric? Maybe someone from CNN or MSNBC?

Don't hold your breath.
The Confederate soldier was peculiar in that he was ever ready to fight, but never ready to submit to the routine duty and discipline of the camp or the march. The soldiers were determined to be soldiers after their own notions, and do their duty, for the love of it, as they thought best. Carlton McCarthy
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apple
one of the angels
ha ha ha

ah how the world has changed..
it behooves me to behold
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
John D'Oh
Oct 5 2008, 12:59 PM
What everyone seems to be missing is that George W Bush isn't a conservative.

Thank you, John. A number of us have been saying that for years.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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kathyk
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Then again, a lot of you conservatives have been valiantly defending him for years.
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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
Isn't it funny... when the man was busy "formulating PNAC" plans, playing footsie with Rove, and a Reagan fan, Kathy thought he was crazy. Now that he's saying things she agrees with he's a genius...

The things that caused the financial crisis we're having began years after Reagan left office. That alone is a clue that this man is now smoking crack.

Fringe Leftists like Kathy would love nothing more than to believe that Conservatism is dead. It's the only thing standing in the way of her fruitcake fringe brethren pushing the country into a Marxist state.

But I have news for you Kathy, and for the idiot who wrote the article. Conservatism is a long way from being dead. And as much as you'd like it to be otherwise, the liberals here who are capable of rational thought should agree that the worst thing that could possibly happen would be for either side of the aisle to die. It is the give and take that comes from a two party system that has made us what we are.

Lastly, as to your "free wheeling Reaganomics, PNAC and Rovian below the belt politics" remark....

one has to wonder if you fringe left morons have to have help tying your shoes. "Free wheeling Reaganomics" worked. I know, you leftwing fruitcakes think otherwise, but you're stupid. PNAC promoted protecting the sovereignty of our country, defending it however we had to defend it. It is really sad to know that there are people in this country who actually have a problem with that. Carl Rove is a brilliant political strategist. He was hired to do a job, and he did it. His "below the belt politics' as you like to call it were no more below the belt than the politics of *your* party.

All in all, it isn't that Conservatism is dead, it's that the number of idiots in the country is increasing.

Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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Larry
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
And furthermore - anyone who is out searching the internet for articles talking about the "fall of America", and who supports an ideology that constantly seems to actually *wish* for the fall of America like the MoveOn/Daily Kos/Kathyk fringe kook Left does

can

KISS

MY

AMERICAN

ASS.
Of the Pokatwat Tribe

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apple
one of the angels
wake up and smell the coffee
it behooves me to behold
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Is that what that stench is?
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Jack Frost
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Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 02:58 PM
40% of Americans are essentially conservative.

Obama will have to produce, and produce quick. But he won't have any money to do so. He might have enough of a majority in Congress to pass some otherwise un-passable legislation, but I think he will be eventually torn into ribbons.

Many have endured years of seeing everything bad that ever happened to anybody attributed to George Bush.

It's time for our pound of flesh...and there's more of us...I may enjoy this immensely...

Obama will be much much smarter and less liberal than you think.

There is actually some chance that three years from now, you will think about voting for his second term.

Ne need to respond. File it away.

jf
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Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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kathyk
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ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 04:48 PM
Is that what that stench is?

Oh, have you switched to green tea, too? Pftt - elitist. ^_^
Blogging in Palestine: http://kksjournal.com/
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Jack Frost
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Larry
Oct 5 2008, 06:34 PM
Carl Rove is a brilliant political strategist. He was hired to do a job, and he did it.

We shall see. Karl (with a K) Rove's job as he described it, was to create the "permanent Republican majority."

I don't want to go too far out on a limb here, but it looks to me that he has failed...but I am willing to go double down on November.

We shall see.

Methinks Karl's plan was very very short sighted.

jf

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Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 08:48 PM
Is that what that stench is?


No, I think that's Larry's American ass.

:lol:
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Jack Frost
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Bull-Carp
jon-nyc
Oct 5 2008, 07:58 PM
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 08:48 PM
Is that what that stench is?


No, I think that's Larry's American ass.

:lol:

OH, that too!

jf
Quote:
 
Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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