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Bias
Topic Started: Oct 5 2008, 05:57 AM (420 Views)
Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
Sarah Palin is taking a bigger beating because she's a Republican woman

After the vice presidential debate ended, as the TV jurors started delivering their verdicts, Sarah Palin and Joe Biden were joined on stage by their families. Nothing unusual there - except the history-making picture of Palin hugging her 5-month-old son while sharing chitchat with Biden.

Freeze the frame and savor its remarkable collection of milestones.

They start with the fact that Palin is only the second woman to be on a major-party national ticket. She is the first who would take office as the mother of five children, the oldest being 19.

Her baby, Trig, has Down syndrome, and her oldest daughter, Bristol, is pregnant and unmarried. They are both firsts, as far as we know, for any major-party nominee. Oh, and her husband, Todd, is part Eskimo.

History doesn't just happen in the 2008 campaign. It is happening in mind-numbing, holy cow, what-next bunches.

The changes are coming so fast we hardly take notice. Is America really going to elect a black President? Two years ago, that was unthinkable. Now it's very likely as Barack Obama has seized the momentum 30 days from the election.

But before we sprain our shoulders patting ourselves on the back for our color-blind, bias-free selves, let's acknowledge that certain prejudices are far from taboo. In fact, in some quarters they are ascendant and celebrated.

I'm thinking of the overt, outrageous prejudice that infuses some of the contempt on the left for Palin. Scrape away the surface excuses and much of it is because she is a Republican. And an anti-abortion one at that. How dare she!

That the bias comes from people we think of as sophisticated makes it disappointing, but not surprising. After all, contempt for Republicans is the only socially acceptable prejudice remaining among many educated people today.

A celebrated retired journalist, a man I've long admired, was surprised when I told him I hadn't decided whom to vote for. "You're too smart to vote for John McCain," he said, thereby insulting 50 million Americans.

A well-to-do, middle-aged professional woman who identifies herself as very liberal casually declared at a recent social gathering that Palin was unqualified to be vice president. "Look at all those children; she would be neglecting them," the woman said, before adding she herself has five grown daughters.

I could hardly contain myself. "How," I managed to say relatively calmly, "would you feel if a man just said what you said?"

"Oh, I didn't mean anything; I was just thinking of the children," she said sheepishly.

Of course she was thinking of the children. And Jimmy the Greek was just talking history when he discussed slavery and black anatomy and Al Campanis was misunderstood when he said blacks lacked the "necessities" to be baseball executives.

Those unmaskings of raw bigotry came on TV 20 years ago. Times change, and so does prejudice. And not all sightings are dramatic.

George W. Bush appointed the first two black secretaries of state, but does anyone on the left regard him as a racial trailblazer? When I raised that question to another liberal, she dismissed the idea, saying Bush "never thought about race."

That exchange took place three years ago, but I still can't grasp her logic. How does she know what Bush thought? Why would it be more important than what he does?

A similar blind spot toward the political "other" explains much of the contempt for Palin. If she were a Democrat, her unusual life would be spun into a compelling narrative that would make her the darling of the coastal elite.

How she's raising that lovely brood of kids, her care for that severely handicapped baby, her relationship with that rugged hubby who often cares for the kids and is part native, her unlikely rise through the political minefields, her tough knocks and gutsy performance on the national stage - all would be testament to a breakthrough of historic proportions we would be ordered to celebrate in the name of diversity and equality.

Yes, I know there are many legitimate reasons to vote against her and McCain. And I am not arguing for a second they should be supported, least of all because of her gender.

But couldn't we all at least acknowledge Palin's moment and what it means for America?

Apparently not. She must lose, the liberal narrative goes, because she is unqualified, case closed.

Some day, we will look back with disgust at the abuse Palin has taken and wonder how it could happen in this great nation, circa 2008.

Spare me. We already know the answer.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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blondie
Bull-Carp
Jolly,
Don't overanalyze it. Sarah's taking the biggest beating because she's the biggest idiot.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
blondie
Oct 5 2008, 10:23 AM
Jolly,
Don't overanalyze it.  Sarah's taking the biggest beating because she's the biggest idiot.

Occams razor at work again.

I'm sure lots of Republican supporters tried to claim that Dan Quayle was suitable for the VP position as well.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
John D'Oh
Oct 5 2008, 10:13 AM
blondie
Oct 5 2008, 10:23 AM
Jolly,
Don't overanalyze it.  Sarah's taking the biggest beating because she's the biggest idiot.

Occams razor at work again.

I'm sure lots of Republican supporters tried to claim that Dan Quayle was suitable for the VP position as well.

The right LOVES someone easily manipulable, who cannot or will not think for themselves.

Sarah fits the bill, you betcha.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
I don't perceive any significant shifts in Palin's positions over the course of her political career -- pro defense, small government, reform of corruption, low taxes, etc -- so I can't see why you would suggest she is manipulable.

I think of all of the four she is the most transparent and principled and presents herself as who she really is -- and I think the left (and you) hate her and mock her for that.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Mona Charen shares her views on all those subjects, and I'd never mock Mona.

Because she's smart and thoughtful.

Sarah Palin is an inch deep. The fact that she's consistent in her views doesn't change that reality.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 12:27 PM
I think of all of the four she is the most transparent and principled and presents herself as who she really is -- and I think the left (and you) hate her and mock her for that.

If I didn't know better, I'd think you haven't heard of the the good Friar.
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
Anybody espousing or believing a conservative point of view must by definition be an idiot, doncha know?



The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
QuirtEvans
Oct 5 2008, 09:33 AM
Mona Charen shares her views on all those subjects, and I'd never mock Mona.

Because she's smart and thoughtful.

Sarah Palin is an inch deep. The fact that she's consistent in her views doesn't change that reality.

None of that addresses the point that you seem to think she is manipulable. In fact you basically admit that she is not since you agree that she is consistent in her view.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
jon-nyc
Oct 5 2008, 09:37 AM
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 12:27 PM
I think of all of the four she is the most transparent and principled and presents herself as who she really is -- and I think the left (and you) hate her and mock her for that.

If I didn't know better, I'd think you haven't heard of the the good Friar.

Jon: you better put away that razor before you hurt yourself. Those are sharp and can cut people who don't know how to handle them.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 11:42 AM
QuirtEvans
Oct 5 2008, 09:33 AM
Mona Charen shares her views on all those subjects, and I'd never mock Mona.

Because she's smart and thoughtful. 

Sarah Palin is an inch deep.  The fact that she's consistent in her views doesn't change that reality.

None of that addresses the point that you seem to think she is manipulable. In fact you basically admit that she is not since you agree that she is consistent in her view.

I don't think her track record is long enough ... she's had about a year-and-a-half in any office larger than [pick your favorite example] ... for you to claim that she is not.

The larger question is how she will choose positions on subjects on which she has not yet taken a (national) position.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
Everything will go to Sh!t regardless of who gets elected.

I expect Obama will.
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Luke's Dad
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Emperor Pengin
Welcome to the "We're Screwed in 08" club, Kenny! Glad to have ya!
The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it.
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
ivorythumper
Oct 5 2008, 12:27 PM
I don't perceive any significant shifts in Palin's positions over the course of her political career -- pro defense, small government, reform of corruption, low taxes, etc -- so I can't see why you would suggest she is manipulable.

I think of all of the four she is the most transparent and principled and presents herself as who she really is -- and I think the left (and you) hate her and mock her for that.

I'm not The Left, but I certainly don't hate her. I'm sure she's a very nice person. I wouldn't want her running the country obviously - my God, you'd have to be a total moron to want her doing that! :lol:
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
QuirtEvans
Oct 5 2008, 10:33 AM
Mona Charen shares her views on all those subjects, and I'd never mock Mona.

Because she's smart and thoughtful.

Sarah Palin is an inch deep. The fact that she's consistent in her views doesn't change that reality.

At one time, people said Reagan was an inch deep.

Now, there's talk about putting him on Mt. Rushmore....
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 03:07 PM
QuirtEvans
Oct 5 2008, 10:33 AM
Mona Charen shares her views on all those subjects, and I'd never mock Mona.

Because she's smart and thoughtful. 

Sarah Palin is an inch deep.  The fact that she's consistent in her views doesn't change that reality.

At one time, people said Reagan was an inch deep.

Now, there's talk about putting him on Mt. Rushmore....

Better blow this up and frame it, it's as close as you're gonna get.

Posted Image
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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Jack Frost
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Bull-Carp
Jolly, I have little agreement with Obama supporters who say if he loses it will be because of racial bias. There is no doubt some will not vote for Obama because he is black; while some will vote for him precisely because he is black. There will always be some voters who don't look past one or two things abount a candidate. Most people get past that.

He offers a detailed position on many issues, and there are plently of substantive reasons to vote against him if you disagree with his positions.

Palin is just plain not competent to be VP. There are lots of good easons to think she is unqualified and many conservative writers have detailed them in the press. In my view, she doesn't even come close. Neither did Quayle. This has nothing to do with bias.

jf
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Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
She's a sitting governor.

She's qualified. Maybe not as much as some, but better than others. Her qualifications are actually better than Obama's, when speaking strictly about executive experience.

Not Ivy League educated, and not as good an orator, but those things are not what defines a President...
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Jack Frost
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Bull-Carp
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 04:47 PM
She's a sitting governor.

She's qualified. Maybe not as much as some, but better than others. Her qualifications are actually better than Obama's, when speaking strictly about executive experience.

Not Ivy League educated, and not as good an orator, but those things are not what defines a President...

I disagree. They both lack experience, but Obama is very competent. Sarah Palin has never even thought about most most the things she would face as President or VP, let anone read a book or talked with anyone about them.

Obama's education is worth a lot, but he has also been studying the issues for two years, talking to some of the smartest and most experienced people in every field. As an executive, he has run a terrific campaign--and yes, he DOES get credit for putting to gether that team.

It's not just a matter of playing "Gotcha" with Palin. I don't care if she has memorized the name of every world leader and capitol city. She seems to have no knowledge of or understanding or or even position on foreign relations, the economy, and a host of other issues.

She is not nearly as competent as Obama is at this point.

Whether she could get there in another two years if she applied herself as he has is a question I will leave for another day.

But my point is...the outcry agasint Palin has nothing to do with bias in the vast majority of cases. It has to do with what MANY people feel is her lack of competence. Even granting the possibility that I and others are wrong to think her incompetent, she has given many many reasons for us to think that.

Bias has nothing to do with it.

jf
Quote:
 
Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 04:47 PM
She's a sitting governor.

She's qualified. Maybe not as much as some, but better than others. Her qualifications are actually better than Obama's, when speaking strictly about executive experience.

Not Ivy League educated, and not as good an orator, but those things are not what defines a President...

She still suffers from the Roman Hruska problem. We don't need the mediocre represented among our national leadership.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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apple
one of the angels
McCain ought to so dump her and get Tina Fey.
it behooves me to behold
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
apple
Oct 5 2008, 05:15 PM
McCain ought to so dump her and get Tina Fey.

Spoken like a true Democrat.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Jack Frost
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Bull-Carp
apple
Oct 5 2008, 06:15 PM
McCain ought to so dump her and get Tina Fey.

Tina Fey is a better Sarah Palin than Sarah Palin!

jf
Quote:
 
Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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Jack Frost
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Bull-Carp
Jolly
Oct 5 2008, 06:25 PM
apple
Oct 5 2008, 05:15 PM
McCain ought to so dump her and get Tina Fey.

Spoken like a true Democrat.

That was Republican speaking.

jf


Quote:
 
Let it be said by our children's children that when we were tested we refused to let this journey end, that we did not turn back nor did we falter; and with eyes fixed on the horizon and God's grace upon us, we carried forth that great gift of freedom and delivered it safely to future generations.
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Ben
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Senior Carp
The statement "bias has nothing to do with it" isn't quite true IMO. The liberal outcry against Palin is not all self-serving bias and it's not all unbiased legitimate concern for the future of the country. We shouldn't pretend that it's either. There is definitely a concrete liberal bias against principled conservatives. They're looked down upon as simplistic, pathetic anti-intellectuals (or, at least, such is my experience and the experience of many others). To what extent is arguable. Likewise, there are legitimate concerns about Palin's qualifications for the Vice Presidency, and I'm not shy to admit that they're not what I wish they might be.

As I've said before, in different words, I would rather have someone who hasn't yet thought about a complicated issue become President and do some on-the-job learning than have someone who has thought about it and come out with the wrong answer run my country. Ideally, I would rather have neither - hey wait, there's a candidate offering such a thing! John McCain!
- Ben

"Playing 'bop' is like playing Scrabble with all the vowels missing." - Duke Ellington

bennieloohoo@gmail.com
Or you can just PM me. :P
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