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Tom Tancredo on Bombing Mecca
Topic Started: Aug 5 2007, 09:20 AM (2,054 Views)
ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Tancredo said something stupid. I have no huge problem (hypothetically) bombing Mecca (perhaps some smaller quibbles though) but it is imprudent to talk about it. Just do it -- don't ever give away your game plan.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
Et tu, Thumpi?

Don't you think bombing Mecca (which is a civilian city in a friendly nation) would be an act of terrorism?
In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
I do not see it as being categorically off the table. However, I think it would be an extraordinary circumstance (perhaps a nuke attack on one of our cities) that would justify it.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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jon-nyc
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Cheers
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 03:18 PM
I do not see it as being categorically off the table. However, I think it would be an extraordinary circumstance (perhaps a nuke attack on one of our cities) that would justify it.

Aren't you missing something there? Like, wouldn't the nuke attack have to have been perpetrated by the Saudis?

In my defense, I was left unsupervised.
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TomK
HOLY CARP!!!
jon-nyc
Aug 7 2007, 03:22 PM
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 03:18 PM
I do not see it as being categorically off the table. However, I think it would be an extraordinary circumstance (perhaps a nuke attack on one of our cities) that would justify it.

Aren't you missing something there? Like, wouldn't the nuke attack have to have been perpetrated by the Saudis?

Now we are talking about the First REAL World War. (WWI and WWII don't count--they were puny compaired to this battle to the death of cultures.)
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
jon-nyc
Aug 7 2007, 12:16 PM
Et tu, Thumpi?

Don't you think bombing Mecca (which is a civilian city in a friendly nation) would be an act of terrorism?

As I said, hypothetically. As long as they remain friendly, fine.

it would not necessarily be an act of terrorism, it could be a legitimate act of war. Depends on the hypothesis.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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AlbertaCrude
Bull-Carp
I would think so too jon. After all, we are being repeatedly told this is not a war against Islam. A retaliatory incineration of Mecca and other select Islamic "holy sites" (whatever the hell that means) would seem to dispute that claim.
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
jon-nyc
Aug 7 2007, 01:22 PM
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 03:18 PM
I do not see it as being categorically off the table. However, I think it would be an extraordinary circumstance (perhaps a nuke attack on one of our cities) that would justify it.

Aren't you missing something there? Like, wouldn't the nuke attack have to have been perpetrated by the Saudis?

I am certainly not referring to a nuke attack by Finland (obviously). However, I would not categorically limit it to an attack by the Saudis. The importance of Mecca to Muslims is such that it transcends Saudi borders.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
I am really getting into the hypothetical here. I am utterly opposed to the bombing of Mecca under present circumstances but I am certain that a nuke attack on one of our major cities will make the vast majority of Americans envision that which they would never have before.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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AlbertaCrude
Bull-Carp
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 01:46 PM
I am utterly opposed to the bombing of Mecca under present circumstances but I am certain that a nuke attack on one of our major cities will make the vast majority of Americans envision that which they would never have before.

I should think that another terrorist attack of any sort and magnitude conducted by Muslims- foreign, home grown or both- will make the US of A a less than friendly place for a Muslim to live.

Will put a hole new meaning to Toby Keith's phrase "we'll put a boot in your ass, that's the American way".
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
I agree, AL. The lines in the airports are enough to send people into a murderous rage, already.
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
If we ever do bomb those sites, it had better be because we have changed over to a Vietnam era sentiment for our strategy - 'Kill 'em all. Let God sort 'em out'.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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TomK
HOLY CARP!!!
When the billion or so Muslems declare war against us--by all means let's bomb Mecca--hell let's bomb the entire Middle East.

Till then let's hunt out the bad people and kill them and then do business deals with the rest.
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AlbertaCrude
Bull-Carp
Better yet, corrupt them with cash
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TomK
HOLY CARP!!!
AlbertaCrude
Aug 7 2007, 05:08 PM
Better yet, corrupt them with cash


We've been doing that for the last 75 years. The Arabs do nothing. They make nothing, they sell nothing. They have no industry. No trade--except in oil. No businesses, just oil.

We pump it and we pay them for the privilege.

It's when the oil runs out--then the real war starts.

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AlbertaCrude
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Think I didn't know that?

I wonder if they know what the futures market for sand looks like?
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
Wouldn't it make more sense, then, to bomb the bejeezus out of the oil fields?

(makes more sense than bombing Mecca, fer godssakes....)
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
Frank_W
Aug 7 2007, 04:17 PM
I agree, AL. The lines in the airports are enough to send people into a murderous rage, already.

Oh, how we suffer so in the war against terror. One day men will tell tales of the me-now generation and their 2 hour wait at Heathrow that defeated Osama bin-Laden and the satanic forces of Islamo-fascism. Those citizens of Moscow, London, even Berlin in the 1940's didn't know how lucky they were - sure, they didn't have a house, but at least they didn't have to queue!

:lol:
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
:lol2:

How global whining caused all of those nasty terrorists to clamp their hands over their ears and run away, and forget all about bombing or converting the Western World. :lol2:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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TomK
HOLY CARP!!!
AlbertaCrude
Aug 7 2007, 05:21 PM
Think I didn't know that?

Teaching my grandmother to suck eggs. :biggrin:
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AlbertaCrude
Bull-Carp
Smarty pants
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QuirtEvans
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 02:40 PM
jon-nyc
Aug 7 2007, 01:22 PM
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 03:18 PM
I do not see it as being categorically off the table. However, I think it would be an extraordinary circumstance (perhaps a nuke attack on one of our cities) that would justify it.

Aren't you missing something there? Like, wouldn't the nuke attack have to have been perpetrated by the Saudis?

I am certainly not referring to a nuke attack by Finland (obviously). However, I would not categorically limit it to an attack by the Saudis. The importance of Mecca to Muslims is such that it transcends Saudi borders.

Hmm, let's see if we can rephrase that, just a little. I wonder if the statement will hold just as true.

Quote:
 
The importance of the New York Stock Exchange to capitalism/Western society is such that it transcends United States borders.


Quote:
 
The importance of the Vatican to Christianity is such that it transcends Italian borders.


Quote:
 
The importance of Jerusalem to various religions is such that it transcends Israeli borders.


Quote:
 
The importance of the Pyramids to Western civilization is such that it transcends Egyptian borders.


Hmm, seems like a dangerous argument.
It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
QuirtEvans
Aug 7 2007, 03:56 PM
Quote:
 
The importance of the Vatican to Christianity is such that it transcends Italian borders.


bad analogy Quirt, since the Vatican is not part of Italy whereas the other places are part of the respective countries.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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JBryan
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I am the grey one
Quirt, every devout Muslim on the face of the planet bows down towards Mecca and prays five times a day. When we see people doing that to the New York Stock Exchange then maybe you have a valid point. Of course, from the point of view of the Islamic radicals they are precisely equivalent, hence the attack on the WTC.

Usually, simply substituting different words into arguments achieves nothing beyond rhetorical trickery.
"Any man who would make an X rated movie should be forced to take his daughter to see it". - John Wayne


There is a line we cross when we go from "I will believe it when I see it" to "I will see it when I believe it".


Henry II: I marvel at you after all these years. Still like a democratic drawbridge: going down for everybody.

Eleanor: At my age there's not much traffic anymore.

From The Lion in Winter.
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
JBryan
Aug 7 2007, 06:20 PM
rhetorical trickery.

Favorite tool of lawyers everywhere! :whistle:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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