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The Battle for Britistan
Topic Started: Oct 20 2006, 08:53 AM (546 Views)
Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
http://www.spectator.org/dsp_article.asp?art_id=10491
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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kentcouncil
Fulla-Carp
Europe's response to Muslim violence has thus far been extremely tame, even after the Madrid and London bombings, but I wonder what will happen when the Muslims currently living in Western Europe finally go too far. The current European of values of tolerance and liberalism constitute a rather thin and recent veneer on top of Europe's traditional racism, nationalism, and unmatched taste for savagery, and perhaps Muslims should not take their current protected position for granted. European countries may now be loathe to unleash their fury against each other as they've done historically, but I think they still retain their capacity for draconian measures against an identifiable population within their own borders.
It was a confusion of ideas between him and one of the lions he was hunting in Kenya that had caused A. B. Spottsworth to make the obituary column. He thought the lion was dead, and the lion thought it wasn't.

- P.G. Wodehouse
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Mikhailoh
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If you want trouble, find yourself a redhead
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 12:53 PM

Zero tolerance policy time. You want to be accepted in a civilized society? Get civil. Do it now.
Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead - Lucille Ball
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ycul
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Junior Carp
There's little validity to this argument when it's based on such utter tripe as this: "Labour politician and former Foreign Secretary Jack Straw, with 25,000 Muslims in his constituency, has suddenly come out and insisted Muslim women remove their veils when they talk to him."

He's done no such thing as "insist" that women remove their veils. He has opened a much welcomed debate about the problems of communicating with Muslim women wearing veils by saying: "Now, I always ensure that a female member of my staff is with me. I explain that this is a country built on freedoms. I defend absolutely the right of any woman to wear a headscarf. As for the full veil, wearing it breaks no laws.

"I go on to say that I think, however, that the conversation would be of greater value if the lady took the covering from her face."

The rest of it is full of quotes from right wing whackos too.
:rolleyes:
How now, brown cow.
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Frank_W
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Resident Misanthrope
Mikhailoh
Oct 20 2006, 09:51 AM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 12:53 PM

Zero tolerance policy time. You want to be accepted in a civilized society? Get civil. Do it now.

Bingo! :thumb: :yesgrin:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:15 AM
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 12:38 PM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:15 AM
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?

No, you don't.

The Klu Klux Klan may not rally in any assembly, with their facial features disguised (masked, covered).

Didn't know that one, didya?... :P
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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John D'Oh
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MAMIL
Why make the veil illegal? I know it's a silly costume, but so are lots of things. THe people who wear veils generally aren't the ones blowing up buildings and what-not.

It struck me that the writer of the article didn't really know Britain very well. He sounded like a tourist with all that hogwash about Windsor Castle.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:41 AM
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 12:38 PM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:15 AM
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?

No, you don't.

The Klu Klux Klan may not rally in any assembly, with their facial features disguised (masked, covered).

Didn't know that one, didya?... :P

Is that a local law? What if I'm not in the Klan and not at a rally?

Would wearing a groucho mask in public be a criminal offense? Posted Image
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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AlbertaCrude
Bull-Carp
kentcouncil
Oct 20 2006, 09:50 AM
Europe's response to Muslim violence has thus far been extremely tame, even after the Madrid and London bombings, but I wonder what will happen when the Muslims currently living in Western Europe finally go too far.


Western Europe may need some sound advice....

Mr. Putin's response has been appropriate. After Beslan, Russia's 24 odd million Muslims know exactly where they stand and what the consequences are if they get out of line.

As for the veils, they learned to live without them during Uncle Joe's tenure.
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 01:01 PM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:41 AM
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 12:38 PM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:15 AM
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?

No, you don't.

The Klu Klux Klan may not rally in any assembly, with their facial features disguised (masked, covered).

Didn't know that one, didya?... :P

Is that a local law? What if I'm not in the Klan and not at a rally?

Would wearing a groucho mask in public be a criminal offense? Posted Image

Federal, enforced by the FBI.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Jolly
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Geaux Tigers!
John D'Oh
Oct 20 2006, 12:53 PM
Why make the veil illegal? I know it's a silly costume, but so are lots of things. THe people who wear veils generally aren't the ones blowing up buildings and what-not.

It struck me that the writer of the article didn't really know Britain very well. He sounded like a tourist with all that hogwash about Windsor Castle.

If I understand correctly, Britian proabbly has more camera-ed streets and more computer technology applied to those images than almost anywhere else in the world.

Hard to recognize what you can't see.
The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros
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Mark
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HOLY CARP!!!
They have to go.

They are potential disguises.

They can wear a scarf. If you don't like the fact that we demand to see your face then leave.
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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
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Phlebas
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Bull-Carp
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 10:41 AM

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?

No, you don't.

[/QUOTE]
I guess it's on to "Plan B" for the halloween party.
:leaving:
Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML

The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D


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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Mark
Oct 20 2006, 12:46 PM
They have to go.

They are potential disguises.

They can wear a scarf. If you don't like the fact that we demand to see your face then leave.


That does not sound like a particularly libertarian view, Mark.

If wearing the burnoose or burqa is construed as a legitimate religious expression (and it does have a significantly ancient pedigree) I can see a prohibition clashing head long into our contemporary interpretation of separation of church and state.

But hey, I don't write the laws.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 10:41 AM
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 12:38 PM
Jolly
Oct 20 2006, 11:15 AM
Wearing a veil should be against the law. If not, your laws need to change immediately. The veil makes as much sense as allowing the general public to wear Klan masks in public. They need to go.

To do otherwise is imbecilic.

But we do have the right to wear Klan masks in public, don't we?

No, you don't.

The Klu Klux Klan may not rally in any assembly, with their facial features disguised (masked, covered).

Didn't know that one, didya?... :P

While searching for the law that says the KKK must ride without covered faces, I found the following on a certain special website. Enjoy:

Quote:
 
Since its inception, the Jew has been the bane of all existence. It acts to destroy any and all faiths and races until there is nothing more than a nondescript mass that is dependant on its brackish blood. The Jew seeks to destroy all other forms of identity while maintaining its own. Whereas the ice that covered our land is pure and clear, the soul of the Jew is clouded and muddled. Therefore, he seeks not to remove the stain of corruption from himself but to further it in the souls around him so that he will not be lonely in a state of dishonesty and an utter lack of honor. Where we created cities, he created plagues. Where we divined art, he sowed famine, and where we sought strength, he sought disharmony. He wishes nothing more than to see the groups of races who he despises and envies wallow in the mud of his ill-fated views, and to lose our identity while he maintains his own and thus climbs over the backs of our brothers to lift himself to a position of ill-gotten fame. His desire is nothing more than to see his betters kneel down in fealty in the fane of degeneracy. For every time we defile ourselves it only lowers us to the level of the obsequent, sycophantic serf so that he may worship himself in false majesty.


Where Satan is just one of the boys

As for the law against the KKK wearing masks, New York has one which was upheld a couple of years ago: NY Law Journal
Posted Image
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
I never knew about the anti mask laws -- thanks for the link. I think it makes a great deal of sense in terms of social order, but also think that it shows the weirdness of our present understanding of personal freedom vs state's power (always at the heart of debates about jurisprudence).
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Quote:
 
the weirdness of our present understanding of personal freedom vs state's power

As the judge says, this is balancing the right to free speech with the necessity of keeping the peace. It seems like a pretty good trade-off to me. March all you want, but we need to know who you are. What do you think is weird?
Posted Image
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Wonder how quickly anti mask at public rally laws would be overturned if directed against the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence?

Posted Image

That's what I think is weird.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Mark
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HOLY CARP!!!
ivorythumper
Oct 20 2006, 02:51 PM
Mark
Oct 20 2006, 12:46 PM
They have to go.

They are potential disguises.

They can wear a scarf. If you don't like the fact that we demand to see your face then leave.


That does not sound like a particularly libertarian view, Mark.

If wearing the burnoose or burqa is construed as a legitimate religious expression (and it does have a significantly ancient pedigree) I can see a prohibition clashing head long into our contemporary interpretation of separation of church and state.

But hey, I don't write the laws.

I am not a fundamentalist libertarian Ivory. :P

What would you do if a person ran around in a "traditional" burglars' mask?

So, are we going to have a massive and continuous masquerade party for society at large?

I say that if you have to hide your face when you are in public and the weather is not below zero degrees Fahrenheit, (-17.778 celsius) then you are hiding something and up to no good.

The burnoose or burqa or anything like them represent repression of the female of our species. They should be outlawed. Just as slavery was outlawed.

Having an excuse that it is allowed because it is a religious practice is ludicrous.

You know how much importance religions have with me anyway.

I don't care about their beliefs about showing one's face in public. I don't care about the beliefs of the people who think female castration is acceptable. It is wrong. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind about that.

Show us your face or get the hell out of the country!

___.___
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o 0
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!

Convict 1: "Whatcha in for?"

Convict 2: "Wearing a groucho mask in public"

Posted Image

Seems to be a weird law, esp at the Federal level.

if someone ran around in a traditional burgler's mask, I think we should keep an eye on them -- but arrest them? No.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Mark
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HOLY CARP!!!
OK.

I will agree with that.

Keep an eye on those people wearing burqas!

___.___
(_]===*
o 0
When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Amen.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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George K
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Finally
Police to avoid Ramadan arrests

Police in Manchester have been told not to arrest Muslims wanted on warrants at prayer times during Ramadan.

Greater Manchester Police confirmed it had asked detectives not to make planned arrests during those periods for reasons of religious sensitivity.

The advice was emailed out to officers working in Moss Side, Hulme, Whalley Range, Rusholme, Fallowfield, Ardwick, Longsight, Gorton and Levenshulme.

Police said it was not a blanket ban, just a "request for sensitivity".

The email stressed the order did not apply to on-the-spot arrests, only the execution of arrest warrants.

The holy month of Ramadan began on 22 September and is due to end with the festival of Eid-ul-Fitr next week.

The internal email was sent to staff listing the prayer times, but confusion arose and a second memo was sent clarifying it was not a total ban on arresting Muslims at these times.

A GMP statement said: "The primary objective of Greater Manchester Police is to fight crime and protect people.

"The month of Ramadan is an important time of the year for members of the Muslim community throughout the world.

"It is important that normal, planned policing activities and operations are maintained, while ensuring that officers are professional and respectful to members of the community while going about their duties."

Liberal Democrat councillor Simon Ashley, who represents the city's Gorton South ward and leads the party on Manchester City Council, said: "This sounds odd but we would need to find out what impact rescheduling arrests had on police operations.

"The police's first job is to police.

"I understand they have a difficult task to do and need to do it sensitively, especially within minority communities, but that can't stop them policing serious crimes."
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