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Why the Islamic Terrorists Hate the USA?; "who we are" or "our foreign policy?
Topic Started: Oct 13 2006, 02:41 AM (2,047 Views)
mmmaestro007
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kentcouncil
Oct 17 2006, 01:11 AM
mmmaestro007
Oct 15 2006, 07:07 PM



Quote:
 
we need to know  why Islamic clerics preach death and destruction-it's not with Islam itself


You are suffering from cognitive dissociation. In the first part of your statement, you state one thing, and in the second part, you attempt to deny it. It IS Islamic clerics, isn't it?
Quote:
 


i'm talking about the radical clerics - i do not beleive all Islamic clerics preach terrorism
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

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kentcouncil
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mmmaestro007
Oct 17 2006, 04:28 AM
i'm talking about the radical clerics - i do not beleive all Islamic clerics preach terrorism

The fact that you meant "radical" clerics does not change my assertion that what they preach is integral to Islam itself.

As for the other "non-radical" clerics... while they may not actively exhort their audiences to terrorism, why do they NOT preach AGAINST terrorism? Why do they not comdemn their more extremist brethren? Because the Koran and the hadith proscribe contempt for non-believers, and advocate jihad against them.

There's a reason why we're talking about ISLAMIC terrorists in this thread, and not Buddhist, Shinto, Quaker, or Wiccan terrorists. To attempt to divorce the religion from the terrorists who adhere to it smacks of either over-tolerance or wishful thinking, and cannot help but lead one to erroneous conclusions.
It was a confusion of ideas between him and one of the lions he was hunting in Kenya that had caused A. B. Spottsworth to make the obituary column. He thought the lion was dead, and the lion thought it wasn't.

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mmmaestro007
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kentcouncil
Oct 18 2006, 11:31 AM
mmmaestro007
Oct 17 2006, 04:28 AM
i'm talking about the radical clerics - i do not beleive all Islamic clerics preach terrorism

The fact that you meant "radical" clerics does not change my assertion that what they preach is integral to Islam itself.

As for the other "non-radical" clerics... while they may not actively exhort their audiences to terrorism, why do they NOT preach AGAINST terrorism? Why do they not comdemn their more extremist brethren? Because the Koran and the hadith proscribe contempt for non-believers, and advocate jihad against them.

There's a reason why we're talking about ISLAMIC terrorists in this thread, and not Buddhist, Shinto, Quaker, or Wiccan terrorists. To attempt to divorce the religion from the terrorists who adhere to it smacks of either over-tolerance or wishful thinking, and cannot help but lead one to erroneous conclusions.

"As for the other "non-radical" clerics... while they may not actively exhort their audiences to terrorism, why do they NOT preach AGAINST terrorism?"

a good point and i believe they should but once again i believe we need to identify the underlying causes- they feel they are being oppressed and threatened politically,in economic, religious and social terms.
i think they also view Western civilisation as decadent and basically going down the gurgler in terms of humanity
i don't profess to know the solution but not occupying their lands would be a step in the right direction IMO
there are theories abound that suicide bombers cannot exist without support groups be they Clerics, family members etc and these support groups are created by oppression eg. prisoners held in Guat. Bay. invasion of Iraq?
having said that, i don't believe their woes are entirely caused by the West, they have bones to pick with their own leaders too
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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kentcouncil
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mmmaestro007
Oct 18 2006, 04:51 AM
a good point and i believe they should but once again i believe we need to identify the underlying causes- they feel they are being oppressed and threatened politically,in economic, religious and social terms.

Why do you insist on believing there are any underlying causes besides religion? Why are you so unwilling to accept that religion is a sufficient cause? The Islamic extremists are telling us as much; why should we not take them at their word? You are approaching this from the mindset of one accustomed to living in a liberal Western democracy, and you feel that for Islamic terrorists to act the way they do, they MUST be responding to something that we did to them, and that is their true motivation. Why don't they just tell us this, then? Why aren't they trying to engage us in diplomatic efforts to address their grievances, haul us before the World Court for our crimes against them, demanding monetary reparations for their losses? The answer is, of course, that they aren't seeking political, economic, or social redress. They are seeking to fulfill the dictates of their religion, which preaches the conquest and extermination of the infidel.
It was a confusion of ideas between him and one of the lions he was hunting in Kenya that had caused A. B. Spottsworth to make the obituary column. He thought the lion was dead, and the lion thought it wasn't.

- P.G. Wodehouse
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mmmaestro007
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kentcouncil
Oct 19 2006, 06:40 AM
mmmaestro007
Oct 18 2006, 04:51 AM
 

Why do you insist on believing there are any underlying causes besides religion? Why are you so unwilling to accept that religion is a sufficient cause? The Islamic extremists are telling us as much; why should we not take them at their word? You are approaching this from the mindset of one accustomed to living in a liberal Western democracy, and you feel that for Islamic terrorists to act the way they do, they MUST be responding to something that we did to them, and that is their true motivation. Why don't they just tell us this, then? Why aren't they trying to engage us in diplomatic efforts to address their grievances, haul us before the World Court for our crimes against them, demanding monetary reparations for their losses? The answer is, of course, that they aren't seeking political, economic, or social redress. They are seeking to fulfill the dictates of their religion, which preaches the conquest and extermination of the infidel.

" Why are you so unwilling to accept that religion is a sufficient cause?"

'sufficient cause'- do you mean 'excuse' to invade Iraq, occupy their lands and control the oil price

your quote-

"and you feel that for Islamic terrorists to act the way they do, they MUST be responding to something that we did to them, and that is their true motivation."

the escalation of terrorist activity in Western countries co-inciding with the above issues-alarm bells should be ringing!



" Why don't they just tell us this, then? Why aren't they trying to engage us in diplomatic efforts to address their grievances"


who is to say they haven't - how often do you tune into Al Jazeera?- how many diplomatic briefs have you witnessed recently?-just because it's not on the six o'clock news we have no idea!

"haul us before the World Court for our crimes against them, demanding monetary reparations for their losses? The answer is, of course, that they aren't seeking political, economic, or social redress. "


don't forget they need the West to buy their oil-they don't have much else in exports and if the oil price goes too high, this will make alternative technologies more viable and more attractive and therefore we have them over the barrel(no pun intended) and hence they fight back in the only way they can

their leaders should accept responsibility for much of their citizens plight but why would they do that when they can simply blame the West!
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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Luke's Dad
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I think Dummmbass just got owned by KC in that exchange.
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AlbertaCrude
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mmmaestro007
Oct 19 2006, 02:15 AM

don't forget they need the West to buy their oil-they don't have much else in exports and if the oil price goes too high, this will make alternative technologies more viable and  more attractive and therefore we have them over the barrel(no pun intended) and hence they fight back in the only way they can


So in otherwords if future technology enables us to produce or buy cheaper energy from alternative sources, we, the customer, must be undermined and annihilated so that the Arab oil producers will have a market for their only source of income? That is not only a preposterous statement, it is ridiculous and utterly vacuous.
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Mikhailoh
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I agree, AC. That is the stupidest thing I have ever read on here. Bar none. You could tell me Bush is controlled by pixies and it would make more sense.
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Larry
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Frank_W
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mmmaestro007
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AlbertaCrude
Oct 20 2006, 12:43 AM
mmmaestro007
Oct 19 2006, 02:15 AM

don't forget they need the West to buy their oil-they don't have much else in exports and if the oil price goes too high, this will make alternative technologies more viable and  more attractive and therefore we have them over the barrel(no pun intended) and hence they fight back in the only way they can


So in otherwords if future technology enables us to produce or buy cheaper energy from alternative sources, we, the customer, must be undermined and annihilated so that the Arab oil producers will have a market for their only source of income? That is not only a preposterous statement, it is ridiculous and utterly vacuous.

oh, here we go again!-does your government receive revenue when you fill your tank?
how many people does your oil industry employ?
what industry are W's business interests in?
why do oil companies make donations to political parties?
what happens to the economy when the price of oil rises?

in conclusion, what would the effect be if we used the sun's ray's for all our energy needs?


"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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AlbertaCrude
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I think you suffer from self induced sleep deprivation partly owing to a growing awareness that your arguments really don't make much sense to anyone other than yourself.

Isn't it bedtime in Australia or have you not yet had your morning coffee?
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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
mmmaestro007
Oct 19 2006, 01:17 PM


in conclusion, what would the effect be if we used the sun's ray's for all our energy needs?

This is a side comment, but it's important to note that right now our solar energy technology is incapable of completely replacing fossil fuels as our main source of energy. Very few technologies are up to the task, but solar is definitely in the rear. So really, energy companies don't really have to work on undermining these efforts, which is what I think you're suggesting, because any effort to fully replace fossil fuels with alternative energy before 2050 is ridiculous.
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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George K
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Finally
mmmaestro007
Oct 19 2006, 04:17 PM
in conclusion, what would the effect be if we used the sun's ray's for all our energy needs?

The effect would be that there would not be enough room for people to live.

EPCOT, a theme park with a solar energy ride, consumes about 395 000 kilowatt-hours per day. The Department of Energy says you'd need around a thousand acres of solar panels to generate that much electricity. EPCOT itself sits on only three hundred acres, so you'd have to triple the size of the park just to operate it!

Got some real estate you want to sell?
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Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

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AlbertaCrude
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As an aside, solar panels currently present serious problems with regard to after life disposal. They contain fairly high quantities of heavy metal and chemical toxins to warrant prohibitively high cost recovery/recycle or containment in a class I industrial hazardous waste landfill.

Just little fact the green crusaders fail to mention as they champion their pet eco-cause.

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Aqua Letifer
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ZOOOOOM!
Quote:
 
Just little fact the green crusaders fail to mention as they champion their pet eco-cause.


Only the ill-informed ones, AC. :wink:
I cite irreconcilable differences.
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AlbertaCrude
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You and I don't count since we're both in the biz.
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TomK
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AlbertaCrude
Oct 19 2006, 05:42 PM
As an aside, solar panels currently present serious problems with regard to after life disposal.

Alas--most of the green crusaders don't believe in an afterlife. :lol:
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George K
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TomK
Oct 19 2006, 05:05 PM
Alas--most of the green crusaders don't believe in an afterlife. :lol:

They are clearly deluded:

Posted Image
A guide to GKSR: Click

"Now look here, you Baltic gas passer... "
- Mik, 6/14/08


Nothing is as effective as homeopathy.

I'd rather listen to an hour of Abba than an hour of The Beatles.
- Klaus, 4/29/18
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AlbertaCrude
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:lol: Reduce, Reuse, Recycle
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mmmaestro007
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Luke's Dad
Oct 19 2006, 11:14 PM
I think Dummmbass just got owned by KC in that exchange.

care to elaborate?
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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mmmaestro007
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Middle Aged Carp
Aqua Letifer
Oct 20 2006, 06:57 AM
mmmaestro007
Oct 19 2006, 01:17 PM


in conclusion, what would the effect be if we used the sun's ray's for all our energy needs?

This is a side comment, but it's important to note that right now our solar energy technology is incapable of completely replacing fossil fuels as our main source of energy. Very few technologies are up to the task, but solar is definitely in the rear. So really, energy companies don't really have to work on undermining these efforts, which is what I think you're suggesting, because any effort to fully replace fossil fuels with alternative energy before 2050 is ridiculous.

well at least now some of are using our little grey cells!

unless we pour a lot of money into quickly developing new technologies we will lose the race


YOUR QUOTE
"So really, energy companies don't really have to work on undermining these efforts, which is what I think you're suggesting, because any effort to fully replace fossil fuels with alternative energy before 2050 is ridiculous."

I'm not suggesting energy companies are undermining anything because at this stage, as you suggest, there is no viable alternative however there is expected to be a big breakthrough within a few years in solar technology

there is also a technology called 'DYESOL' which is a sort of window tint which can convert the sun's rays to electricity so every window in the world could be covered with this tint
the last thing we want to think is 'any effort to fully replace fossil fuels with alternative energy before 2050 is ridiculous' otherwise we're doomed
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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mmmaestro007
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Middle Aged Carp
AlbertaCrude
Oct 20 2006, 07:12 AM
As an aside, solar panels currently present serious problems with regard to after life disposal. They contain fairly high quantities of heavy metal and chemical toxins to warrant prohibitively high cost recovery/recycle or containment in a class I industrial hazardous waste landfill.

Just  little fact the green crusaders fail to mention as they champion their pet eco-cause.

and what does the burning of fossil fuels do to the environment?
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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mmmaestro007
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Aqua Letifer
Oct 20 2006, 07:15 AM
Quote:
 
Just little fact the green crusaders fail to mention as they champion their pet eco-cause.


Only the ill-informed ones, AC. :wink:

yeah! let's destroy the planet!
"Madam, you have between your legs an instrument capable of giving pleasure to thousands, and all you can do is scratch it!"

Sir Thomas Beechem, conductor
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Frank_W
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mmmaestro007
Oct 20 2006, 02:36 AM
yeah! let's destroy the planet!

:thumb: COOL!!! LET'S DO IT!!! :devilgrin:
Anatomy Prof: "The human body has about 20 sq. meters of skin."
Me: "Man, that's a lot of lampshades!"
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