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| Ann Coulter's Version of the Truth | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 9 2006, 08:33 PM (1,354 Views) | |
| David Burton | Aug 10 2006, 07:31 AM Post #26 |
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Senior Carp
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Only an analogy mind you, but what do we REALLY think of much the Left thinks? Let's hope that thoughts at least are remediable. |
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| Jolly | Aug 10 2006, 07:41 AM Post #27 |
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Geaux Tigers!
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True, but every now and then she chunks out some red meat. Thought this snippet was particularly interesting:
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| The main obstacle to a stable and just world order is the United States.- George Soros | |
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| Aqua Letifer | Aug 10 2006, 07:45 AM Post #28 |
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ZOOOOOM!
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Jolly, she didn't cite her sources, so based on what I know of her fact-fumbling, I can't assume those are correct figures, and her conclusions based on these "facts" are nothing more than ridiculous. |
| I cite irreconcilable differences. | |
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| AlbertaCrude | Aug 10 2006, 07:46 AM Post #29 |
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Bull-Carp
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Coulter insisted, despite historical facts to the contrary, that Canada did not send troops to the Korean War. In all over 26,000 Canadian Forces personnel were deployed in United Nations Operations, Korea, 1950-1953 as follows: Royal Canadian Navy (RCN) HMCS Athabaskan HMCS Cayuga HMCS Sioux HMCS Nootka HMCS Huron HMCS Iroquois HMCS Crusader HMCS Haida Canadian Army Lord Strathcona's Horse (Royal Canadians) 2nd Field Regiment, Royal Canadian Horse Artillery (RCHA) 1st Regiment, Royal Canadian Horse Artillery (RCHA) 81st Field Regiment, Royal Canadian Artillery (RCA) The Corps of Royal Canadian Engineers (RCE) The Royal Canadian Corps of Signals The Royal Canadian Regiment (RCR) 2nd Battalion 1st Battalion 3rd Battalion Princess Patricia's Canadian Light Infantry (PPCLI) 2nd Battalion 1st Battalion 3rd Battalion Royal 22e Régiment (R22eR) 2nd Battalion 1st Battalion 3rd Battalion The Royal Canadian Army Service Corps (RCASC) The Royal Canadian Army Medical Corps (RCAMC) The Royal Canadian Dental Corps Royal Canadian Ordnance Corps The Corps of Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers (RCEME) Royal Canadian Army Pay Corps The Royal Canadian Postal Corps The Royal Canadian Army Chaplain Corps The Canadian Provost Corps Canadian Intelligence Corps Royal Canadian Air Force (RCAF) No. 426 (Thunderbird Squadron) (in addition, 22 RCAF pilots flew with the U.S. Fifth Air Force) source: Veterans Affairs Canada Ann Coutler is little more than a clever and brash cariacture of what the world has termed "the ugly American". She makes good money spewing brash insults. In a few years she will be completely forgotten. |
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| Larry | Aug 10 2006, 07:48 AM Post #30 |
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
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You've decided she "fumbles the facts", where's your proof of that? And yet you're willing to dismiss what she has to say without having solid sources to back up your decision? |
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Of the Pokatwat Tribe | |
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| Aqua Letifer | Aug 10 2006, 07:52 AM Post #31 |
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ZOOOOOM!
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I'm saying I don't know either way. She may have fumbled the facts in this particular case, and she may not. But since we do know she has done so in the past, it is possible she is wrong in this instance as well. I'm just saying I can't take them as fact. As for her conclusions based on these numbers...
I can't give statements like that any kind of credibility. |
| I cite irreconcilable differences. | |
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| Larry | Aug 10 2006, 07:55 AM Post #32 |
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
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No, *you* are confusing your dislike for her with rational thought. I know the difference between loud and smart. Coulter is extremely intelligent, loudness has nothing to do with it. 99% of the time she has her facts straight, as good a track record as anyone else you care to examine. And I think she adds a *lot* to the discussion - in fact, she's taken many subjects the left try their best to keep from being discussed and brought them out into the public eye for discussion. |
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Of the Pokatwat Tribe | |
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| Kincaid | Aug 10 2006, 08:20 AM Post #33 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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That she does. And thanks AC for completing my fuzzy recollection. |
| Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006. | |
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| Larry | Aug 10 2006, 08:37 AM Post #34 |
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Mmmmmmm, pie!
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Why not? It dead on accurate. Show me a democrat willing to fight the terrorists. I believe you only had two - Lieberman, who just got Borked for daring to do so, and Hillary, who saw Lieberman get Borked and switched to tote the party line, which is "cut and run". Show me *any* democrat who says he or she wants to fight terrorists. And don't give me one of those idiots who say things like "I'll fight a *better* war" without actually saying how. |
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Of the Pokatwat Tribe | |
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| Phlebas | Aug 10 2006, 08:37 AM Post #35 |
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Bull-Carp
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If I said Michael Moore brings up subjects the right tries there best to keep from being discussed, and that he was intelligent, that would say a lot about me. Anne Coulter is exactly the same, and does exactly the same things - poor research, lying, etc. |
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Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D | |
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| Christopher T | Aug 10 2006, 08:42 AM Post #36 |
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Junior Carp
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*their best Sorry, grammar freak here. |
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| Kincaid | Aug 10 2006, 08:45 AM Post #37 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Just an example of Phlebas' poor research and lies!
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| Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006. | |
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| Phlebas | Aug 10 2006, 08:49 AM Post #38 |
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Bull-Carp
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Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D | |
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| Luke's Dad | Aug 10 2006, 08:53 AM Post #39 |
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Emperor Pengin
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Yeah, but she has nicer legs. |
| The problem with having an open mind is that people keep trying to put things in it. | |
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| Phlebas | Aug 10 2006, 08:56 AM Post #40 |
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Bull-Carp
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And more testosterone in her little finger than MM has in his entire corpulet body. Seriously, I think AC had a sex change - check out the size of her hands, and that addam's apple. |
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Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D | |
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| QuirtEvans | Aug 10 2006, 09:45 AM Post #41 |
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
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Taking a story about sex ed for college students, and spinning it on its head to be about sex ed for kindergarteners, is telling the truth? That's an awfully strange looking glass you're using. |
| It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010. | |
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| AlbertaCrude | Aug 10 2006, 10:53 AM Post #42 |
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Bull-Carp
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| David Burton | Aug 10 2006, 11:20 AM Post #43 |
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Senior Carp
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Maybe these help the discussion: In China; http://sayanythingblog.com/2004/07/19/kindergarten_sexed/ In California; http://www.freedom21santacruz.net/site/article.php?sid=63 In America widely; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.f...QuerySuggestion http://life.familyeducation.com/sex/teen/36172.html Sex ed in kindergarten is not such a far fetched idea. It's been going on. Now, so what or what? |
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| QuirtEvans | Aug 10 2006, 11:37 AM Post #44 |
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
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Coulter's quote, which I quoted above, was about teaching anal sex, fisting, and some other fairly "out there" practices to kindergarteners. And her source for that was a 20 year-old story about college students. She can't be trusted to get her facts right. Anything she says needs to be examined with a microscope. |
| It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010. | |
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| justme | Aug 10 2006, 11:43 AM Post #45 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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I think that can be said for most fanatics whether they're on the right or the left. |
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"Men sway more towards hussies." G-D3 | |
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| ivorythumper | Aug 10 2006, 11:55 AM Post #46 |
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
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A few mistatements here and there are not why her "facts" would be checked with a microscope. |
| The dogma lives loudly within me. | |
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| Daniel\ | Aug 10 2006, 11:59 AM Post #47 |
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Fulla-Carp
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It's not her scholarship in question BECAUSE THERE IS NO QUESTION SHE IS NOT A SCHOLAR as much as how publishing houses have descended to the point of having no editorial standards- and giving talking points as responses MAKING MILLIONS. Let me get this straight. Ann Coulter said that liberals are godless as evidenced by the fact that they are teaching children about fisting talking about a 20 year old story and Dartmouth College, mixing fear mongering about religion with hate mongering about gays with a political smear campaign against liberals? Random House dismissed the questions put to it and noted that there were pages of footnotes? Ann Coulter is actually good at what she does but Random House is a joke. |
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| Kincaid | Aug 10 2006, 01:38 PM Post #48 |
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HOLY CARP!!!
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Is there more that you can post or link on this? I mean, the full text. I just am not sure that what you posted accurately reflects what Coulter was trying to convey. If the authors misconstrued something, then the entire thread is pointless. |
| Kincaid - disgusted Republican Partisan since 2006. | |
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| QuirtEvans | Aug 10 2006, 01:44 PM Post #49 |
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I Owe It All To John D'Oh
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The link that I posted earlier has a link to the full Media Matters report, Kincaid. It was, understandably, somewhat slow today, lots of people trying to take a look. |
| It would be unwise to underestimate what large groups of ill-informed people acting together can achieve. -- John D'Oh, January 14, 2010. | |
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| Phlebas | Aug 10 2006, 01:47 PM Post #50 |
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Bull-Carp
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If it helps, here's the 1987 NY Times article [response to your snarky comment before](how's that for doing research :silly:[/response to your snarky comment before] Survey of Education Desk; 12 At Dartmouth, A Helping Candor By Thomas Morgan; Thomas Morgan is a reporter on the metropolitan staff of The New York Times. 2362 words 8 November 1987 The New York Times Late City Final Edition English Copyright 1987 The New York Times Company. All Rights Reserved. DURING registration at Dartmouth College, students can pick up forms, course material and a sex-education packet containing a condom, a dental dam for oral sex, and an explicit pamphlet explaining how to have safer sex in the era of AIDS. When they go to the library they can also get a condom when they check out a book. DURING registration at Dartmouth College, students can pick up forms, course material and a sex-education packet containing a condom, a dental dam for oral sex, and an explicit pamphlet explaining how to have safer sex in the era of AIDS. When they go to the library they can also get a condom when they check out a book. In small, informal gatherings marked by light-hearted humor in fraternities, sororities and all-coed dormitories, student team leaders trained by the college health center discuss abstinence as well as the use of various contraceptives, which are available at cost on campus. At the center of Dartmouth's aggressive effort to include sex education along with health education is feisty 36-year-old Dr. Beverlie Conant Sloane. As director of health education at the college health service she has worked to demystify sexuality and affect student behavior positively by setting up peer-education sessions in which students teach each other about contraception; integrating sex education into the liberal arts curriculum, and advising students individually and lecturing at other campuses. Dr. Conant Sloane is part of a growing trend to broaden public health on campus, particularly as schools move further away from traditional roles as parents in absentia and toward encouraging students, as adults, to make their own decisions. ''Many students at Dartmouth know about contraceptives, have them and don't use them,'' said Dr. Conant Sloane, who has a doctorate in social science from Syracuse University. ''Some of them think they are invulnerable. Some of them think they are not susceptible to getting AIDS at a time when the Centers for Disease Control is predicting that AIDS will be the number one killer on campus by 1991. ''Society is sending mixed messages: wear musk perfume and guys are going to go after you,'' said Dr. Conant Sloane. ''On television or in the movies, people have sex and no one talks about contraceptives or responsible behavior. Meanwhile, society is telling young people to wait until marriage to have sex. We have to deal with the biological realities and help people make responsible decisions.'' Dartmouth's forums on contraceptive methods and the distribution of its so-called ''safe sex kit'' and contraceptives have generated controversy. Both Dr. Conant Sloane and the college have received vehement criticism from conservative students, a few parents and alumni, all of whom complain that the sex education programs do little to stress moral values and may encourage students to have sex. Though Dr. Conant Sloane agrees that abstinence should be mentioned as an option, she disagrees with critics about the weight it should have in discussions with students. ''I say that abstinence is definitely a choice, but it's weighed equally with everything else,'' she said. ''I'm willing to discuss morals, but my job is not to teach one right value system. Parents and churches teach moral values. My job is to say, 'These are the facts,' and to help the students, as adults, decide what is right for them.'' At the same time, other students, parents and colleagues elsewhere in health education have praised Dr. Conant Sloane. Her aggressive stand on sex education, her published work in public health and behavioral science and her research on such issues as rural health care in Kenya and emergency health care in urban centers, have made her a leader in the public-health field. This year Dr. Conant Sloane won an award from the Educational Press Association for her 64-page book, ''Partners in Health,'' a widely respected publication for college students that deals with sexuality, contraceptives and reproductive-health issues. Students and colleagues say some of her success in winning support for such public-health issues comes from her intensely personal style. Despite her five-foot frame, Dr. Conant Sloane is a mountain of energy, especially when discussing public health, the needs of college students today and what she says is society's age-old inability to talk openly and honestly about sex. AT A recent meeting in her office with a small group of students who wanted to start a program of AIDS education in dormitories and fraternities, she was anything but professorial. With one leg tucked beneath her in an overstuffed wing chair, she leaned forward touching students' hands or arms engagingly while making points about ways to educate other students. ''How do you feel about saying the words vagina or penis?'' she asked. Several students shifted in their seats. ''Language is very important in teaching others,'' she said. ''I'm going to teach you how to use anatomical words in positive ways. If you are teaching about AIDS and you are uncomfortable about using certain words, like anal, your feelings will be communicated.'' Her gaze, clear and direct, darted from one student to another to see if her words registered. ''She has a terrific blend of chutzpah and compassion that make her very effective,'' observed Dr. Doryn Davis Chervin, a project director at the Education Development Center in Newton, Mass., and a former associate director of student health at Stanford University. ''She connects with people.'' Dr. Conant Sloane says she has been influenced by the works of Margaret Sanger, a pioneer in the birth-control movement in this country, and Margaret Mead, the anthropologist and author of ''Coming of Age in Samoa.'' But much of Dr. Conant Sloane's attitudes about sex education and public health in general reflect some of her earlier experiences at Middlebury College in Vermont, where she received a bachelor of arts degree in history in 1973. As a student there, she helped set up seminars on contraception after several students became pregnant. ''We were trying to help our friends find safe abortions,'' she said. ''Then we began to initiate the sex-education road shows, taking them to dormitories, to try to prevent unwanted pregnancies. The school was against what we were doing, and they called my parents, who supported me. I think abortions are upsetting. It's a bad situation. But I do believe in people having choices.'' Dr. Conant Sloane, who is from Weston, Mass., said that from her experiences at Middlebury College she developed an interest in women's health issues, particularly childbirth and contraception education. But her research and professional work experience since her days at Middlebury broadened to include public-health issues in general. For example, while she was a research assistant at Syracuse University, she studied male and female circumcision, childbirth practices and rural health-care delivery among the Masai and Okiek in Kenya. Dr. Conant Sloane studied the side effects of stress on elderly people at Syracuse University's Gerontology Center and prison health care in New York State for the Family Medicine Program at the University of Rochester. With her husband, David, a social historian at Dartmouth who is on leave to write a book about the history of American cemeteries, she has taught classes on the history of medicine at the college's medical school. The couple have no children. Dr. Conant Sloane holds dear the value of self-esteem, especially in regard to personal well-being. ''My parents taught me values - they don't believe in sex before marriage - and problem solving,'' Dr. Conant Sloane said. ''They taught me to set my own limits. They didn't say be home at 10 P.M., but when are you coming home.'' As a youngster asking about the process of birth, she found her parents open and frank. ''Teaching children to feel good about their bodies and sex education can start as soon as a child learns body parts,'' Dr. Conant Sloane said. ''There are wonderful sex-education books for children today. When a child asks a question about sex, choose an answer you are comfortable with, answer the immediate question, then wait for the next question.'' For teens and young adults discovering their own sexuality, she recommends such books as ''Sex Roles and Personal Awareness,'' by Barbara Lusk Forisha; ''Sexual Unfolding,'' by Lorna Sarrel and Philip Sarrel, and ''Taking Chances,'' by Christin Luker. ''Anything by Sol Gorden, at the Family Life Institute at Syracuse University, is good,'' she says. Uncomfortable Feelings At the college level, Dr. Conant Sloane finds some students still uncomfortable with talking to others about their feelings regarding sex. Often, she said, they are afraid of rejection, and under the influence of drugs or too much alcohol, they may be susceptible to behavior they might later regret. Meeting with the students who want to begin AIDS seminars, Dr. Conant Sloane listened intently as they described how they learned about sex and what students say about sex, AIDS and sexually transmitted diseases today. Several said they thought students were tired of hearing about AIDS, even though they lacked all the facts. They also said students considered themselves to be in a low-risk group for the disease. James Bramson, 20, a senior studying engineering and physics, said the specter of AIDS had done little to change dating behavior. And Steve Dettelbach, 21, a government major, said most sexual activity on campus occurred in the dormitories. ''There are no curfews and it's a pretty free rein here,'' Mr. Dettelbach said. ''People can get AIDS in a single encounter, and you can pass it on to other people. Students have several relationships during their time here. At Dartmouth, a four-month relationship is a long-term relationship.'' Sarina Schrager, a 21-year-old French major, said: ''In my experience, with my friends, there are a lot of problems with communication. Some women feel insecure. They feel that they have to have sex with a boyfriend if they are going to keep him.'' Neil Friedman, also 21 and a senior majoring in biochemstry, said his parents told him he should know the consequences of having sex, yet he felt uncomfortable hearing the message from them. One sophomore, Walt Shea, a 19-year-old studying math and computer science, told how he first learned about sex: ''One of my parents bought a book about sex and said, 'Here, it's in there.' '' Dartmouth's approach of including sex education as a part of the comprehensive health services reflects a national trend. Today, on many college campuses, health clinics do more than dispense aspirin and give physical examinations. They counsel on alcohol and drug abuse, birth control, nutrition, physical fitness and eating disorders like bulimia and anorexia as a component of aggressive preventive health care. College health professionals are also focusing more on developmental issues like self-esteem and communication. ''Self-esteem is very important in personal health,'' Dr. Conant Sloane said. ''Sometimes, people have bad health habits as a means of self-destruction, or engage in alcohol and other drug abuse because they want to feel high and don't find pleasure in life. They are trying to fill an empty place within. I want to help students see how wonderful they are. My job is to hold a mirror up to them so they can see themselves, to help them explore developmental issues when they say 'I'm too fat,' 'Nobody loves me' or 'I don't have a boyfriend.' '' The trend toward more sex education as a part of a more comprehensive health care has been encouraged by reports from the United States Surgeon General, C. Everett Koop, and the National Academy of Sciences advocating education as the only way to combat the spread of AIDS. Health educators say AIDS has helped draw attention to discussions about other sexually transmitted diseases as well as contraception. ''There has been a real revolution in college health since the mid-1970's,'' said Dr. Davis Chervin, who has initiated similar sex- and health-education programs at Stanford University. ''A lot of us came into college health centers as the only person to promote health education. Now colleges have health departments, which speaks to the role of health education in institutions. Each of the health issues - nutrition, fitness, weight management, for example - require particular approaches.'' ALTHOUGH institutions like Dartmouth, Stanford and the University of Massachusetts at Amherst have been at the forefront of aggressive health education, Dr. Richard Keeling, president-elect of the American College Association, a group of college health professionals, and chairman of its task force on AIDS, said that the organization's recent survey showed that only about 25 percent of the schools surveyed had undertaken AIDS education. ''What that tells us is that there still are a lot of schools that have not gotten involved in doing education programs,'' said Dr. Keeling, who is also director of the health service at the University of Virginia and associate professor of internal medicine there. ''The program that Beverlie and her people put in place caused controversy,'' he said, ''because it was explicit and aggressive and widely available. A lot of colleges doing sex education have been quiet about it, and a lot of colleges that fear controversy are timid about starting AIDS-education programs.'' Dr. Conant Sloane has staked her reputation on shunning approaches restrained by timidity and controversy. ''When we began talking about providing the safer sex packet,'' she said, ''there was some resistance from the campus administration. As college health officials, we had to have a conviction that what we were doing was right and give the facts about the need for AIDS education, which has been supported by the Surgeon General and the National Academy of Sciences. I said we can be on the cutting edge of health education in this country, or fall behind. Either way, we will be criticized.'' |
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Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D | |
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10:41 PM Jul 12