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Mel Gibson apologizes directly to Jews; ...asks for more than forgiveness.
Topic Started: Aug 1 2006, 07:27 AM (2,164 Views)
John D'Oh
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MAMIL
I believe that bringing children in a bigoted and/or racist environment is very akin to child abuse, or more accurately a type of child abuse. Many abusers were themselves abused, and it appears difficult to break the cycle. Does it excuse the behaviour? No, but it does perhaps explain it.

I don't see how Gibson can do any more than he is doing at the moment.
What do you mean "we", have you got a mouse in your pocket?
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Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
Dave Spelvin
Aug 1 2006, 09:29 AM
Quote:
 
I can't imagine anyone expecting any more of him than what he's said...

I agree with you, but what he says now (after consultation with his priest, press agent and conscience) is less important to me than what he said before. Can someone be forgiven? Of course. But he can't unring the bell so easily, in my opinion. Which is the true Mel: the guy who made outrageous statements after a couple of drinks, or the guy who assures us he isn't an antisemite/bigot? Either way, I'm grateful that his idiocy came to light and that the media reported it, even if the police department tried to cover it up (as seems to be the case).

Everyone has demons buried deep within them, sometimes demons they're not even aware of. We can't ever expect anyone to be pure & free of those demons; all we can do is apologize and reconcile when they surface. The cost of forgiveness of and reconciliation with others is the price we pay if we want to be considered human - if we hope to expect the same treatment in return when our own demons, which we're similarly ashamed of, show their faces - and of course, at some point, they always will.

"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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DivaDeb
HOLY CARP!!!
Quote:
 
I don't see how Gibson can do any more than he is doing at the moment.

neither do I John...he's done what needs to be done (as regards the apology, he will need to adress the alcohol problem from now on) but for some it will never be enough. Not everyone is good at forgiveness and there seems to be an ugly tendency in people to take pleasure in pointing out the speck in the other guy's eye.
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
I agree, we all hold ugly things inside.
We are all equal to Mel.
Most of us are more careful with our shadow.

But booze IS truth serum.
Sincere or not this statement is damage control; millions are at stake.
Fame can be a very unfortunate thing.

I don't need to boycott Gibson.
I've never seen any of his work, it's not my thing.
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The 89th Key
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Kenny, you've never seen any of his movies that he's acted or directed?

Mad Max, Braveheart, Patriot, Passion, etc.?

You're missing out, d00d! :D
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
No
Popular commercial movies usually don't interest me.
Sorry.

Go ahead, throw eggs.
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The 89th Key
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I think you might like one or two of his films! If you get bored one night with your lady...you should check them out! :yes:
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
Thanks, maybe I will someday.
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Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
I haven't seen Mad Max (however many of them there were) and several other of his movies. I've seen Braveheart, Patriot, at least two Lethal Weapons, actually more for Joe Pesci than for Gibson ("Okay, okay okay... They always f*ck you at the drive-through! They always f*ck you at the drive through!" :lol: ), and Passion. Kenny, if I were going to pick a Gibson movie for you to see, I'd pick The Patriot. It might surprise you; I think you might like it.
"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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justme
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HOLY CARP!!!
My favorite Mel Gibson movie was The Conspiracy Theory.



"Men sway more towards hussies." G-D3
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Dewey
Aug 1 2006, 11:16 AM
I haven't seen Mad Max (however many of them there were) and several other of his movies. I've seen Braveheart, Patriot, at least two Lethal Weapons, actually more for Joe Pesci than for Gibson ("Okay, okay okay... They always f*ck you at the drive-through! They always f*ck you at the drive through!" :lol: ), and Passion. Kenny, if I were going to pick a Gibson movie for you to see, I'd pick The Patriot. It might surprise you; I think you might like it.

Man Without A Face and Gallipoli :thumb: :thumb:
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Phlebas
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Bull-Carp
Payback was pretty good.

As far as his "non-commercial" movies go - Kenny - you should check out "The Year of Living Dangerously," and "Gallipoli."
Random FML: Today, I was fired by my boss in front of my coworkers. It would have been nice if I could have left the building before they started celebrating. FML

The founding of the bulk of the world's nation states post 1914 is based on self-defined nationalisms. The bulk of those national movements involve territory that was ethnically mixed. The foundation of many of those nation states involved population movements in the aftermath. When the only one that is repeatedly held up as unjust and unjustifiable is the Zionist project, the term anti-semitism may very well be appropriate. - P*D


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ny1911
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Senior Carp
I recommend:

Mad Max
The Bounty
The Man without a Face
Maverick
Ransom
Braveheart
The Patriot
Payback
We Were Soldiers
Signs

So live your life and live it well.
There's not much left of me to tell.
I just got back up each time I fell.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
Funny how this thread is turning into a Mel Gibson Fan Club... :lol:
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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ny1911
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Senior Carp
As I alluded in an earlier thread, I had considered him the closest thing to a role model in Hollywood. And I like a lot of his movies.
So live your life and live it well.
There's not much left of me to tell.
I just got back up each time I fell.
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The 89th Key
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Ditto, NY.
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Dave Spelvin
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Fulla-Carp
Dewey
Aug 1 2006, 09:47 AM
Dave Spelvin
Aug 1 2006, 09:29 AM
Quote:
 
I can't imagine anyone expecting any more of him than what he's said...

I agree with you, but what he says now (after consultation with his priest, press agent and conscience) is less important to me than what he said before. Can someone be forgiven? Of course. But he can't unring the bell so easily, in my opinion. Which is the true Mel: the guy who made outrageous statements after a couple of drinks, or the guy who assures us he isn't an antisemite/bigot? Either way, I'm grateful that his idiocy came to light and that the media reported it, even if the police department tried to cover it up (as seems to be the case).

Everyone has demons buried deep within them, sometimes demons they're not even aware of. We can't ever expect anyone to be pure & free of those demons; all we can do is apologize and reconcile when they surface. The cost of forgiveness of and reconciliation with others is the price we pay if we want to be considered human - if we hope to expect the same treatment in return when our own demons, which we're similarly ashamed of, show their faces - and of course, at some point, they always will.

That's a very nice post. I guess I'm just not as forgiving as you, but it's something to aim for. In the meantime, while in no way a boycott, I'll continue not seeing Mel's movie (though I liked Man Without a Face).
Posted Image
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Nina
Senior Carp
Call my cynically optimistic.

Gibson, by virtue of his celebrity, is in a unique position to really demonstrate remorse in a way that can affect many people. I'm hoping he uses his "Hollywood pulpit" to perhaps enlighten people about how bigotry and alcoholism are unacceptable.

That would really be something to see.

As it is, his apology today is more than adequate. Not namby-pamby, rather accepting specific guilt and not splitting hairs. I'll take him at his word until shown otherwise.
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
The 89th Key
Aug 1 2006, 08:27 AM

I’m not just asking for forgiveness. I would like to take it one step further, and meet with leaders in the Jewish community, with whom I can have a one on one discussion to discern the appropriate path for healing.

Gotta wonder how much they're going to hit him up for. :wink:
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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kenny
HOLY CARP!!!
kenny
Aug 1 2006, 10:11 AM
Thanks, maybe I will someday.

Then again, not.

I think I'll boycot the guy.

What he revealed about himself merits a boycott.
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The 89th Key
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What did he reveal?

What he said in a drunken tirade while getting arrested, and then incessantly apologizing for it and working to reconcile the community he offended while getting personal help himself....warrants a boycott of his work?
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ivorythumper
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I am so adjective that I verb nouns!
It's Kenny's money -- he can do what he wants with it. Market forces, 89th -- if Kenny finds him objectionable, he should not support Gibson's endeavors. Same reason I won't go see a Michael Moore movie.
The dogma lives loudly within me.
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Dewey
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HOLY CARP!!!
kenny
Aug 1 2006, 12:23 PM
kenny
Aug 1 2006, 10:11 AM
Thanks, maybe I will someday.

Then again, not.

I think I'll boycot the guy.

What he revealed about himself merits a boycott.

During World War II, Soichiru Honda worked in research and development in the aircraft industry, increasing the efficiency of propellers for military aircraft of the Imperial Japanese military, thereby acting as an accomplice to the deaths of countless American lives during the war. Perhaps we should we boycott Honda because of that.
"By nature, i prefer brevity." - John Calvin, Institutes of the Christian Religion, p. 685.

"Never waste your time trying to explain yourself to people who are committed to misunderstanding you." - Anonymous

"Oh sure, every once in a while a turd floated by, but other than that it was just fine." - Joe A., 2011

I'll answer your other comments later, but my primary priority for the rest of the evening is to get drunk." - Klaus, 12/31/14
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justme
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HOLY CARP!!!
I was for boycotting him yesterday. But, today's apology has swayed me not to boycott his movies. That is, depending on how he follows through.

Having said that, I'm still very disillusioned with the man and will not enjoy watching his movies anymore. Because now every time I see him I will be reminded of what he said while driving drunk.

I think the man has lots of emotional issues that he's been masquerading for many years now. Maybe he's been aware of the issues and has been battling them for a long time. I believe this is so. But, right now we finding out about these issues and he's a pretty messed up guy. I think any one who would have directed and produced something as heartwrenching as the Passion in all it's gore and glory must be somewhat messed up.

I get the impression that the man is struggling with some very deep issues. I hope the good inside of him wins the battle.
"Men sway more towards hussies." G-D3
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The 89th Key
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ivorythumper
Aug 1 2006, 04:31 PM
It's Kenny's money -- he can do what he wants with it. Market forces, 89th -- if Kenny finds him objectionable, he should not support Gibson's endeavors. Same reason I won't go see a Michael Moore movie.

I'm not talking about Kenny's right to spend his money where he wants. I'm just trying to figure out what would warrant such a boycott, although I guess Kenny has already made it clear.

To me it seems almost mean to hold what Gibson said against him in spite of Gibson's comprehensive apology and doing everything he can do to rectify the situation.
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