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| Transformers 2: Revenge of the Fallen; AutoBots, Roll Out | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 24 2008, 08:32 PM (942 Views) | |
| darktitan | Jul 10 2009, 11:22 PM Post #31 |
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Commander
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And knowing is half the battle! |
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| dl316bh | Jul 10 2009, 11:52 PM Post #32 |
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Hiss! @_____________@
They are trying to do it for the fans. They went out of their way to get several classic voices, tried to fit in fan favorites and generally tried to make a movie that would please hardcore audiences and attract new viewers with little to no nostalgia in the cartoons. That's a balancing act that's a very thankless job. I'll be honest, I think the human stories are somewhat necessary. Much as I love the big guys duking it out and all, it's never made much sense in the cartoons - except Beast Wars being the obvious exception - how relatively left out the humans were aside from the token human tagalong. People would just let robots come in and fight on our planet and never get actively involved? I've never bought it and it's been one of those suspension of disbelief things, which is why I felt the military sequences were a good thing in the first film. I don't know about the second yet though. I need to see it. I'm just addressing some things you've said and my thoughts as they stand. |
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| Lizard-Man | Jul 11 2009, 01:53 AM Post #33 |
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Global Moderator
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I'm not saying they shouldn't be told, I'd just like a balance between both the autobots and the humans here. The only robot team I could honestly say was given a good amount of screen time were the decepticons. They got plenty of scenes, especially with Starscream and Megatron and their relationship in this movie. It was interesting, it was touched on and I wanted to see more of stuff like that with the autobots. But I didn't. I'm find with the human stories, I just want it to be balanced. As for pleasing fans, sure they have done a lot Dl, but at the same time... when you watch the movie... for me... is just didn't do it for me. Peter Cullen was great, Optimus was great, I loved the fight scenes, I'm not saying that stuff was bad. But... it falls back on a lot of stupid humor that half the time isn't funny or is crude. The story just isn't that great. Its just not very good, I can't really say anything more then that. It had stuff that would please the fans, but it also had quite a bit that would piss them off, no doubt about that there anything weould piss them off, and piss off the audience that doesn't have the same memories of the show. I think some people who aren't familiar with Transformers wouldn't particularly like this film. By the way, about the whole, its popcorn, its Transformers, what do you expect thing? Well, fine, but isn't that just seriously lowering your standards? Instead of doing that, why not actually achieve something a bit more with this film? I mean when you lower expectations that low and just accept it, the producers and directors think they made a good movie and they continue along that line putting in more of that stuff and lowering the film's quality as a whole. I'm not asking for a masterpiece here, I'm asking for something thats entertaining. And I wasn't entertained. The first film was a good popcorn movie, this one... its just lowered its standards instead of raising them. The autbots screentime is low to the point I could care less about any of them besides Optimus, I can't tell which ones are still alive after all that went down. They introduce new characters and only give them one line and very little development. They introduce original comic relief characters who are stereotypical and annoying as hell. I mean, when you don't expect much and you still come out of it dissapointed... that says a lot for it. |
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| dl316bh | Jul 11 2009, 02:15 AM Post #34 |
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There's a difference between lowering your standards and being realistic. There's no way a movie based on a toy line is going to be a Citizen Kane of cinema. Hell, even the original cartoon wasn't exactly the pinnacle of animation; no matter how much nostalgia we have for it, when you break it down it was cheesy, corny and ridiculous. Most of the Transformers cartoons were, actually. So exactly what can you expect from something based off of that? A cinematic achievement that pushes the boundaries of storytelling and screen? Hell, if they played the films just like the cartoon they'd be laughed right out of theaters, even if diehard loyalists of the original show loved it.
The same obviously goes for others. That doesn't always mean much. A lot of people didn't like the first one; I did.
Well, in their defense, isn't that the reality of a lot of movies? |
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| unfunnyjoke | Jul 11 2009, 02:26 AM Post #35 |
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Knight Champion
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Yeah, but lot's of people were entertained. The people I went with to see it loved it more than me, the people in the theatre all laughed quite a bit at all the jokes, even the lowbrow ones. And the general mumblings while leaving were all good. My expectations were a little low going in, yeah, though mostly because of what I read here. I was pleasantly surprised by this film. |
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| Lizard-Man | Jul 11 2009, 03:27 AM Post #36 |
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Fine, you like it UFJ I didn't. I just don't see why some people would think its good. For a popcorn movie it failed me. I'm not saying I want Citizen Kane, I just want effort and I didn't see that. I saw a cheap cash in that didn't really care about its story and yes, I was realistic. I didn't think the movie would be anything better then a standard Micheal Bay film, but I expected more. I can't just accept poor film making because its based on a toy line for kids. It doesn't work that way. You can make an idea work if you try and I don't think they did. I don't know what exactly to say, I keep saying the same thing and I feel like no one's really listening. I didn't want anything out of it except a Transformers movie and in that respect it failed for me. Again, I DIDN'T want a masterpiece of cinema, I DIDN'T want a reproduction of the show, I wanted something that could take an idea and make it work better. for some people they can apparently just accept its a popcorn film and laugh, but for me... I guess what I was expecting was to see them develop the characters more, that didn't happen to be honest. I didn't feel a connection with anyone. Even in some of the dumbest action movies, like 300, I can feel somewhat of a connection. Transformers I could, somewhat between Sam and Bumblebee. I wanted to see development I wanted to see a semblance of a plot I wanted to see more on the robots and their relationship with the humans. I got nothing of what I expected except seeing Optimus Prime kick ass. I don't know what to say. It just wasn't a good movie, thats all. |
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| dl316bh | Jul 11 2009, 03:30 AM Post #37 |
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Eh, that's subjective. It's not going to go down as a classic in cinema like Blade Runner or The Godfather, but there will certainly be a lot of people who like it and think it's a good film. Just like the first film, really. Admit it; you're just mad the Dinobots didn't make it into the film. =P |
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| unfunnyjoke | Jul 11 2009, 04:58 AM Post #38 |
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Nah, we're listening we're just disagreeing with you. Like DL said, it's subjective. I mean, I could rewrite the entire first part of your post here from my perspective. I just don't see how some people could see this as a bad movie. For a popcorn movie it delivered. I'm not saying I thought it was Citizen Kane, but I wanted effort and I could see it was made. I saw a well made film that gave a lot of nice nods to the fans while still letting newcomers enjoy themselves. I didn't think the movie would be any worse than any other Michael Bay film, but I was pleasantly surprised. I like seeing this much effort put into something as silly as a toy line., it worked though and ended up being pretty darned entertaining. Did I change your mind? Didn't really think so. Though... if DL is right and you're just sore because there was no dinobots. Yeah, I'm right with you on that. Dinobots were pretty kickass. |
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| Ravisk | Jul 11 2009, 07:55 AM Post #39 |
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Sergeant
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LOLS took a dig at the Dinobots XD
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| Now You See Me Haha!! Now You Don't! | |
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| Lizard-Man | Jul 11 2009, 11:53 AM Post #40 |
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Well I keep saying I didn't expect much and keep asking what I expected out of a film that wasn't going to be very high quality. I keep saying not much and you just ask the question again, thats what I mean. Please Dl, I knew the dinobots weren't in this move for the longest time. If anything the fact Arcee, the only girl in the transformers, played no role in it period (Not as a strong female, Not as eye candy, not as a love interest, not even as damsel in distress, but no role period. She's just there.) is a bigger factor in my dislike. Dinobots don't even register as a factor. I've listed off the reason I don't like the film. The autobots are barely in it and have no real character development (Which I wasn't expecting much considering its an action movie but it couldn't have hurt it), many Decepticons were killed too easy by either the autobots or the US military diminishing tyheir supposed threat and that the story was boring and slow. While saying its bad is subjective and I know others will like it, the fact is I didn't find very good. My family didn't find it very good and they all liked the first movie. I don't know what expectations they had, but still. I don't know how exactly to explain my issue with this low expectations stuff but I think the best way I can say it is this. When you go to a film, knowing its just a popcorn flick and only expecting to be entertained thats okay, I do that all the time, but theres gotta be a point where you have to expect a little more. This is the sequel to last Transformers film that was also a hit or miss and a good number of people disliked it. I don't know why, I didn't hate it, but when you make a sequel we have to have some expectations, just a few. I mean theres gotta be a limit to what you can tolerate, right? Think about the fourth Rambo movie, I went to see it to see Rambo kill bad guys, I got my money's worth and because it was commenting on a real life human rights abusing regime I felt there was something of a more noble message then "America Rules!" which I agree with but is also kinda tiring after awhile. So that surprised me. When I went to see Die Hard 4, or whatever they like to call it, I was expecting a tiny bitty nostalgia trip and I got that. The censorship during the film sucked, but when the uncensored cut came out on DVD that complaint was gone. That film met my expectations but didn't surpass them during the theatre expierience. Both times I enjoyed myself because I went in with low expectations. This film I expected apparently a dumb explosions flick but one that had more robots, less people. In that maybe I was expecting too much and thats was dissapointed. Still, its a Transformers movie, a sequel at that. Isn't one of the expectations one is suppose to have about a sequel is more of what you got the first time around. More robots, more action, more explosions, I got the last two but I didn't feel like the robots one succeeded because we never really focused that much on them. Thats my core complaint, now if you're telling me therefore I was expecting too much from Micheal Bay because of that okay, fine, but I still wasn't expecting that much and the film still dissapointed me. So I don't know what else to say. Maybe after watching a number of good films, and other movies that may not rank in that catergory but still enjoying them, had made expect more out of people who make movies. I mean I enjoyed Terminator Salvation this year, my family said good things about Star Trek and I wouldn't mind seeing that now, I knew what to expect from those films. With all the talk from the directors about the other robots that would be in this film I guess I just expected the autobots and decepticons to get more of the spotlight this time around. Perhaps that was asking too much, but thats how they built it up. |
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7:27 PM Jul 10