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Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Oh hey, I died and everyone else is having a serious discussion 'n shit. Seems like a perfect time for...

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Dolphins are cool. I'm gonna go hang out with some while ya'll sort out this mess. Peace :3

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
I'm sorry, I was up to like 5 RPGing last night and I'm running on about four hours of sleep. I'm gonna try to catch up and parse what's going on to make a big informed post. Right now, I'm wary of Flare's claim because while Dr. Cox being in the game and being the Roleblocker, I cannot imagine any version of the game where Dr. Cox and Dr. Kelso are on the same same side, at least during the period where Kelso was Chief of Medicine and not retired. While they became friends later in life, Kelso and Cox hated each other during the period this seems to be set, and actively worked against each other whenever possible, to the point that they would do things that were inconvenient or inconsequential for them just to mess with their counterpart. Given that we know for a fact that Kelso is in this game and was Town, I'm having a hard time believing that Dr. Cox is also Town, but at the same time we still have no idea who the Mafia are flavor-wise or what's even going on in the hospital to cause all this, so it's hard to make a judgement call there.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Given that Vyse is rapid fire posting now, he's probably off on some desperate gambit. Has he 1) Accused me of being unable to read him, 2) begged for one more phase to prove himself, 3) Come up with a new roleclaim, 4) Tried to build a scum-case against myself, Kilmarnock, or MW, 5) Gone on a circular diatribe about how he represents logic and reason and everyone else is playing to emotion, 6) Insisted that I can't have a good read on him since I'm not reading all his new material, or 7) All of the above?

Personally, I'm betting on just about everything short of a new roleclaim, since that would be a truly desperate maneuver, but the rest fits his current M.O. See, the fact is, Vyse is probably flipping out about the fact that I'm not reading his shit, but in my mind I gave him a whole phase to argue his case and make me see the light. He failed. He should have been dead. As far as I'm concerned, he is, and we're just feeling out the phase to see if there are any other leads to follow after he's lynched. I'm not letting him talk his way out of this one with me. I'm not letting him bargain his way into a stay of execution. I'm not letting him, to take an old phrase of his, tell reality to shut up and cry in a corner. Because the reality is, everything about Vyse's game screams scum, and the fact that he's posting this much, this frantically about the whole thing just proves it. When Vyse is playing truly helpful town, he's reserved, and he doesn't wall this much. Compare the post counts between SDR, a game where Vyse was primarily town until his last couple of phases, and this game: In SDR, he had 98 posts for the whole game. In this game, he's up to 208 in just two and a half phases. In Star Wars, which is the game most analogous to this one for me in terms of his play, he had 87 just in the first day. This is absolutely Vyse's back to the wall scumtell. He just tries to become the loudest possible voice to secure as many folks who are uncertain through volume. At this point, I'm 99% certain he's scum, and the other 1% paints him as incredibly selfish town.

This has very much been a game where Vyse has tried to convince other people to think like him and play in his clubhouse, and where he panics when that doesn't happen. That's never good for town, period, and it's something he does a lot more when he's scum than when he's town. That's why I'm not listening to him. Let's just kill him already and sort this whole mess once and for all. Please.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
EBWOP: Last phase*, not last things.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Full disclosure: I'm deliberately not reading Vyse's posts at this point until someone makes some sort of solid case for him as town. From what I'm picking up from snippets with others though and the general length and number of his posts, though, he's doing the exact same thing he did last things: Talk town in circles with math and logic and appeals to stall until either the phase ends or everyone involved dies of old age. Whichever comes first, really.

I'm legitimately flabbergasted that Vyse is still alive and that there seems to be any question as to whether he is our lynch or not today. If he's trying to play his town game, he's doing it very, very badly this time. It's full of scumtells that are pinging me like mad,and everything he does just pushes the read further. Vyse likes to bring up V4P2 a lot about how he was town then and I pushed him hard, but he's forgetting the fact that I actually went along with his initial gambit and later defended him again as the game went on. It's only when he does bizarre, insane, anti-town stuff that I read him as scum. This game is full of that. He needs to go, ASAP.

Hot Problems
Hmm. Now that was significantly less scandalous than she was hoping for. Instead of venting secret frustrations and plotting against anybody in particular, Hazel was just...being a better actress, or whatever. Which was cool because, like, she was a really good actress already, so it was kinda pumping to think about her going further, but some gossip would have been fun. She'd have to find the juicy stuff elsewhere, probably.

Another distraction worked it's way into the room as Cass tried to sneak by her and get out with just a snag of their artbook. They should really know by now it wasn't going to be that easy. Caedyn flashed them a grin and turned her attention in their direction. "Caaaaass! What's good, hun? You know, I've been wanting to compare some notes with you! Ja's providence, yeah?"

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
M'kay. You're doing the thing again and I'm tired of it. You should have been dead last phase, so here's what I suggest: If we want to explore other avenues besides Vyse for a bit before we kill him, which we should absolutely do this phase, let's just tune him out. He wants attention and to stir the pot up. The easiest way to deal with him is to just ignore his mad, weird-ass theories and lynch him when the time comes. I'm 100% done with this fight and it's what I'm going to be doing. Unless he survives this phase by some miracle, Vyse is already dead to me and I'm not entertaining this nonsense any further. This is how he always fucks Town over and I'm just not participating in it this time. I see what he's trying to do to try and get me to tunnel in and make a big fight out of this. It's the same reason I'm still alive if he's scum. I am basically town's celebrity debutante, one off-kilter statement from jumping into the deepest scum camp, and scum Vyse likes to push my buttons to try and get me there. This time, I'm just not doing it. I'm washing my hands of this and keeping my vote here, because there is no universe where Vyse should survive this phase.

I would like to hear more from Grim and Turtle this phase, as they're my next two scum picks right now. Already voiced my vague suspicions on Flare but I don't feel confident one way or the other there.

For the people all said "Sit down, sit down you're rockin' the boat."
Ty cracked his neck a bit as he rested against the tree. New guy helped ease the tension some between him, it felt like. Wasn't really sure where the conversation was headed, but at least they weren't yelling yet. Seemed like an improvement over the usual.

The synopsis Jeremy supplied sounded kinda scattered, but maybe that was just the timing of it all. All he did was shrug and nod as he listened on, trying to think of something to add. Maybe this was it. Maybe this was all they needed, just a sorta civil conversation, and then he could bail out. Might resolve whatever the fuck he came looking for over here. "Mmhm," he mumbled, "sounds like a packed one. Can't say I've heard of it, or too familiar with the Green fella. It any good?"

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Your basic math is trumped by basic logic. There is a chance that a investigative role is hit tonight if scum fires blindly. There is a guarantee that an investigative role is hit tonight. I don't care what chance you think scum has right now, that chance skyrockets to 100% if they claim, and if they don't have any scum identified, that's unacceptable. End of story.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
VysePresident
Aug 17 2015, 09:10 PM
(Sorry Percy, I'm just double posting because I forgot something important. I'll try & keep it at that for now.)

Also guys, All Investigative Roles ought to claim at this point, if you have anything useful at all

We're down to 10 members, several of whom have claimed VT, 3-4 of whom are scum. It's not going to be hard for scum to sort through the rest for PRs.
No. God no. Nooooooooooooooooooooo. If you combined every voice of every sentient creature that ever has, does, or will exist in every possible reality in every possible dimension in to one single, disjuncted and droning "NO," it would still not be loud enough to express the NO that is in the dark, empty, sucking void that exists roughly where I have a soul when I read this plan.

This is such clear scum fishing. If an investigative role believes they have scum, then sure, step up and claim. However, if you don't, then remain anonymous. Yes, scum is hunting for investigative roles. Yes, scum is probably excluding the VT claims. However, they're still rolling the dice every time they make a kill to try and hit someone investigative. If they claim now, and they have no scum results, then they're dead that night and we have no leads, and significantly less hope of generating them in the future. This plan is bad bad bad bad bad. Don't do it. Just say no to extremely transparent fishing expeditions.

Really don't like Flare's press on MW. There are way better targets. I do have to say I'm sorta suspicious of MW because of Vyse's deep, deep expressed faith in him, but I dunno. Seems like it could get awful WiFoM messing with that. I want more.

Vote: VYSEPRESIDENT.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
VysePresident
Aug 14 2015, 06:53 PM
Heh, I'm not lynched yet?

Really?

No worries Cake. I just wish you'd been here earlier, because you actually can get what I'm doing.
By all means, feel free to vote for yourself and bring us a little closer to ending your amazement. ;)

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Oh, point redacted then, I could have sworn it did but I think you probably know better than I do XD I think that somewhat supports the case I'm making though, since the reaction I'm getting the most from Vyse here is his SW bargaining and shakiness.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
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The only thing that stands out as a bit odd is the idea Vyse wouldn't have left scum instructions night one, since he was pretty clearly gonna be in the hot seat today.


The assumption I'm operating on here is that while Vyse might have left some stuff the night beforehand, I don't think Vyse was really expecting to get lynched today. Kilmarnock was the only person who was really burning after Vyse hard yesterday, and I think Vyse assumed he could handle him while getting other town voices to flip for him or look elsewhere. It's how he's been able to survive as scum previously, and even during SW he had daychat available during his lynch since it was Day One. This is a somewhat unprecedented situation in my read of Vyse, so I'm making some educated guesses as to exactly how is play is going, but I'm reasonably confident.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
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I don't know. I was hoping you could see what I mean, but I don't fully know where you're at. All I can ask is that you trust me this one phase please, and I'll give the lynch to you if I'm wrong.


You said almost this exact same thing last game, verbatim. You wanted town to give you just one more phase to trust you and lynch Kilmarnock instead. It's always a matter of "give me just one more phase."

You're in bomb mode right now. You know your days are numbered and you've been caught out. You're just trying to do as much damage as you can before that happens. Given that this is Day 2, you don't have day chat to leave any coaching or advice to your scum buddies on how to handle your lynch and score townpoints off of it. You're banking on making it to night 2, leaving a strategy to help protect them and either discredit or enfold town targets ya'll have deemed influential, and then eating the lynch if you have to tomorrow while trying to spread more chaos and buy yourself another phase through shenanigans.

I know that that's what you're doing if you're scum. If you're town, and you're telling the truth, you have no power role to act with during the night, and one more phase just means scoring to one of your preferred lynches on the off chance we hit scum and giving you another round to defend yourself and tie up town discussion based on whether you're scum or not next phase. The reward is not worth the risk. That's why you're a viable lynch.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
The thing is, you always act like the push against you is full of logical fallacies and holes even when you're scum. You literally just did this last game. I'm not pretending I have an airtight case against you, but there's enough there that I'm pretty comfortable assuming you're scum.

I can't read your MS Iso and find anything of note. I don't understand what's happening in it. Without the context I look for to identify actions in-game, it's pretty much gibberish. I also don't feel like the play I'm seeing looks anything like what you're doing here. Again, maybe it's the differing context, but you seem way more flustered and scattered in those posts than you do right now. You've got this faux air of disorganization to what you're doing right now, but you tend to have laser-focused and long, well thought out thoughts about what's going on and where you want to push for that post, at the very least, each time. This does not feel like the same thing by a mile.

Way more inclined to trust that Laverne is a VT than Carla is. I feel like Turtle claimed way too quickly, personally, but I'm not inclined to press that claim right now when it's relatively plausible. I do wanna look at her next phase, though.

RE: Murder at me soft-claiming, I'm not. I'm not claiming a power at all. I'm merely verifying that I have a conditional phrase in my Role PM that alters my role in some way if the conditions are met, not what those conditions are or how it changes. What I was fishing for from Vyse was a confirmation that he also had a similar sentence in his role PM, since I felt like he could be crumbing that and it didn't feel like something he would do without it being true, since it's a rare mechanic and he had no way of knowing it's part of my role and I suspect it's part of some other roles as well. Since he stuck with plain old vanilla, on a character that important(especially to J.D., our narrator), it really feels like he's riding a safeclaim to me, and I wanted to get my evidence out there now so we can view it in context of the other claims so far.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Sorry, man. You're tempting me by linking me a game based on my favorite webcomic ever(and evoking all sorts of feels because the damn thing is in its last arc before it closes shop for the foreseeable future), but I can't make heads or tails of what any of this means. Mafia for me relies a lot on context and meta and I have no idea how you read any of these players by experience, or how I should be reading them to inform my read on your play. No matter how much MS you link me, it basically might as well all be in wing-dings for how I construct my reads. I don't like examining stuff in a vacuum and there's no way to get the context I need for this without reading just a lot of games and maybe participating in the site, neither of which I have any intention of doing while in possession of my more rational faculties.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
VysePresident
Aug 14 2015, 03:39 AM
You seriously think I'm adding to the risk on me, to make Town apathetic? The same Town that's going to lynch me if they can't get a better suspect?

I give up, at least for now. I'm just going to stop playing ADD Squirrel, get my thoughts on Turtle out there, and just hope for a miracle.
I think you have done squirrelier things when the chips are down. You bomb out pretty hard when you feel your lynch is certain and you're just kinda dancing around it.
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You owe me a theory chat after the game though. Sound good? (I've kinda been wanting an excuse to chat with you anyway, so let's go with this, please. :P )

Can do, hoss. No promises as to my relative sobriety, though. ;)

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
Scum!Vyse benefits far more from your current play than Town!Vyse. Scum!Vyse doesn't want a lynch at all. Scum!Vyse wants to hop from train to train and keep suspicions moving so we're not really sure where to look. That way Scum!Vyse survives another day and still has the same leads to play off of to run town in circles around next phase. I know Scum!Vyse pretty well. That sounds like a Scum!Vyse thing to do. Town!Vyse doesn't really gain a whole lot from jumping around, since it doesn't generate traction this late in the game and with this much of the town away for various reasons. Town!Vyse is probably smart enough to figure that out and stick to their guns on whoever they feel has the greatest chance of being lynched, because unlike Scum!Vyse, Town!Vyse prefers a lynch to a no lynch at this stage of the game.

I'm not gonna run a bunch of numbers or try to dislodge your WiFoM reasoning. It's pretty plain who benefits from your course of action. You said it yourself: scum wants an apathetic town. A town that can't decide to vote on too many targets is just as good as one that can't decide to vote on no targets. Seems fairly straightforward to me, no WiFoM required.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
VysePresident
Aug 14 2015, 03:11 AM
Then you believe I'd give up literally every advantage I had to pursue a random lynch as scum?

Come again?
I have no idea what this means. Elaborate.

Scrubs Mafia Game Thread
So here's the deal.

I asked that question because I was genuinely curious. I wanted to see how Vyse handled it and what direction he chose. If he chose to say that he did have a conditional sentence in his PM, I would be intrigued and more willing to not lynch him. Because I have a conditional sentence in my PM that alters my role, and since that kind of effect isn't super common in SotF(especially on the town-end), the coincidence would have been enough to tip me into the Grim camp and explain away all the bad vibes I'm getting off of Vyse's claim.

He didn't, though. Which means all my boogeymen lurking about my thought process about how it makes no sense for such a big character to be nothing but a VT in a game with so many easily accessible background characters are still here, and I trust him even less than I did before, because he went with a claim that is safe and innocuous and can fit into any game, rather than one with a unique bit of flair that he couldn't know I also have.

I'll jump ship if the only other choice is a no lynch. At this point though, I'm really getting a lot of alarm bells from Vyse and I want this flip, because I'm not going to be able to truly focus on anything else in this game until I know one way or the other what he is.