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FRR: No Mercy - Discussion
Topic Started: Jul 16 2013, 01:33 PM (8,990 Views)
Badnik96
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You're just a voice pal, you don't know a damn thing about racing!
NWOWWE
Apr 16 2014, 08:57 AM
:P

I'm currently contemplating different strategies for dealing with Kody. Right now Spinach, Gamma Rays, or a Cerebral Enhance-O-Tron seem the most viable. :v:
Just make sure that you get your RP done in time if you use the third option :P
Team Ignition
WhipCoil - The Crash & Burn Tournament 5 Champion
Redline - Robot Bastards LW Champion
Sling Shot - Bot-o-Rama 2016 Sportsman Champion
The Debilitator - Cherry Bomb Classic Lightweight Champion
Pyrite - FRR Backlash Lightweight Champion
Doomerang - Robot Fight Night Heavyweight Champion

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Siphai
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The Guy
NWOWWE
Apr 16 2014, 03:06 PM
Well shit, why stop there?

Maybe we should go back to me blatantly fixing the playoffs to eliminate you and grab a cheap championship. Oh wait that didn't actually happen.

You want to bring up the Tank/Stampede thing again too while we're at it?

Jesus, if I hadn't already agreed to help Lian in CB by being on the staff I'd just take a leave from the staff for awhile. Clearly I'm being deemed unfit to write results anymore so I'm sure it would be to everyone's benefit if I didn't for awhile after FRR. >__>
Uhh, idk where that's coming from. I'm not accusing you of fixing the playoffs? I'm just saying don't use Heph vs. T Rex as a comparable match, because the RPs in that are in no way comparable to this. My RP wasn't any more of a joke than Kody's was for that match (even less so, really) and Dong Adventure actually has the stats to do something to Dancing Headless.
Team Targeted - (36-12) Robot Bastards

Dr. P: 4-8
Square Wave: 11-1
Snijmachine: 10-2
Parabolic Trajectory: 11-1
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NWOWWE
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Uhh, idk where that's coming from. I'm not accusing you of fixing the playoffs? I'm just saying don't use Heph vs. T Rex as a comparable match

You also brought up the whole FRR Dead Zone business. You also said "It doesn't matter what I did". Well I've got some bad news for you, it DOES matter what you did. If there was malicious intent involved (not saying that is the case, just for the sake of argument) then I absolutely feel no guilt about letting Kody redo his RP for that week because that's a well established dick move to try and bait an easy win.

At the time the circumstances were highly suspicious and it was a rather unique case. This wasn't just a regular competitor that had left and came back, you were actually on the staff. Then you just randomly vanished. There was no ARC contact, no Facebook contact, no MSN Messenger contact. Nothing. You basically Bot257'ed us. Now I can't remember what your reasoning for vanishing was. It was probably even reasonable, but at that time I don't think I had the information and made a judgement call. I generally lean towards the sympathetic option even if it's technically against my principles.

Quote:
 
don't use Heph vs. T Rex as a comparable match, because the RPs in that are in no way comparable to this. My RP wasn't any more of a joke than Kody's was for that match (even less so, really) and Dong Adventure actually has the stats to do something to Dancing Headless.

All right I'm going to be fair about this. The Heph/Wrex fight really isn't one of my prouder moments. It's been long enough since the fight happened that I honestly didn't remember anything about Kody's RP, so I'll allow that no, it's not a fair comparison. In fact I'm probably not being fair to Philip with this comparison because he put more effort into his RP than you did with yours.

However, while I may not stand behind the actual result any longer, I don't regret the principle behind the result. Let's be honest with ourselves. You turned in about as lazy of an RP as you felt you could get away with. I don't care who you are and who you're facing, that isn't going to do you many favors. You figured Heph just being Heph was enough to give you the match regardless of Kody (or Martjin) would put up. I'm familiar with your "there's only so much you can do with an RP" viewpoint, but I can guarantee that if even with the same win/loss record, if Marti had been putting forth serious RP's week to week you'd have been able to come up with more than 2 fucking sentences. Plenty of people put out joke RP's but by and large they are against people that are not going to end up RPing period and we know we'd have to deal with the consequences if they did.

Now on Skype you called it the worst result you've ever seen. Well I think I can reconstruct my thought process mostly. Going by the RP's Heph was taking damage in a landslide, no brainer. But since your RP was so bare of anything else besides "hit him with my weapon" and you take his charging plan into account, Wrex in turn dominates Aggression. At this point Strategy becomes a very annoying category. At the surface you both succeed brilliantly at your tactics, but since you declined to attempt anything else that might help you out or really swing the fight completely in your favor, I wasn't going to blindly award you the category. At the time it basically seemed like a failure of strategy because you basically declined to do anything beyond perfunctory attacking. So if that's the worst result ever, well, at least you know where it came from.
Area51Escapee,Jan 30 2011
01:27 AM
Spatula,Jan 29 2011
11:32 PM
I should go 3-1 this week but it'll probably be something like 0-4 or 0-5.

It sucks going 0-5. You lose all 4 of your bot fights for the week and you also lose at life.
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That Kode Guy
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Ruiner of All
Listen, Alex, I only stepped in for Martijn because he was sick. I didn't go into the Heph vs. Rex match expecting to actually win, but all the same I wasn't going to put in like a few words and be done with it. Instead I (rather accurately) emulated his RP style as best I could. I was having fun with the match, and was in no jurisdiction out to prove Rex was the better bot. Do I agree with the end result? Eh, not really, but I can see where Josh is coming from. You dominated damage because Rex could to nothing. I dominated aggression because I was constantly attacking. Strategy? You literally did nothing else other than "Spin up the spinner and hit him a lot." while the Rex RP had more to it than just "ram him", however short it was. Come on man, it's really not worth as big of a deal as you're making it out to be. SPEAKING OF WHICH...

I don't give a SHIT about Dr. Pepperdine vs. Scarab in FRR5. I literally don't. The only reason I felt the "need" to edit my RP for that was because you came back so suddenly and it was the last match I had against you; all the rest of our matches were FF wins for me. Now, coming back like that out of the blue with an RP like that was incredibly lame, dude. You're a seasoned veteran (and on the writing staff at the time, fuck) and you just completely disappeared, no warning. How the fuck are we supposed to react? If you were coming back, you should have let us know beforehand, "panic attack" or not. There is no excuse. Even so, covering my ass was not my intent. I wanted an actual fucking good fight with you for god's sakes, even if I lost. (and look how that turned out, lol... 2-3 lines for the fight?) If even that violates the rules, fine, DQ my RP. I wouldn't have cared less. Hell, if you actually spoke up about it beforehand, I probably would have had Josh delete my edit. And at any rate it was a match that held no bearing on anything whatsoever - Scarab and Dr. Pepperdine were already eliminated, so I care even less about the end result. But I really don't appreciate you labelling me a cheater without knowing why I did what I did, and especially while you weren't there at all.

I dislike having to be so harsh but there's no way around it. It's just a game for crying out loud. I don't know why we have to get so uptight about it.
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StevenMcG
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Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the war thread! :headache:

In all seriousness, guys, I think it's time to step back a moment and calm down. I realise it's probably not my place to say this kind of thing - I've only been back here on ARC a few months after who knows how long - but I just want to ask one thing.

We are barely a dozen or so nerds in one little corner of the Web playing what amounts to Battlebots fantasy football.

Is something like that really worth this much stress and hostility towards each other?

I'm not having a very good season with my bots. In fact, they're kinda sucking. Last-minute entries tend to do that. Why, a couple weeks back, I lost a match by forfeit because my opponent made a second RP thread for the fight by mistake and the first one I made got lost in the shuffle. Have I blown my top yet? Cried "stitch-up"? Sworn like a sailor at all involved? Have I heck. I have a jokey bitch in the discussion thread and get ready for the next week. When I did have an actual problem, like the mix-up above, I only had to ask nicely and got my rematch fine and dandy. I still lost the battle, but at least I got to lose properly. :v:

Because even the sucky bits aren't that big of a deal.

I don't do these fantasy contests simply to win. I do them to have fun with my friends. Things go wrong sometimes, but I know by now that we can always work them out together. If we couldn't, I'd have jumped ship from this fandom eons ago. This is my twelfth straight year doing this stuff and counting and it's not the battles or the bots that have kept me coming back.

There are so few of us still doing this sort of thing anymore, guys. The last thing we should be doing is fighting each other. That's meant to be the robots' jobs.

Here endeth the Heart of the Cards lecture. :P
"Eat, drink and be merry - for tomorrow, you may catch some disgusting skin disease!"
~ Edmund Blackadder
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GF93
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Vi veri veniversum vivus vici.
All right, this was a good week! Got the wins I hoped I would- beat Kody twice, took down the reigning champion, and was able to get a KO for War Bastard as well.

Getting completely thrashed in the SHW match was not so good, but I guess you win some and lose some.
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"I will not die until I achieve something. Even though the ideal is high, I never give in. Therefore, I never die with regrets."

Cherry Bomb Classic: Season 2 (8-0)
Swiftsure- 2-0
Torque Dirty 2 Me- 2-0
Ayame- 1-0
Dead on Arrival- 1-0
Barley Picker- 1-0
Lethal Injection 3- 1-0

Robot Bastards 2 (5-5)
Apathy & Lethargy- 2-1
Trump ex Machina- 0-3
Rainbow in the Dark- 3-1 (6-3)

Ruination: The Upheaval (20-8)
Ayame- 6-1
Marauder- 6-1
Dreadnought Mk3- 3-4
Lethal Injection 3- 5-2

ALL-TIME RECORD
Wins: 347
Losses: 230
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Alex Valentine is the hero we deserve.

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Siphai
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The Guy
NWOWWE
Apr 16 2014, 10:20 PM
Quote:
 
Uhh, idk where that's coming from. I'm not accusing you of fixing the playoffs? I'm just saying don't use Heph vs. T Rex as a comparable match

You also brought up the whole FRR Dead Zone business. You also said "It doesn't matter what I did". Well I've got some bad news for you, it DOES matter what you did. If there was malicious intent involved (not saying that is the case, just for the sake of argument) then I absolutely feel no guilt about letting Kody redo his RP for that week because that's a well established dick move to try and bait an easy win.


Ahaha are you fucking kidding me? Yes, I left FRR5, for like 8 weeks straight, forfeiting every match for 8 weeks, JUST so I could get an easy win off of Kody in week 9. That gets me a net positive of -7 wins! Truly one of my shining moments.

It's not an 'established dick move'. An established dick move is actually saying that you're leaving and THEN actually COMING BACK and RPing! Dan did that in Armageddon or whatever tournament that was, and his opponents were rightfully allowed to edit their RPs because of his announcement. Otherwise, everyone that hasn't announced anything is fair game. If rob came today and RP'd, no one should be allowed to edit their RPs. It's their own fault. You run that risk when you look at an auto FF team.

Whether or not Dylan allowed people to edit RPs, or my reasons for leaving, or whatever doesn't actually matter. Those are just excuses. The in this scenario the rules are very clear. Editing your RP is illegal.

Quote:
 
Now on Skype you called it the worst result you've ever seen. Well I think I can reconstruct my thought process mostly. Going by the RP's Heph was taking damage in a landslide, no brainer. But since your RP was so bare of anything else besides "hit him with my weapon" and you take his charging plan into account, Wrex in turn dominates Aggression. At this point Strategy becomes a very annoying category. At the surface you both succeed brilliantly at your tactics, but since you declined to attempt anything else that might help you out or really swing the fight completely in your favor, I wasn't going to blindly award you the category. At the time it basically seemed like a failure of strategy because you basically declined to do anything beyond perfunctory attacking. So if that's the worst result ever, well, at least you know where it came from.


Now this is really a leap in logic. My strategy is to spin up and hit him. I'm a spinner. Doing damage and hitting him is good strategy points. Kody's strategy was to 'ram me'. Basically just running into my spinner. He doesn't even have the torque to push me, we'd just be stuck in the middle until he had to back away (and that's when the ram stops my spinner). Like, I can't believe I have to explain this. T Rex can't do anything to Heph. In fact, I would call him a failure of strategy because HE declined to attempt anything else that might help him out. The big factor there is that he's throwing himself into the blade, causing himself damage, which is BAD STRATEGY. That's result writing 101.

What more do you want me to put in my RPs for those fights? Especially against a robot like T Rex? Most of my RPs, (especially for spinners) even now, are just me saying how the other guy's design is bad, and how my design is better, and then a short clip of actual strategy. I mean, I don't even like putting that in there to be honest, that's something the writer should see immediately. But if you want the paragraphs of fluff, which I guess you do, I guess I'm more than happy to accommodate. My Hephaestus RP there said as much about strategy as some of my other Heph, or Snijmachine, or Windmill RPs. Except it lost because it was short.
Team Targeted - (36-12) Robot Bastards

Dr. P: 4-8
Square Wave: 11-1
Snijmachine: 10-2
Parabolic Trajectory: 11-1
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NWOWWE
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Ahaha are you fucking kidding me? Yes, I left FRR5, for like 8 weeks straight, forfeiting every match for 8 weeks, JUST so I could get an easy win off of Kody in week 9. That gets me a net positive of -7 wins! Truly one of my shining moments.

I didn't say that WAS your endgame. All I said was at the time it was a possible thought process. Yes hindsight is 20/20, so I know now that obviously wasn't the case at all.

Quote:
 
It's not an 'established dick move'. An established dick move is actually saying that you're leaving and THEN actually COMING BACK and RPing! Dan did that in Armageddon or whatever tournament that was, and his opponents were rightfully allowed to edit their RPs because of his announcement. Otherwise, everyone that hasn't announced anything is fair game. If rob came today and RP'd, no one should be allowed to edit their RPs. It's their own fault. You run that risk when you look at an auto FF team.

I've established on few different occasions that I should probably be the last person sympathetic to someone throwing away their RP on an expected FF win only to have it come back to bite them. But I am a very sympathetic person. I care more about a fair/fun competition than "lol sucks to be you cause da rulez says so". As I said I pretty much went ahead with it because it wasn't going to effect anything. It was a nothing match so there was literally no harm in letting it play out. If it had had playoff implications then I would have had to leave it as it was and just say "Sorry Kody, them's the breaks".

So if you still want to be all bent out of shape about a completely meaningless fight from years ago then go ahead and keep ranting because obviously nothing is going to change your mind about it anyway.

Quote:
 
Now this is really a leap in logic. My strategy is to spin up and hit him. I'm a spinner. Doing damage and hitting him is good strategy points. Kody's strategy was to 'ram me'. Basically just running into my spinner. He doesn't even have the torque to push me, we'd just be stuck in the middle until he had to back away (and that's when the ram stops my spinner). Like, I can't believe I have to explain this. T Rex can't do anything to Heph. In fact, I would call him a failure of strategy because HE declined to attempt anything else that might help him out. The big factor there is that he's throwing himself into the blade, causing himself damage, which is BAD STRATEGY. That's result writing 101.

Gee, it must be great to have never written a questionable/terrible result. I didn't say I still agreed with the result, and I'm not here to argue it's merits, I was just reconstructing my thought process from the time of the fight so it didn't look like I just pulled it out thin air to say "haha all over you asshole!" or anything like that. >__>

Hey, remember that time I bitched you out on the main boards for the Zombie Killer vs. Night Train result or even the Revolver Ocelot vs. Long Shot playoff match (which you incidentally admitted/stated was a bullshit result)? Wait, that never actually happened? Oh yeah, that's because I contacted you directly though PM about the ZK result and I didn't really raise any kind of real stink about the Ocelot fight other than the usual disappointed post.

Quote:
 
What more do you want me to put in my RPs for those fights? Especially against a robot like T Rex? Most of my RPs, (especially for spinners) even now, are just me saying how the other guy's design is bad, and how my design is better, and then a short clip of actual strategy. I mean, I don't even like putting that in there to be honest, that's something the writer should see immediately. But if you want the paragraphs of fluff, which I guess you do, I guess I'm more than happy to accommodate. My Hephaestus RP there said as much about strategy as some of my other Heph, or Snijmachine, or Windmill RPs. Except it lost because it was short.

I'm not saying it needs to be some epic RP, but just something with some actual effort or at least an RP that looked like you gave a shit and not just "Well I guess I'm required to actually put down a complete sentence or two just so I can say I technically RPed".

Also I'm fairly certain your other Heph (and other bots) RP's were a bit more intricate than "spin up and attack him", and if they really weren't, well then they probably should have lost more fights because that's just lazy RP logic and I know your capable of better than that.
Area51Escapee,Jan 30 2011
01:27 AM
Spatula,Jan 29 2011
11:32 PM
I should go 3-1 this week but it'll probably be something like 0-4 or 0-5.

It sucks going 0-5. You lose all 4 of your bot fights for the week and you also lose at life.
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Area51Escapee
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I beg the question
"If you're talking about time travelling bunnies...then yes." - Ben, LOST
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succotash_54
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Grandmaster Narrator
Steve, your post was not in vain. It is supposed to be for fun. It just isn't much fun when you feel like you're not getting a fair shake, which is my contention with two (well, one-and-a-half) of my results this week, or just being treated as a joke when you're actually trying (which Josh has apologized for). Fwiw, I was worried I would lose to you as well. I would have been shocked if our HW bout had been a blowout either way, but it was a very close match, which win or lose, I would have called fair.

I think that's why we see so many split decisions or near split decisions, so the writers don't ever have anyone question their integrity or neutrality.

Two RPs up. Two long-winded RPs. I should be able to get my SHW up tonight, as that one should be much more straightforward. The HW one I'm saving until such time as I can see the video that my worthy adversary has recommended so I can get a better handle on how it's supposed to function.
There are few crimes in our modern society that merit public beating. Interrupting someone's enjoyment of Messiah to request "Jingle Bells" by the Singing Dogs is irrefutably one such offense.
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playzooki
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oi
basically steven is right

this is for fun

arguing isnt fun

reading arguments isnt fun.

sure, BS results may not be fun, but just take it to pm's.
March or Die - Ruination: The Omen MW Last Eight, Ruination: The Omen Tag Team Champion (with the Green Hornet / NWOWWE), Ruination: The Contagion MW CHAMPION
Corrupt Politician - Reign of Steel SHW Finalist
Murder Is Fun! - Reign of Steel HW Semi-Finalist
Shrek - Hammerfall 4th Place

GF93
 
I'm starting to regret entering.
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That Kode Guy
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My piece is said and I'm done with it.

On another note, Lian's descriptions were very vague, and I would have asked him personally about Merry Hampton and Stabstract were he around. As it stands, I had to do some detailed guesswork in my MW and SHW RPs, which revolved around having to go into his CAD thread of all things, and get further details... which still didn't give me the full picture. I hate having to work with vague descriptions.

But I'm trying to have fun so... :v:
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NWOWWE
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Badnik96
Apr 16 2014, 04:04 PM
NWOWWE
Apr 16 2014, 08:57 AM
:P

I'm currently contemplating different strategies for dealing with Kody. Right now Spinach, Gamma Rays, or a Cerebral Enhance-O-Tron seem the most viable. :v:
Just make sure that you get your RP done in time if you use the third option :P
Badnik: How's it going?

Josh: Great! I just remembered who my opponents are!
Area51Escapee,Jan 30 2011
01:27 AM
Spatula,Jan 29 2011
11:32 PM
I should go 3-1 this week but it'll probably be something like 0-4 or 0-5.

It sucks going 0-5. You lose all 4 of your bot fights for the week and you also lose at life.
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succotash_54
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Grandmaster Narrator
Okay, looking at Green War.... so its shape is that of the bottom half of a pyramid, right? So each of the four sides... those are hinged wedges, or are they flipper panels... because "two forward flipping panels at each side of the bot" sounds like it's like that bot... some "kicking mule" of sorts? It had kicker-flippers on each of its four sides that kicked outward.... so each of those trapezoid shaped wedge panels are flippers, or are they hinged wedges? If they're hinged wedges, where are the panels? Are they on the top, flat part? Did he say "each side of the bot" when he meant "either side of the green bar on top?" Trying to figure out what I'm up against here.
There are few crimes in our modern society that merit public beating. Interrupting someone's enjoyment of Messiah to request "Jingle Bells" by the Singing Dogs is irrefutably one such offense.
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Badnik96
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You're just a voice pal, you don't know a damn thing about racing!
I'm pretty sure the two green panels on top are the two flippers.

Knowing Mystic and his lack of hope he probably won't RP anyway... >.>
Team Ignition
WhipCoil - The Crash & Burn Tournament 5 Champion
Redline - Robot Bastards LW Champion
Sling Shot - Bot-o-Rama 2016 Sportsman Champion
The Debilitator - Cherry Bomb Classic Lightweight Champion
Pyrite - FRR Backlash Lightweight Champion
Doomerang - Robot Fight Night Heavyweight Champion

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That Kode Guy
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[4:01:06 PM] Kody Kunz: GOD DAMN IT
[4:01:18 PM] Kody Kunz: why Lian, why do you show up when I've reposted the fixtures
[4:01:30 PM] Nick Fisher: Because he is infuriating like that
[4:01:39 PM] Josh Noel: lmao
[4:01:45 PM] Kody Kunz: I'm quoting this :P

<______>
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prince palatine
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KodeBreaker
Apr 17 2014, 01:24 PM
My piece is said and I'm done with it.

On another note, Lian's descriptions were very vague, and I would have asked him personally about Merry Hampton and Stabstract were he around. As it stands, I had to do some detailed guesswork in my MW and SHW RPs, which revolved around having to go into his CAD thread of all things, and get further details... which still didn't give me the full picture. I hate having to work with vague descriptions.

But I'm trying to have fun so... :v:
What seems to be the problem that you're trying to pinpoint?
Team Ectogasm

Honours

Robot Attack LW Runner Up (With The Servant's Assistant)
FRR: Dead Zone LW Runner Up (With The Servant's Assistant)
Ruination: The Beginning joint third place (With The Servant's Assistant, Camo Alert and Hammer & Nailz)
Crazy Bots Blazing Ruin: MW Runner Up (Merry Hampton BR) and SHW CHAMPION!!! (F-Dynasty)
League of Robotic Excellence: MW 3rd place (Terminus) and LW CHAMPION!!! (The Servant's Assistant 3)
Ruination: The Omen: MW joint 3rd place (Merry Hampton BR) SHW joint 3rd place (Curse Of The Deep 2) and HW CHAMPION!!! (Klarinette)
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That Kode Guy
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The main thing is that you didn't state if Merry Hampton's front plow was hinged or not, not even in the CAD thread where I had to look at the first post you put the drawing in, so I had to assume a lot of things. Also, how does Stabstract's wedge set-up work inverted? If it's flipped, the top of the plow will clearly hit the ground and suspend the wedge up.

I'm sorry but you really should have made your sign-up descriptions clearer. But you wouldn't be the first to do that.
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prince palatine
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Merry's plow has always been hinged, and Stabstract's is also hinged and works inverted, but it's not as effective.

Sorry for any confusion.
Team Ectogasm

Honours

Robot Attack LW Runner Up (With The Servant's Assistant)
FRR: Dead Zone LW Runner Up (With The Servant's Assistant)
Ruination: The Beginning joint third place (With The Servant's Assistant, Camo Alert and Hammer & Nailz)
Crazy Bots Blazing Ruin: MW Runner Up (Merry Hampton BR) and SHW CHAMPION!!! (F-Dynasty)
League of Robotic Excellence: MW 3rd place (Terminus) and LW CHAMPION!!! (The Servant's Assistant 3)
Ruination: The Omen: MW joint 3rd place (Merry Hampton BR) SHW joint 3rd place (Curse Of The Deep 2) and HW CHAMPION!!! (Klarinette)
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V900
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playzooki
Apr 17 2014, 01:23 PM
basically steven is right

this is for fun

arguing isnt fun

reading arguments isnt fun.

sure, BS results may not be fun, but just take it to pm's.
yeah well you're mom was fun in bed last night ooo damn get #dunked #anallyannilated son
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