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| New head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith; Archbishop Gerhard Ludwig Müller | |
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| Topic Started: Wednesday, 19. September 2012, 01:07 (806 Views) | |
| PJD | Friday, 30. November 2012, 22:59 Post #46 |
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"Those who consider the Second Vatican Council, or Vatican II, to be a break from Church Tradition, offer a “heretical interpretation” of this great ecclesiastical event. And this doctrinal error is not made only by modernist innovators: it is also committed by neo-traditionalists who believe that Vatican II supposedly turned its back on the “traditional Church”." Yes Rose, if you might recall, many members here have expressed and discuss as such; here and elsewhere in another place (now closed down). PJD |
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| Rose of York | Wednesday, 19. December 2012, 17:58 Post #47 |
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http://www.catholicherald.co.uk/news/2012/12/19/head-of-the-cdf-urges-catholics-to-welcome-ordinariate-converts/
"Everyone who is Catholic" suggests to me that Archbishop Müller is concerned that cherry-picking points from the Church’s teachings for the sake of supporting an ideology is widespread, across the board, not confined to any particular group. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Angus Toanimo | Wednesday, 19. December 2012, 18:24 Post #48 |
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I'll not take counsel from an heretic. Thanks, but no thanks. |
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| Mairtin | Wednesday, 19. December 2012, 20:06 Post #49 |
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| Mairtin | Wednesday, 19. December 2012, 20:08 Post #50 |
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Angus, a serious question - why do you want to belong to a church which appoints a heretic as custodian of its beliefs? |
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| Rose of York | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 01:31 Post #51 |
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I cannot speak for Angus, but I will say there are people who would be glad to see the back of Archbishop Müller because he says they are heretics! Me? I think Pope Benedict is intelligent and wise, and I will trust his judgement. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Angus Toanimo | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 02:26 Post #52 |
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Because I recognise that the Holy Father is only human, has faults like the rest of us and can make mistakes or swallow bad advice just as much as you or I. Because the Head of the CDF is not the Head of the Catholic Church and, unlike the Pope, is not the visible symbol of unity in the Church. |
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| Seren | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 10:01 Post #53 |
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I have to admit this all goes over my head, my formal Catholic education having stopped at 11 years old. But I don't think this makes me a second class member of the Catholic Church. Does all this knowledge really make one a better Catholic? Reading all this makes me yearn for a more 'back to basics' approach. After all, the apostles were ordinary people.
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| Gerard | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 10:08 Post #54 |
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The apostles spent three years following The Rabbi. Most University degrees are of three years duration. No one says this level of knowlege is essential, but we are expected to use our God given gifts and intelligence is one of them. We are expected to inform our conciences. This will mean deeper study for some more than others. Gerry |
| "The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998). | |
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| Rose of York | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 13:18 Post #55 |
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The problem is, official documents produced by Cardinals at the Vatican are written in such a manner I struggle to grasp their meaning, in the English translations. People reading my posts can judge for themselves the standard of my understanding of the English language. In another topic I wrote about the new Bishop of Portsmouth
Bishop Egan's written vocabulary is similar to that used in normal conversational speech. Cardinals at the Vatican have their own language, Vaticanese. There are people who accuse Archbishop Müller of denying some basic Church doctrines. I am of the opinion what he wrote has been (understandably) misinterpreted, but not having doctorates in theology, languages and scripture I do not feel competent to explain why I think those who accuse him of heresy are mistaken. Now that documents that previously would not have been read by many laity are available on the internet, plain simple vocabulary would come in useful. I think one document should be sent to all bishops, and a more easily understandable one also available for those of us who are not highly educated in the appropriate subjects. Love the Lord your God. Love your neighbour, are easily to understand. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Seren | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 14:53 Post #56 |
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But they didn't spend those three years studying. |
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| Gerard | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 15:12 Post #57 |
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I think they did. Gerry |
| "The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998). | |
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| Seren | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 16:09 Post #58 |
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I suppose that depends on your definition of the word 'studying'. I meant it in the sense of book-learning.... So we could both be right, Gerry. Edited by Seren, Thursday, 20. December 2012, 16:09.
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| Derekap | Thursday, 20. December 2012, 18:31 Post #59 |
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Rose wrote: "The problem is, official documents produced by Cardinals at the Vatican are written in such a manner I struggle to grasp their meaning, in the English translations"" Probably the fault of too literal translations and the use of obscure expressions and words! |
| Derekap | |
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8:36 PM Jul 11