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Religion and Spirituality; When does one lose out
Topic Started: Saturday, 12. May 2012, 16:02 (929 Views)
James
James
For the purpose of this discussion, I am basing my point on a premise that religion and spirituality are seperate experiences.
One leading into the other but distinct.

Now, if a person becomes too involved in the mechanics of religion and it's personalities, do you think he/she can lose out spiritually ?

Rather like someone taken "back stage" during a performance and find "the magic is gone" .
Hustle and bustle and the mechanics of the show - but no magic on that side of things.

I often think it as I try and assimilate religious knowledge and become more aware of "behind the scenes" fiascos.


Where do you draw the line and say " I am damaging my relationship with God here "
"I need to back off and rekindle something I am in danger of losing"

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Rose of York
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James
Saturday, 12. May 2012, 16:02
Now, if a person becomes too involved in the mechanics of religion and it's personalities, do you think he/she can lose out spiritually ?
I think I know what you are getting at, James.

There is indeed danger of forgetting our religion is about our relationship with God. Currently we could do with some new topics on here about spiritual matters, or revival of existing ones. Any ideas?
Keep the Faith!

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Gerard

James,

There could be a danger, but a lot depends on what you mean by "spiritual".

Quote:
 
Rather like someone taken "back stage" during a performance and find "the magic is gone" .
Hustle and bustle and the mechanics of the show - but no magic on that side of things.


If this made one turn from men to God it could be an aid to ones spiritual life. Which reminds me of a 35 year old prophesy that is very well known within CCR. I have been thinking of it a lot recently. I posted it here before - to much derision. I may search for it and bump it.

There is also a danger in being so spiritual you are of no earthly use. Is it better to know what is going on and be disturbed or better to be in blissful ignorance? or to put it another way, naieve.

Then there is the question of spirituality. Is this about personal peace and nice feelings or is it about action for justice?

Gerry

Edited by Gerard, Saturday, 12. May 2012, 19:56.
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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Gerard



Searched but could not find it so here is a new link to an old prophesy (40 years old)
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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OsullivanB

Would anyone care to try to define these terms before we try to discuss their implications? I fear a sort of verbal equivalent of thick fog descending.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Deacon Robert
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Let me slap myself for ansewring. Gerard I see the prophesy being fulfilled today. "Little by little by cat's feet it approches".

Osb, There are many. Those who hear but can not see, a veil placed before their eyes, and many others. We just do not or can not make the connection. The problem may be ours or it is not time for us to understand.
The burden of life is from ourselves, its lightness from the grace of Christ and the love of God. - William Bernard Ullanthorne

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Gerard

Thanks Robert, yes, me too, and that is why I have been thinking about recently it and posted it.

Gerry
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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valleyboy

Pardon my ignorance, but who is Ralph Martin and what is the provenance of his revelation?
Liberal, ecumenical, universal and it's my church too.
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one of the flock

Yes , like valleyboy I have not heard of Ralph Martin and would be interested in info about him.
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Gerard


Short Bio of Ralph Martin

No interest in Bruce Yokum ?

The prophesy was given in 1975 in St Peters Basilica, Rome, Pope Paul VI was present.

Gerry
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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Jamie

OsullivanB
Sunday, 13. May 2012, 00:27
Would anyone care to try to define these terms before we try to discuss their implications? I fear a sort of verbal equivalent of thick fog descending.
I would define spirituality as the desire for God, which seems to be inbuilt into all of us, however different our ideas about what our "god/s" are.

And religion as the formal/communal expression of that desire....
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OsullivanB

Thank you, Jamie.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Mairtin
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James
Saturday, 12. May 2012, 16:02
Rather like someone taken "back stage" during a performance and find "the magic is gone" .
Hustle and bustle and the mechanics of the show - but no magic on that side of things.
I think there is, it's just a different sort of magic. It also depends whether you want to be a participant or a spectator - not suggesting that one role is better than another, just different and both needed.
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James
James
It was not my intention that this should become complicated.

It arose from a simple meditation on Christ's words " Unless you become AS little children, you cannot enter the kingdom of heaven"

I then saw a group of small children in the front row.
Eyes alight and mouths open.
They were not naive,
Innocent, I would use.
Spiritual as suggested byChrist.

Then there were the people who make it happen.
Religious in their duties. The man on the lights.
The costumers and the actors.
The producers and the cleaners etc. etc.
All attending to the various functions in order to create this experience for the children.

But somewhere, the man on the lights might glimpse out and see this innocent awe and think, I was that child once.


I look at the mass and think which of my experiences at mass are religious or spiritual.
The only spiritual experience is in the communion and no amount of knowledge can understand what is happening at that moment.

Hence my posting that "are we in danger of losing becoming " as a child"
Edited by James, Sunday, 13. May 2012, 15:09.
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Gerard

I think the OT prophets got stuck right in there.
Challenging rulers, priests and people.
Shouting in the market place, acting out prophesies, breaking pots etc.

Were they spiritual?

Gerry
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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