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| Will They Never Learn? - Part 2 | |
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| Topic Started: Saturday, 28. January 2012, 09:23 (535 Views) | |
| Mairtin | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 09:23 Post #1 |
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Once again, the Vatican responds to a problem by trying to shoot the messenger. It would make you weep. Edited by Mairtin, Saturday, 28. January 2012, 09:27.
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| Mairtin | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 09:41 Post #2 |
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More details of the story here (Reuters) Despite a personal plea to the Pope to be allowed to carry on, the guy who discovered the corruption and tried to fight it was removed from the Vatican by "promoting" him against his wishes to a post in the USA. |
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| Deleted User | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 16:57 Post #3 |
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Deleted User
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I suppose Mairtin it is always possible that the story is angled to give a particular view. However, even trying hard for this objectivity, you are spot on in suggesting that this has all the familiar signs of a cover-up , a technique used and discredited in past. financial and abuse scandals. A familiar sense of dread is hitting me! John |
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| Rose of York | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 17:29 Post #4 |
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What makes you think they want to learn? |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Rose of York | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 17:34 Post #5 |
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http://www.indcatholicnews.com/news.php?viewStory=19727
Article reproduced in full, with permission. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Derekap | Saturday, 28. January 2012, 22:13 Post #6 |
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Way back I was told that in the military and civil services when senior officials wish to have someone removed they recommend him/her for promotion. The rank in the department or unit is then "over-staffed" so the lucky person is transferred to a vacancy. |
| Derekap | |
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| Anne-Marie | Sunday, 29. January 2012, 12:26 Post #7 |
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For decades I have made no secret that I am a Catholic in spite of the Church, rather than because of it. When I learn of what our collections for the diocese are used (cover-ups of crime when all else fails) I simply withhold my money from the collection. And as at the time of the scandals which activities at the Vatican Bank threw up, I refuse to put even a penny in Peter's Pence (or whatever the HQ collection is called these days). My duty as a Christian/Catholic is to serve God, not to serve man - whether dressed in clerical uniform or not! I am not duty-bound to finance crooks and cover-ups, and were I so bound by the Church, then they could excommunicate me without causing me to lose any sleep over it, because I wouldn't need a man (pope or otherwise) to tell me they would be wrong - I'd know that for certain. In relation to the issue raised, the Vatican should have corrected what was clearly wrong (with documentation to prove it if necessary) BEFORE transferring the honest archbishop - that HQ still deludes itself into believing Catholics of any rank will be silenced about such behaviour (and will refrain from leaking it) shows just how far they have departed from serving God. (I'm still trying to decide whether I feel sorry for my outgoing parish priest, who will take up his new post there in two weeks - rather him than me) |
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Anne-Marie FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI | |
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| Rose of York | Sunday, 29. January 2012, 18:02 Post #8 |
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Don't you mean you are sick of some of the individuals in power in the Church? I join you in that. If you were sick of The Church you would have walked out by now.
Serving God? I understood that their attitude is that we should be serving THEM. Those who are corrupt N.B. - once I would have said the few who are corrupt, now I wonder whether they are majority or minority) will never learn, change if it comes will be from the bottom upwards, but why should we be treated as the bottom, the lower ranks, the non commissioned? Every one of us is a part of the Church. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Deleted User | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 10:47 Post #9 |
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The more I read about this the more depressing and worrying it gets. As far as I can see, the Vatican is making no attempt to deny the story but is simply deploring the leak of the correspondence. Its only other defence is to say that measures have now been put in place to counter the abuses listed. If we believe the media version of this, then the Pope, his Secretary of State and other senior figures not only chose to ignore corrupt financial practices but took deliberate decisions to undermine and sideline the man who uncovered these practices. A story like this would get politicians hounded from office. Where are our own bishops on this? They are the senior management and should be demanding explanations from head office. Let us give them the benefit of the doubt and imagine that they are indeed doing so discreetly. This is not good enough--this is a public scandal and needs a public response and investigation. If our bishops remain silent on our own scandal, why should the general public pay any attention when they make statemens on any other issue of public morality? Indeed, if the story is true, why should we give any credibility to these senior figures at the Vatican when they call for a Year of Faith or extol the New Evangelisation? John |
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| Rose of York | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 12:51 Post #10 |
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Now now John, it's none of our business. There are plenty of laity who will take that attitude and tell you off if you voice your reaction to this story. You will be denounced as anti Catholic, dissident, rebel, advised to find a Church that suits you. Our bishops live in the dark ages. Only a few decades ago, trade unions dealt with the culture of the employer having all the rights and the workers being told that if they were not happy with the dangerous machinery, bullying manager, or unacceptably low pay, they could always find another job. Since then the world has moved on, it is time our bishops twigged that. http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/vatican-defends-whistleblowers-transfer-to-us-181602.html
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Chris | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 13:12 Post #11 |
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The Holy Father spoke positively last year about the power of social media. It would be interesting (but unrealistic, I suspect) if there were an online poll of Catholics, that quantified our feelings about the Vatican's handling of such situations. |
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| Rose of York | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 13:30 Post #12 |
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Chris it is the lack of accountability, the secrecy and the superiority complex that make me mad. Is there any record in scripture of the first bishops, the Apostles, behaving in such a manner, as though what went on was nothing to do with laity? It beats me how so many men who supposedly felt a call from God to offer Mass and administer Sacraments end up as bankers. I doubt whether they had true vocations to priesthood in the first place. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Chris | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 14:33 Post #13 |
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Amen. "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely." John Dalberg-Acton, 1st Baron Acton |
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| Gerard | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 14:44 Post #14 |
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I have recently come to see this verse as just such an example:
Gerry |
| "The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998). | |
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| tomais | Sunday, 5. February 2012, 14:56 Post #15 |
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Take their titles away fom them;their bonuses,ie., their " Indulgences",transfer them to coperative functions in other faiths! "promote " them to jobs in the UK/EEC?Brussels. |
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