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| Pope Benedict: Jews not to blame for death of Jesus | |
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| Topic Started: Saturday, 5. March 2011, 23:34 (1,498 Views) | |
| Clare | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 15:19 Post #76 |
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
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The prayer for the perfidious Jews does not include Jews who have become Catholics, schismatics, heretics, pagans, infidels. It is for Jews who practise Judaism. If I, who am not semitic, were to start practising Judaism, the prayer would include me. And as a convert from Catholicism, I'd be even more perfidious! It is not an anti-semitic prayer, as it is not for a race. There are no prayers for races, only religions. |
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| Clare | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:10 Post #77 |
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
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The more I think about it, the more I realise how ridiculous the very idea of praying for the Jews as a race is! I mean, why not prayers for whites, or blacks, or Asians? Ridiculous. No, the Good Friday prayers are concerned with people's religious beliefs. Race is nothing to do with it. |
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| Derekap | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:23 Post #78 |
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Clare, do we pray for perfidious Protestants, perfidious Atheists, perfidious Moslems, perfidious Hindus etc etc? I don't think we do, then why use the adjective perfidious only for Jews? We may not literally pray for blacks but did you not pray for Africans, Asians and Coloureds penalised by the Apartheid Laws in the Republic of South Africa, neither their religions? Edited by Derekap, Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:24.
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| Rose of York | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:28 Post #79 |
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How about prayers for perfidious schismatic bishops and their followers?
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Rose of York | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:33 Post #80 |
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Prayer for the Jewish people. Good Friday liturgy, Easter Triduum.
Note, the phrase "continue to grow in the love of his name." The Church acknowledges the Jews are not, as a religion or race, a body of perfidious people. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Rose of York | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:41 Post #81 |
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Prayer for the Jewish people. Good Friday liturgy, Easter Triduum.
Note, the phrase "continue to grow in the love of his name." The Church acknowledges the Jews are not, as a religion or race, a body of perfidious people. |
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Keep the Faith! | |
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| Clare | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:51 Post #82 |
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
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The relationship of the Jews with Christ is special, because they were chosen, and their whole religion was preparing them for His arrival, and yet they rejected Him! |
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| Clare | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 16:53 Post #83 |
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
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It's nonsense, because they (of the religion) are not faithful to His covenant. |
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| Clare | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 17:02 Post #84 |
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
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Not on Good Friday. We're talking about the Good Friday prayers for sundry non-Catholics, not prayers for victims of social injustices. |
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| Angus Toanimo | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 18:26 Post #85 |
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I guess the word "perfidious" should be removed from the Irish song "The Foggy Dew" then, since it mentions "perfidious Albion"? Tell me, had six million Jews not perished in the last World War, would anyone be bothered about the use of "perfidious Jews" in the Good Friday prayers? I'm assuming the original composer of the old Good Friday prayer for the Jews found them to be perfidious - at which point was each and every Jew found to be not perfidious? |
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| Derekap | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 18:27 Post #86 |
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If there are any Jews still living today who rejected Jesus Christ they must be at least 2000 years old. I think that beats Methusalah. Would you like to be blamed for the martyrdom of Protestants, the burning of whitches and other events in past history? Would you like to be blamed by the Japanese for the dropping of the first atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagassaki? |
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| Derekap | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 18:40 Post #87 |
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Angus wrote: "Tell me, had six million Jews not perished in the last World War, would anyone be bothered about the use of "perfidious Jews" in the Good Friday prayers?" The Holocaust never entered my head when I heard the terrible expression. I suppose, Angus, you'll blame me for the colonialistion of Ireland and the migration of Protestant Scots to Northern Ireland? Even though they happened well before my time. |
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| Angus Toanimo | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 18:46 Post #88 |
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To be honest Derek, I asked it as a serious question. If the Holocaust never took place, would people today be bothered about the use of "perfidious" as an adjective for the Jews in the old prayer? Should I blame you for the colonisation of Ireland? Of course not, I blame that other Englishman, Nicholas Breakspear! As for the Prod Scots migration to the North - it was not a migration caused by some plight or other but a deliberate and organised plantation. |
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| Derekap | Thursday, 6. September 2012, 20:35 Post #89 |
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I answered purely on a personal note, Angus. Whether there may have been so much opposition to the adjective if there had been no Holocaust I don't know. There have been many changes in The Church in the last one hundred years and no historic event (outside The Church) has been responsible. |
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| Ned | Friday, 7. September 2012, 03:42 Post #90 |
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Hi Clare,"Race is nothing to do with it." Race or bloodline? That bloodline is very important to Jews. And it's still very important to Jesus. Please. Refresh you memory regarding St Paul's letter to the Romans - the inspired Word of God - the inspired Word of the Ascended and Glorified Jesus speaking through the Apostle Paul. And read through chapters 9, 10 and 11 in particular. http://www.usccb.org/bible/romans/9
That's just the start. You need to read through those three whole chapters, and of course you need to be, and you should be anyway, familiar with the whole letter. Regards Ned Edited by Ned, Friday, 7. September 2012, 03:47.
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8:38 PM Jul 11