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Requirements for theological knowledge
Topic Started: Monday, 29. November 2010, 19:34 (1,194 Views)
Angus Toanimo
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Just reading through this thread, I have picked up on this:

Penfold2
 
If we are to teach the next generation we shall need something less draconian than the "Penny Catechism" and yet as easy to digest


I was taught using the Penny Catechism at home and I didn't find it "draconian" at all, not as a child and not now as an adult. What is draconian about it, Father?

http://www.proecclesia.com/penny%20catechism/
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tomais

For such knowledge one would require a thorough knowledge of a wide swathe of history; how theology has slotted into the aera under study; and a wonderfull memory.
AND access to a home library and of course a sceptical view of Google. Such scepticism will come from the afore books and along the way discussions.
Conclusion; stand back; one does not need an iota of beliefe to trace theological structures throughout all aspects of history and historically related theology if one wishes to encompass the wrolds structures.
Doing all of that have a firmly bonded belief undercuts such understandings- if of course all of that matters at all.
Imagine a High court judge then with his/her training in the law! Then coming to a judgement.
Scottish judges have read Aristole.Aquinus and cone to differing end judgements-an early 2010 court case repates to this.
Enough-I am going back to my mentor.Msr Montaigne.
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KatyA

Patrick
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 13:35
Just reading through this thread, I have picked up on this:

Penfold2
 
If we are to teach the next generation we shall need something less draconian than the "Penny Catechism" and yet as easy to digest


I was taught using the Penny Catechism at home and I didn't find it "draconian" at all, not as a child and not now as an adult. What is draconian about it, Father?

http://www.proecclesia.com/penny%20catechism/
I have to agree. I still have an old penny catechism - and I know my sister does also. It's often the first port of call in any moral dilema - at least it points us in the right direction
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Rose of York
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The Penny Catechism was not of itself draconian. Much depended upon the teacher. One would scare the wits out of infant school children, over emphasising the fear of burning in Hell. One of ours told us it was a sin to play with protestant children. I did have some very good RE teachers, who taught about Heaven and Hell, virtue and vices in a balanced way.

People who lack the intellectual ability to read the Catechism or the Compendium need a simple catechism they can understand.

There have been so many changes in recent years, a book of Catholic FAQs would come in handy. It could include questions such as:

Who should I approach about an annulment.

What are the days of Fasting and Abstinence in England and Wales.

Is a Catholic permitted to receive Communion at a Church of England Communion Service?


Our bishops could go the whole hog, issue a loose leaf version. For a big fat fee one would subscribe annually, to receive weekly updates of the latest changes to the rules. :fire:
Keep the Faith!

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Derekap
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Rose wrote:

"Our bishops could go the whole hog, issue a loose leaf version. For a big fat fee one would subscribe annually, to receive weekly updates of the latest changes to the rules"

Like the change (or not) in the rules of using a condom?

:tc:
Derekap
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OsullivanB

Derekap
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 17:48
Rose wrote:

"Our bishops could go the whole hog, issue a loose leaf version. For a big fat fee one would subscribe annually, to receive weekly updates of the latest changes to the rules"

Like the change (or not) in the rules of using a condom?

:tc:
So that is what is meant by "a loose-leaf version".
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Penfold
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Rose of York
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 16:49
The Penny Catechism was not of itself draconian. Much depended upon the teacher. One would scare the wits out of infant school children, over emphasising the fear of burning in Hell.
I think this just about sums it up.
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Angus Toanimo
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Penfold2
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 19:54
Rose of York
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 16:49
The Penny Catechism was not of itself draconian. Much depended upon the teacher. One would scare the wits out of infant school children, over emphasising the fear of burning in Hell.
I think this just about sums it up.
Far better than the wishy-washy luvvy-duvvy mush that converts and schoolchildren get fed today.
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Rose of York
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Penfold2
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 19:54
Rose of York
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 16:49
The Penny Catechism was not of itself draconian. Much depended upon the teacher. One would scare the wits out of infant school children, over emphasising the fear of burning in Hell.
I think this just about sums it up.
It sums up some (not all) of the teachers, not the book.
Keep the Faith!

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K.T.B.

Patrick
Saturday, 4. December 2010, 22:00
Far better than the wishy-washy luvvy-duvvy mush that converts and schoolchildren get fed today.
Could you be more specific, Patrick?
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GonQPat

Hello Anne-Marie

My Bible punching brother said to me that Catholic theology is untrue. Amongst other questions, I asked him, whether, or not, a commentary on a Gospel parable is theology? Or, if a word study of a symbol frequently used in the Gospels is theology?

So, where does the problem lie? Is it in the nature of theology? Or, have readers been mis-lead about the nature of theology? I do believe that theology does not begin and end only at a Ph. D. thesis on Thomas Aquinas.

Just a passing thought!

Patrick Q Gonsalves
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Anne-Marie

Hi, GQP.
My concerns about theology/theologians is merely that they end up appearig to tell God what he must have done because they find that logical... and telling God what He thinks, because that is what they think, so it must make sense....

Like with the Penny Cathechism, which I still have and love, I prefer things kept simple.
The Church told me that unless the Mass was Latin Tidentine it was invalid... then that it was invalid if it was Latin Tridentine... all based on some theological point.
I'm told Our Lady was bodily assumed into Heaven: I've no way of knowing whether she was or not and I just don't spend time thinking about it... but she was, and remains, Jesus' Mum, so of course she has my respect, whether you call that devotion or otherwise.
When you read Aquinas, Augustine and others, they go to great lengths to tell you something must be so... only to find another theologian saint said something very different about what we must accept... and both are in Heaven as saints.

If I like someone, I really don't care whether they are rich or poor, executives or shop-floor.
And if I want a relationship with God, Our Lady or a saint, it is a relationship I try to have... and I really don't care to have to understand the intricacies of money-dealing, teaching, engineering, or efficient refuse collection: they are irrelevant to a relationship.
That is why I (personally of course - how else???) have no truck with theology:it is an irrelevance and obstruction to that which has meaning to/for me.
Anne-Marie
FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI
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OsullivanB

Without theologians there would be no Penny Catechism.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Rose of York
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Anne-Marie
Sunday, 5. December 2010, 20:23
Like with the Penny Cathechism, which I still have and love, I prefer things kept simple.
The Church told me that unless the Mass was Latin Tidentine it was invalid... then that it was invalid if it was Latin Tridentine... all based on some theological point.
When and where was it taught that that unless the Mass was Latin Tridentine it was invalid? The Church never taught that Tridentine Mass was no longer valid. Permission was needed, for its celebration. Cardinal Heenan obtained an indult for such Masses to be offered in England and Wales. http://www.latin-mass-society.org/resources/documents/heenan_indult

Disciplinary laws and theology are not the same thing.
Keep the Faith!

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CARLO
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Both Anna Maria and Rose are right here.

Anna Maria uses the term 'invalid' in a loose, every day sense. I know what she means. I too was told that the pre-V2 Mass was the only Mass. Post V2 I was told that it was out of date and the 'new' Mass was the preferred version. The Church in the UK then made it well nigh impossible for most Catholics to regularly attend the pre-V2 Mass for over 40 years.

Rose uses the term 'invalid' in its correct theological sense but I agree with Anna Maria's history of the matter.

Salva nos
Save us


CARLO
Judica me Deus
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