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Offensive Words
Topic Started: Thursday, 16. September 2010, 19:54 (829 Views)
Peter

Anne Marie was unfortunately taken to task on another thread regarding her use of the word Spastic to describe the gentleman who was present at the Papal Mass and clearly she meant NO offence. I performed at quite a few shows for people with disabilities and on these occasions, I was booked to do so by the Spastics Society when they were called such. When was the name changed?

Some years ago I was at BBC Television Centre and during a break in rehearsals I went into the canteen and I asked for a black coffee and was taken to task by the waitress serving who after admonishing me said , "Don't you mean a coffee with no milk?" Clearly, like Anne Marie I meant NO offence but offence was taken on that occasion. Now was it just that particular waitress that had an issue with the word black or is it a term that is a no go area now?

Trouble is, we're not told when the rules are changed.
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OsullivanB

The name was changed in 1994. See http://www.scope.org.uk/sites/default/files/pdfs/History/Scope_name_change.pdf
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Rose of York
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The document to which OSB gives a link, is long. I suggest those who do not have time to read it in full, go straight to Page 7, it depicts a black block with a list of words. One look will explain, Spastic came to be associated with words with nasty meanings.

As a general rule the people who would once have been called Spastics do not like it, so my policy is, best to avoid using the expression.
Keep the Faith!

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Eileenanne

OsullivanB
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 20:07
In the other thread, Clare said:

"When I got a copy letter from my neurologist to my GP, it mentioned that I sometimes have some spasticity and ataxia. I was not offended! Scope used to be called the Spastics' Society, as I recall, so it evidently never used to be an offensive word. "

It changed because people with cerebral palsy were offended by being called spastics. Similarly, I used to see buses with "Glasgow Cripple League" emblazoned on the side. How many of us would be happy to be ferried around in such a vehicle?

There is a difference, Clare, between the medical term "spasticity" being used by a doctor to describe someone's condition, and a person being described as "spastic" or worse, as "a spastic". "Spastic" became unacceptable when it became a term of abuse levelled against people with disabilities, often shortened to "spaz" or "spazzy". Similarly, here in Glasgow, and elsewhere for all I know, local corner shops run by Asian immigrants and their families were generally described as "the Paki's". Usually no offence was intended or taken, until the word "Paki" was hi-jacked and used as a racist taunt. (However, we still use the similarly derived "Aussie" which remains inoffensive - I think!)

The first provision made for people with what we now call Learning Difficulties or Learning Disabilities (formerly Mental Handicap) divided people into three groups: feeble-minded, idiots and imbeciles. If your child had difficulty learning would you be happy with one of those as a diagnosis? Usage of words can change and we sometimes need to be ready to adapt the language we use if we are to avoid offending others.

The black coffee incident if plain silly as the word black does not have negative overtones, at least in that situation. We occasionally hear stories of people being told to refer to chalkboards rather than blackboards, but now that these are less used in schools, I have never heard anyone suggest we stop calling their replacements "whiteboards".
I am happy to report also that my two-year old grandson is still singing "Baa Baa Black Sheep".

Eileenanne

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Rose of York
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Eileenanne has got it right. People would say of a person they considered to be foolish "He's nuts, he's a spastic". The word acquired a new meaning.

Nowadays it is considered more polite to refer to a persons with mobility problems as people with disabilities, not as "the disabled". The message is they are people with individual skills, failings, virtues, vices, good looks, ugly looks, fashion sense, interests, they are not a job lot to be placed in a category and all told to sit together in a pen just because they use walking aids or white sticks.

Since the incident when a horse injured me I have been occasionally borrowing an electric wheelchair so I can have a good "walk" along the river bank. It is a temporary measure. If I were a regular wheelchair user and my parish priest had asked me to "represent the disabled people of the diocese" at a public event I would have said "No Father, I am myself. Who will represent the walkers, who will represent the car drivers? I prefer to be with my friends and fellow parishioners"
Keep the Faith!

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tomais

Who are you offending with the use of such words or phrases.as above?
Who determines the use and usage of words and of phrases?
The law?
Common use?
A slap in the face from some one? But then how do they know?
Then of course there are those who are unaware of alterative meanings- or just plain ignorant or thick!
There are those who couldn't care less and just use any noun or adjective. Swear even! In a pub; bistro; neighboure home; on a web site!
Yesterday I was at a third medical student training day with many from overseas; ( great stuff-they pay full fees up front!)- the use of strict medical terminology to peers or consultantsok; to patients, to patient families etc? The vernacular intrudes.
Subtle eh?
Yes but sensativity plays a part-as well as the understanding of explanations at st to parallel meanings.
How would you explain the condition of that wee boy who was blessed at the end of Mass; that wee fellow in the smart grey suit?
Pope benedict just blessed him-benedicts secretary would know as the wee boy had written to the Pope.
Words are important- so for all you erudite folk with ancient yellowing parchent interpretive leanings- how would Wittengenstein approach this ?
Or just use a foreign term.
In Corstorphine Edinburgh circa 1948/9 mu neighbour was spastic.
Now bring things up to dat-
ME ?
YOU?
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K.T.B.

Rose of York
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 20:45
If I were a regular wheelchair user...
I prefer this term to the more negative sounding "wheelchair bound". I changed my vocabulary in the
'90's when I worked with adults, many of whom did use wheelchairs, in social services. I think the call for this change of wording came from the disability lobby itself.
Edited by K.T.B., Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:53.
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Anne-Marie

Well I've always called a spade 'a spade', and I ain't changin now.
I haven't got a clue what the 'correct' words are in the modern PC-correct world.
Incidentally... no-one has yet told us what is supposed to be the modern correct word in place of spastic!
As for 'black', it never ceases to fascinate me that I'm supposedly racist if I call someone 'black'... yet there are all manner of 'blacks', including incidentally, the Black Police Association!!!
Sorry guys and gals, no offence, but I'm tired of all the rubbish young people have to speak because intelligible English is now banned from their vocabulary. Praps that's why folks swear so much - there ain't no uvver *****ing language they're allowed to speak!
When I were young there was a saying that 'you can't teach an old bitch new tricks'. And I'm now one of them, so live with it. I have to, because I have no other language to speak.
Edited by Anne-Marie, Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:59.
Anne-Marie
FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI
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Clare
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Anne-Marie
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:57
Incidentally... no-one has yet told us what is supposed to be the modern correct word in place of spastic!
It's "person with cerebral palsy", I imagine. Snappy, eh?
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Rose of York
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Anne-Marie
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:57
Well I've always called a spade 'a spade', and I ain't changin now.
I haven't got a clue what the 'correct' words are in the modern PC-correct world.
Incidentally... no-one has yet told us what is supposed to be the modern correct word in place of spastic!

"Spastic" describes people with one particular medical condition. If the man used a wheelchair he is a wheelchair user, not necessarily all the time, he may have used it today because he was outdoors for a long period.

Quote:
 
Sorry guys and gals, no offence, but I'm tired of all the rubbish young people have to speak beacuse English is now banned from their vocabulary. Praps that's why folks swear so much - the ain't no uvver *****ing language they're allowed to speak!
When I were young there was a saying that 'you can't teach an old bitch new tricks'. And I'm now one of them, so live with it. I have to, because I have no other language to speak.

On this forum we do not live with swearing, with or without asterisks
Keep the Faith!

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Eileenanne

Anne-Marie
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:57
Well I've always called a spade 'a spade', and I ain't changin now.
I haven't got a clue what the 'correct' words are in the modern PC-correct world.
Incidentally... no-one has yet told us what is supposed to be the modern correct word in place of spastic!
As for 'black', it never ceases to fascinate me that I'm supposedly racist if I call someone 'black'... yet there are all manner of 'blacks', including incidentally, the Black Police Association!!!
"Black" is not generally considered racist. It is the term black people prefer as far as I know. We used to describe those with dark skin as "coloured" but mainly because in South Africa that was the term used for people of mixed race, it fell out of favour. Or maybe it was never in favour with black people themselves - i don't know about that.

"Spastic" usually referred to people with cerebral palsy, but as mentioned above it came to be a term of abuse for people with other disabilities too.

Of course you can go on calling people "spastic" if you like Anne Marie, but from now on you will be doing it with the knowledge that it is offensive.

Eileenanne
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Clare
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Rose of York
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 22:04
On this forum we do not live with swearing, with or without asterisks
You've not seen the Jokes thread then, Rose!
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K.T.B.

Anne-Marie
Thursday, 16. September 2010, 21:57

As for 'black', it never ceases to fascinate me that I'm supposedly racist if I call someone 'black'... yet there are all manner of 'blacks', including incidentally, the Black Police Association!!!

I wouldn't say the word "black" is racist to define a group of people, although it can be used to stereotype people, as can any label. A term I really loathe is "ethnics" to describe people from ethnic minorities; we all have ethnicity, don't we?

Quote:
 
When I were young there was a saying that 'you can't teach an old bitch new tricks'. And I'm now one of them, so live with it.

:laughing:
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OsullivanB

Alcholics who drink often think that "alcoholic" is an offensive term. Many of those who have ceased to drink find it a useful and innocuous term. PC is a minefield.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Clare
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I remember Joey Deacon. He was a man with cerebral palsy who was featured on Blue Peter in the early 80s, in an attempt to raise awareness among my lovely, sympathetic generation.

The outcome? A new term of abuse: "Joey Deacon".

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