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Catholic Social Teaching; Connecting with people
Topic Started: Saturday, 4. September 2010, 08:09 (885 Views)
PJD

"PJD Pope Benedict has his experiences and academic knowledge, about which I for one could teach him nothing."

What I was really suggesting Rose - was that we have much to learn to the Pope, because of his experience etc. Perhaps I put my point badly.

"Who would be best fitted to connect with the British people, on Catholic Social teaching, regarding for instance employment - a trade union leader, a company chairman, or a bishop - or all three working as a team? "

In reply to that I simply don't know how they could work together. It would be difficult wouldn't it? for each has his/her own exeriences and presumably their own agendas. Sorry to be so negative. Now if you had suggested a theologican, a bishop, and an elderly pew sitter it might be different.

PJD

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Rose of York
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PJD
Tuesday, 7. September 2010, 20:55
"Who would be best fitted to connect with the British people, on Catholic Social teaching, regarding for instance employment - a trade union leader, a company chairman, or a bishop - or all three working as a team? "

In reply to that I simply don't know how they could work together. It would be difficult wouldn't it? for each has his/her own exeriences and presumably their own agendas. Sorry to be so negative. Now if you had suggested a theologican, a bishop, and an elderly pew sitter it might be different.

PJD

The idea was that the company chairman and/or the trade unionist would be pew sitters! I am not so sure that it matters whether they are elderly.

For good measure lets chuck in a banker with a social conscience.
Keep the Faith!

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PJD

"I am not so sure that it matters whether they are elderly."

I think it does matter Rose. Not in all cases, but at the least age generally brings experience.

PJD
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James
James
Mairtin
Saturday, 4. September 2010, 08:09
The BBC has published the results of an online poll about the Pope's visit. I don't want to discuss the findings about reactions to the Pope's visit, that is better done in the thread dedicated to the visit, but in the middle of the report comes this little gem:

Quote:
 
In the Theos survey, researchers also put 12 statements - taken without naming the source - from the Pope's third encyclical letter which outlines his social policy, to people taking part in the survey.

A majority backed 11 out of the 12 extracts, including 82% agreeing with the statement "technologically advanced societies can and must lower their domestic energy consumption".

Some 79% agreed with the Pope's statement "the natural environment is more than raw material to be manipulated at our pleasure".

Paul Wolley, director of Theos, said ... "What is really striking is not simply that the public tends to agree with Pope Benedict's social teaching but that they agree so strongly.

"This confirms the view that beneath the terrible stories of sex abuse that have dominated coverage of the Catholic church in recent times, there remains real potential for the church to connect with the public."

At the end of the article there is a quote from a spokesman for the Catholic Bishops' Conference who said it was pleased the survey showed the majority of people agreed with Catholic social teaching. So why don't they get off their backsides and do more to publicise this teaching?

I've been convinced for a long time that the message of our Church is still the message that society at large wants to hear, not least in the times we have recently been through; I have been equally depressed at how desperately bad our Church has become at promoting that message.
Who writes this stuff ??
Promote what message ?
Communicate on this level ?
What level ?
Who does the communicating ?.

Where is Paul - Corinthians first letter chapter 12 in all this communicatrion ?

He seems to say it is comprised of various individula gifts from the Holy Spirit in each of us and each to our own way
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PJD

"Who writes this stuff ??
Promote what message ?
Communicate on this level ?
What level ?
Who does the communicating ?.

Where is Paul - Corinthians first letter chapter 12 in all this communicatrion ?

He seems to say it is comprised of various individula gifts from the Holy Spirit in each of us and each to our own way "


I agree with you here James. That is if I am reading you correctly.

A lot of what is being said is pie in the sky. The abuse scandal most certainly has almost zapped any "potential for the church to connect with the public." And added to that it appears that at least half of Catholics think the hierarchy are incapable of effective leadership.

PJD
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Mairtin
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James
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 00:58
Who writes this stuff ??
Well seeing that you've quoted it from my post with my name at the start of the quote, I guess it's me :wh:

James
 
Promote what message ?

The Good News.

James
 
Communicate on this level ?
What level ?

On every possible level. Another St. Paul quote -1 Corinthians 9:22 - seems appropriate "To the weak I became weak, that I might gain the weak. I became all things to all men, that I might save all."

Quote:
 
Who does the communicating ?.

Where is Paul - Corinthians first letter chapter 12 in all this communicatrion ?

He seems to say it is comprised of various individual gifts from the Holy Spirit in each of us and each to our own way

Yes indeed, all of us have a role to play but the lead should and must come from our Bishops especially when the highly autocratic nature of our Church makes it extremely difficult for laypeople to take any initiative without hierarchical support.
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James
James
\Yes, I thi8nk you are PJD and my comment was not against Mairtin in any way.

It is just that communication seems to have taken on a statistical and promotional extension.
Which becomes the norm - outside agencies promotion type of thing.
Them and us.
The pope becomes the centre point of journalistic display whilst the Holy Spirit and His central role in all of us fades sadly into the background.

Actually with Paul there is not them or us iin the Church,
There is only the Holy Spirit at wotk in each one of us - communicating His gifts through each one.

Roll on St. Paul - we are not dead yet !!
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James
James
Sorry Mairtin,
Our post seem to have crossed and it was only after rerading it that I also saw it could be directed at your comment - which it wasn't.

It is the statistical percentages thing thta gets up my nose when it is applied to the teachings.
The child abuse is containable as long as the image projected is ok on this lower level.
If you follow me.

I don't think Paul would see it that way

Apologies again if wrong impression given James
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PJD

Ditto for me Mairtin; I did not see any direct connection between what James was saying and anthing you had said.

PJD
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Mairtin
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James
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 10:32
It is the statistical percentages thing thta gets up my nose when it is applied to the teachings.
The child abuse is containable as long as the image projected is ok on this lower level.
If you follow me.
I don't quite follow you.

Look at it this way, when teachings of the Church related to social policy were put to people, those people overwhelmingly endorsed those policies.

If, instead of the specific policies being detailed to those people, they had been asked a general question along the lines of "Are the Catholic Church's teachings on social policy relevant to the world today?", I'm willing to bet my last penny that the vast majority would have said "No" or, at best. "Don't know" which I think is just as bad.

The key point here as I see it is that despite the bad press that the Church tends to get about things like contraception and homosexuality, many - possibly most - of her teachings would be accepted by people if they knew about them.

To my mind, the problem is not so much one of the Church's teachings being difficult for people to accept, it's more a case of our Church being totally ineffective at communicating those teachings.

James
 
Apologies again if wrong impression given James

No problem.
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Rose of York
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Mairtin
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 11:08
To my mind, the problem is not so much one of the Church's teachings being difficult for people to accept, it's more a case of our Church being totally ineffective at communicating those teachings.
Do they try?

If I had not attended a grammar school I would not have known the Church has any social teachings. In seventy years as a Catholic I have not heard their existence mentioned, in preaching.

It may be they think the pew warmers are too thick to understand.

Sorry, I am in a mood. TV programme this morning has not helped. The question was "Is the Catholic Church obsessed with sex?" The public know our Church has teaching about sex, they do not know we have teaching about social justice.
Keep the Faith!

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Anne-Marie

Rose of York
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 11:35
TV programme this morning has not helped. The question was "Is the Catholic Church obsessed with sex?"
And came the answer, Rose : 'No, but it has some very dysfunctional leaders'
Anne-Marie
FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI
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James
James
Mairtin
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 11:08
James
Sunday, 12. September 2010, 10:32
It is the statistical percentages thing thta gets up my nose when it is applied to the teachings.
The child abuse is containable as long as the image projected is ok on this lower level.
If you follow me.
I don't quite follow you.

Look at it this way, when teachings of the Church related to social policy were put to people, those people overwhelmingly endorsed those policies.

If, instead of the specific policies being detailed to those people, they had been asked a general question along the lines of "Are the Catholic Church's teachings on social policy relevant to the world today?", I'm willing to bet my last penny that the vast majority would have said "No" or, at best. "Don't know" which I think is just as bad.

The key point here as I see it is that despite the bad press that the Church tends to get about things like contraception and homosexuality, many - possibly most - of her teachings would be accepted by people if they knew about them.

To my mind, the problem is not so much one of the Church's teachings being difficult for people to accept, it's more a case of our Church being totally ineffective at communicating those teachings.

James
 
Apologies again if wrong impression given James

No problem.
I think the problem between us lies in your last sentence Mairtin,
"our church being totally ineffective "

How do you define "our church"

There are two approaches as I see it.
One is a "them and us" approach.
The Vatican, The hierarchy, bishops, priests etc. and then at the bottom the "Joe Soaps"
Much like a multi national business group.

Then we have a second viewpoint.
More organic in the sense that each individual is a part who is given a gift in particuler to communicate.
Has been aptly described as "the mystical body of Christ"
A mystical organism.
Paul has described it as an outpouring of the Holy Spirit into each soul where there is no differenial between male or female, slave or master, jew or gentile.
We are the church, in Christ, as an organic force.
If you follow.

Sin is and always will be in all of us, but through the Mystical body, we can be made whole.
There will never be a time when there is no sin in the church.
Redemption is what it is all about.

I think after that , it all depends an how you "see" "the church"
There are those selected to ensure that the faith is preserved - which we call hierarchy - but in the eyes of some " The greater become the lesser" and Christ will wash the feet of the apostles.

Edited by James, Wednesday, 15. September 2010, 00:35.
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Gerard

James,

An outstanding post.

Gerry

"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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Rose of York
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At last! One of our bishops has connected via the Opinion section of a good quality regional newspaper.

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/opinion/Arthur-Roche-Papal-progress-that.6534163.jp

It is an excellent piece, with much about social justice. I will quote two snippets.

Quote:
 
Secondly, Pope Benedict writes of the Church's "service of charity". He argues that its message is only credible where Christians engage in practical efforts to care for the vulnerable. In the Diocese of Leeds, I am glad to report, there are many such initiatives, including the care of down and outs, prostitutes, prisoners, the homeless, asylum seekers, those with learning difficulties, the sick and the dying, the elderly, young people and children in schools, those with mental difficulties, the severely impaired and, up until recently, a good adoption service.

This is to name but a few. People of faith have an enormous
contribution to make to our society in this way.

I hope that the Pope's visit will inspire more Catholics to engage in local charitable work, not least through the great work which the St Vincent de Paul Society does in so many of our parishes.


and the bit I really like
Quote:
 
It is important that we get out and about and resist the temptation of remaining a holy huddle. In this respect, I am interested to know more about the Conservative's idea of the "Big Society," whose principles seem to correspond in large part with Catholic social teaching.

This man writes in language we can understand. He knows all about holy huddles!
Keep the Faith!

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