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Scottish Conversions; Cardinal Newman's Influence
Topic Started: Tuesday, 31. August 2010, 16:18 (236 Views)
tomais

Trusting that this enquiry is posted into the correct site.
When cardinal newman was ill he visited melrose to recuperate and did so with Sir Walter Scott at Abbotsfird. The Cardinal visiet Scott on numerous occaisions.
The cardinal also over time remarked on the conversions of many." upper class and laird type Scots. The papacy was even noted to have remarked upon this.
Scott of course did not convert- time and ill health perhaps.
Is this of note for readers and worth comment.
One such is a descendant, of the Lothian family, is a Conservative MP for a near London Constituency.
Much such source material is fom Michael Turnbull a noted historian and himself a Catholic.
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CARLO
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Very interesting stuff Tomais, thanks for posting it.

I rather suspect that converting prominent and sometimes rich people is not flavour of the month today but there is a long tradition of it.

It has an important part to play in gaining influence for the Church as well as saving souls in this once protestant and now increasingly secular UK.

Veritas
Truth


CARLO
Judica me Deus
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OsullivanB

Fr Michael Seed was doing just that until very recently.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Rose of York
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CARLO
Tuesday, 31. August 2010, 20:11
Very interesting stuff Tomais, thanks for posting it.

I rather suspect that converting prominent and sometimes rich people is not flavour of the month today but there is a long tradition of it.

It has an important part to play in gaining influence for the Church as well as saving souls in this once protestant and now increasingly secular UK.

Veritas
Truth


CARLO
Good morning Father, you know me, I deliver your post. I'd like to see you some time, I have been reading and praying about the Catholic Church, I would like to have some instruction please, just to iron out a few points I find it hard to understand.

I'm awfully sorry, I am a very busy man. An MP is coming to see me about just the same thing, for the next two years I will be tried up giving private instruction to a cabinet minister. One must prioritise. Influence for the Church is important. We have group classes for people like you. Come along if you feel like it, somebody will help you save your soul.

:wh:

Keep the Faith!

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Rose of York
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tomais
Tuesday, 31. August 2010, 16:18
When cardinal newman was ill he visited melrose to recuperate and did so with Sir Walter Scott at Abbotsfird. The Cardinal visiet Scott on numerous occaisions.
The cardinal also over time remarked on the conversions of many." upper class and laird type Scots. The papacy was even noted to have remarked upon this.
Did the papacy remark on the number of poor Scots who were converted? Was social class significant?

I have much admiration for the landed rich who kept the faith during recusant days. If caught attending Mass, they risked losing all they had, and they were not allowed to hold public office.
Keep the Faith!

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CARLO
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OsullivanB
Tuesday, 31. August 2010, 20:59
Fr Michael Seed was doing just that until very recently.
Yes and of course Knox and Gilbey and many others............

Veritas
Truth

CARLO
Judica me Deus
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Gerard

"There is great rejoicing in Heaven over the conversion of a single arstocrat"

Err I think my memory of that verse is wrong but cant quite put my finger on it. Better look it up ..

Gerry
"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).
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tomais

Michael Ancrum -X MP !
Name of Kerr; Lothian family. Interesting story to the Lothians,the family) . My Mother-in-Law a pupil teacher in Haddington East Lothian was pursuaded by Lady Lothian,( Kerr family I believe) to go to London and learn how to become a governness. Which she did. subsidised; Became a governness / teacher to Members of the Spanish Royal Family in Madrid and elsewhere even travelling whilst they embarked on their luxurious holidays; SanSebastian-Switzerland.
Mis Grant,as she then was, was from an Irish background- surprise surprise!
Fay,my wife has documents from that time.Once on holiday in Madrid we meet with an elderly lady- one of the children Miss Grant taught.
The Aragon Family.
So the aristocracy did further much education and enterprise.
Michael Ancrum is a pleasant fellow-albeit we do differ on certain small issues.
I hope that you do not mind the wee personal touch.
PS- in case some one is wodering-Grant is not so much an uncommon name in the south west of Ireland; Grants X Scots from the religious purges in 16th Century Scotland.
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tomais

Cardinal Newman vestments are being bought to Edinburgh this week from Sir Walter Scotts home in Abbotsford. How many folk knew that these vestments were there?
Well we know now.
neat juxtapositioning of names-Abbotsford etc!
Question- how and why were they left in Abbotsford house?
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Poesy
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tomais
Wednesday, 8. September 2010, 11:36
Cardinal Newman vestments are being bought to Edinburgh this week from Sir Walter Scotts home in Abbotsford. How many folk knew that these vestments were there?
Well we know now.
neat juxtapositioning of names-Abbotsford etc!
Question- how and why were they left in Abbotsford house?

Thank you for that intersting information about Abbotsford Tomias, I did a search and found the anwer to your question. All is revealed here:-


Centuries-old vestments from Scotland have been unveiled ahead of a viewing by the Pope next week.

The two garments were worn by Cardinal John Henry Newman, who will be beatified by Pope Benedict XVI during his visit to Britain next week.

The Cardinal gifted the ornate vestments to Abbotsford House in the Scottish Borders following stays at the property in 1852 and 1872.

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home-news/holy-relics-unveiled-ahead-of-ceremony-1.1053583

Edited by Poesy, Wednesday, 8. September 2010, 14:07.
Domine Jesu, noverim me .
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CARLO
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Tomais and Poesy,

Thank you so much for this fascinating information.

What a delight that the vestments have been kept safe in private hands!

Gloria!


CARLO
Edited by CARLO, Wednesday, 8. September 2010, 23:15.
Judica me Deus
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