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Thomas Kempis; The Imitation of Christ
Topic Started: Friday, 6. August 2010, 20:50 (210 Views)
Poesy
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Does anyone know whether Thomas Kempis was beatified?



What prompted my question was the story that Thomas a Kempis was never made a saint because it was siad that when they dug up his body for the ossuary , they found scratch marks on the lid of his coffin, showing signs that he was buried alive, and this is almost automatically grounds to end the canonization process, due to the possibility of despair.


Poor Thomas Kempis, how cruel.



Edited by Poesy, Friday, 6. August 2010, 21:09.
Domine Jesu, noverim me .
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Derekap
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I don't!
Derekap
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Anne-Marie

Thomas a Kempis does not appear on the list of Catholic saints, Poesy.

My PP once mentioned about despair being an automatic dis-qualifier for sainthood. What it is impossible for any of us to know is whether such scratch marks in a coffin indicate despair!
Think about it: you wake up in the dark (no light supplied in the coffin!!), you seem to be locked into something, and not unreasonably try to work out where you are, what's going on and whether you can reach some form of normailty that makes sense to you. While that can be despair (on not finding a way out of the real-lifenightmare scenario), it doesn't have to be despair... though I suspect very few saints would have just lain back and thought of England!!

Which, of course, rather raises the issue of whether what popes/Church declares to be a saintly person has anything whatever to do with whether the person is anywhere near Heaven, or even already there!
And once you start questioning the link twixt the reality of God and the activities/teachings of the Magisterium/pope/Church, the whole thing is in danger of unraveling! Because the practices of the Church (such as saying not knowing where you are and trying to find out and put right whatever has 'gone wrong' precludes sainthood) shows a very obvious dis-connect with the reality of God.
Anne-Marie
FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI
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Poesy
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Thanks Anne-Marie, Though we can be sure that Thomas' soul is now in heaven, I do agree with what you say. How on earth can the Church judge what was going through Thomas Kempis' mind ? He could well have prayed and said, 'Father , into thy hands I commit my spirit'.


A thought that also occurred to me what the final words our dear Lord uttered from the Cross.

Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachthani.

My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me? Why are You so far from helping Me, and from the words of My groaning? O My God, I cry in the daytime, but You do not hear; And in the night season, and am not silent." (Psalm 22:1-2)

Is this not a cry of despair?

Also Our Lord prayed in the Garden of Gethsemane,
'Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee, take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

.







Domine Jesu, noverim me .
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garfield

No mention of being buried alive here
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14661a.htm
just that the person promoting his cause for sainthood died
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Poesy
Saturday, 7. August 2010, 09:00
Thanks Anne-Marie, Though we can be sure that Thomas' soul is now in heaven, I do agree with what you say. How on earth can the Church judge what was going through Thomas Kempis' mind ? He could well have prayed and said, 'Father , into thy hands I commit my spirit'.
It doesn't follow that because the Church hasn't or won't canonise someone that she believes he is in Hell. Just that the heroic virtue was lacking, I guess.

Quote:
 
A thought that also occurred to me what the final words our dear Lord uttered from the Cross.

Eli, Eli, Lama Sabachthani.

My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me? Why are You so far from helping Me, and from the words of My groaning? O My God, I cry in the daytime, but You do not hear; And in the night season, and am not silent." (Psalm 22:1-2)

Is this not a cry of despair?


I understood that Our Lord was quoting a Psalm there.
S.A.G.

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