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Left Wing, Right Wing, moderate, extreme
Topic Started: Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 12:27 (2,136 Views)
Mairtin
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Clare
Monday, 7. June 2010, 16:20
Guess what, though. Church teaching supports the death penalty, and just war, although, a just war is nigh on impossible these days. The death penalty, though, is certainly supported by Church teaching.
I think you have to be careful with the label "Church teaching", neither the death penalty nor just war are dogma, they have both changed through the ages and are liable to change again.

Quote:
 
Quite often, those who are most pro-abortion are also anti-death penalty. Now that is bizarre. Supporting the killing of the innocent, while opposing the killing of the guilty.

Leaving aside your 'guilty' label, that is a perfect example of why I think taking these areas together could stimulate useful debate.
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Mairtin
Monday, 7. June 2010, 16:58
I think you have to be careful with the label "Church teaching", neither the death penalty nor just war are dogma, they have both changed through the ages and are liable to change again.
No they haven't.
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Mairtin
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End of discussion.
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Rose of York
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Sorry but I'm laughing my head off, enjoying reading this ding-dong. First the two of you admit you have already gone over this ground time and time again, I go out for a couple of hours and return to find you're still at it. My, you two have energy, you don't even need a half time break for refreshment. Do you simultaneous joint meal breaks? You could ask members to sponsor you so much per word, proceeds to a charity of the winner's choice.

Carry on, lady and gent.
Keep the Faith!

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Mairtin
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Rose of York
Monday, 7. June 2010, 18:22
Carry on, lady and gent.
No thanks, Rose, I was genuinely interested in a serious debate on this extremely important topic but I should really have followed my original instincts that such a debate is simply impossible.
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Mairtin
Monday, 7. June 2010, 17:55
End of discussion.
Sorry about the brevity of my last post but I was cooking dinner!

Still, I don't see how asserting "No they haven't" and not backing it up is any worse than saying "they have" and not backing it up.
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Mairtin
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Sorry, I'm not biting, Clare.
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Rose of York
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I thought Left WIng, Right Wing, moderate, extreme was something to do with liturgy, and Councils with a capital C. One lives and learns!
Keep the Faith!

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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Rose of York
Monday, 7. June 2010, 19:55
I thought Left WIng, Right Wing, moderate, extreme was something to do with liturgy, ...
No, you're thinking of Gospel side, Epistle side, nave, and flying buttress, Rose!
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Rose of York
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Clare
Monday, 7. June 2010, 20:53
Rose of York
Monday, 7. June 2010, 19:55
I thought Left WIng, Right Wing, moderate, extreme was something to do with liturgy, ...
No, you're thinking of Gospel side, Epistle side, nave, and flying buttress, Rose!
:rofl:
Keep the Faith!

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Derekap
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Don't forget the Narthex, as a convert priest I knew referred to the entrance.
Derekap
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Mairtin
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There's a very interesting and relevant editorial in today's Tablet about the Pope's speech last week in Portugal regarding secularism and the Church.

Here's an extract:
Quote:
 
The challenge of secularism to the Church is a larger version of the pluralism that already characterises the ecumenical scene – how to work towards shared objectives with those with whom one does not totally agree. There was no call here for a return to the Catholic ascendancy, nor even for the laws of the state to comply with the moral teaching of the Church. His remarks on abortion could almost have been an endorsement of the policy adopted by President Barack Obama in the United States: he praised “all those social and pastoral initiatives aimed at combating the socio-economic and cultural mechanisms which lead to abortion …”

The encounter between faith and secularism had shown a prevailing tendency towards “opposition and mutual exclusion”, he said. But this not inevitable. “The presence of secularism is something normal, but the separation and the opposition between secularism and a culture of faith is something anomalous and must be transcended. The great challenge of the present moment is for the two to come together, and in this way to discover their true identity.” He cautioned against “an excessive trust in ecclesial structures and programmes” and over-reliance on “simply proclaiming the message”. Even more surprising, given Pope Benedict’s opposition to relativism, was his telling the Cultural Centre at Belém, Lisbon, that the Church “is in the process of learning how to live with respect for other ‘truths’ and for the truth of others … Dialogue, without ambiguity and marked by respect for those taking part, is a priority in today’s world.”


I'll take some consolation from the fact that I seem to be on the same wavelength as his holiness :wh:
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Rose of York
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Mairtin
Monday, 7. June 2010, 22:47
I'll take some consolation from the fact that I seem to be on the same wavelength as his holiness :wh:
Right wingers will not like it. Oh dearie dearie me!
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Rose of York
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The Tablet
 
There was no call here for a return to the Catholic ascendancy, nor even for the laws of the state to comply with the moral teaching of the Church. His remarks on abortion could almost have been an endorsement of the policy adopted by President Barack Obama in the United States: he praised “all those social and pastoral initiatives aimed at combating the socio-economic and cultural mechanisms which lead to abortion …”


It looks to me as though The Tablet misinterpret the Pope's words. He praised “all those social and pastoral initiatives aimed at combating the socio-economic and cultural mechanisms which lead to abortion …” That is hardly support for abortion.
Keep the Faith!

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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Rose of York
Monday, 7. June 2010, 23:17
The Tablet
 
There was no call here for a return to the Catholic ascendancy, nor even for the laws of the state to comply with the moral teaching of the Church. His remarks on abortion could almost have been an endorsement of the policy adopted by President Barack Obama in the United States: he praised “all those social and pastoral initiatives aimed at combating the socio-economic and cultural mechanisms which lead to abortion …”


It looks to me as though The Tablet misinterpret the Pope's words. He praised “all those social and pastoral initiatives aimed at combating the socio-economic and cultural mechanisms which lead to abortion …” That is hardly support for abortion.
No, it's not a misinterpretation, it's spin.

That nun, Sr Helen Prejean, has also tried to make Obama's policies out to be pro-life. Reckons his social policies would result in fewer abortions. Nonsense of course.
S.A.G.

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