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Left Wing, Right Wing, moderate, extreme
Topic Started: Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 12:27 (2,131 Views)
Anne-Marie

I have been intrigued at a discussion that's broken out in another thread about whether you have to be right wing, left wing, or whatever just because you are gay, or have several children, or don't object to abortion, or have sex with someone you're not married to....
Complete nonsense, of course, but I guess it keeps some people amused reading the ludicrous prejudices of others.

I like eating bananas (they tend not to be as acidic as apples): does that make me right wing... or left wing?
I drive a car: yes, alright, that definitely makes me very right wing.
I do use public transport when it goes where I want and isn't expensive: Oh well, that makes me very left wing indeed.

This stuff is utter nonsense.
Right wing and left wing are normally understood in English (particularly in England) to refer to a relative position regarding libertarianism and rigid state control - which starts to get really ridiculous when we recall that Fascism (normally understood to be about as far right wing as you can get without falling off the end!!) practices considerable state control and reacts harshly to those who have a different opinion to that promoted by the State.

Whether you prefer your Mass in Latin or the Tridentine form has nothing to do with right and left, any more than a preference for a banana or an apple does;
People having lots of kids used to be thought... no, scrub that - both rich and poor managed that in the good ole days;
Like it or not, homosexuality has to do with your natural state/identity or a powerful natural/instinctive reaction to the same sex, rather than the other one - noting whatever to do with right or left wing;
As for sex... well that's about as natural an instinct as comes our way - it's also a lovely way of expressing the most wonderful and tender feelings for someone you feel precious beyond words... ans certainly has nothing whatever to do with politics, right or left;
As for abortion... well... that's just an expression of total selfishness, happy to murder someone to rid oneself of an 'inconvenient' result of one's own behaviour!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What the heck any of this has to do with right wing or left wing is totally beyond me.
Though I guess it does serve as a pretty neat way of condemning and dismissing those who disagree with us and won't shut up....
Anne-Marie
FIAT VOLUNTAS DEI
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Mairtin
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Anne-Marie
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 12:27
Though I guess it does serve as a pretty neat way of condemning and dismissing those who disagree with us and won't shut up....
That just about sums it up, Anne-Marie :deadhorse:
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Rose of York
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Anne-Marie
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 12:27
Whether you prefer your Mass in Latin in 3or the Tridentine form has nothing to do with right and left, any more than a preference for a banana or an apple does;
Anne-Marie by making that point with only thirty one words, one comma and one semi colon you demonstrate that you have left wing leanings.

A truly right wing person whose education was at a monastic school and a Gregorian University, followed by a lifetime following the standard pattern for clerical officer class (lecturer, bishops secretary, head of an agency of the bishops conference, secretary to the bishops conference, bishop, archbishop them cardinal) would have taken the trouble to tell us the same, in thirty thousand words.
Keep the Faith!

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PJD

"That just about sums it up, Anne-Marie"

I would second that Mairtin.

For amusement, if you were constructing a ship to go to Mars, any ideas left or right wing and you'd be dead.

PJD
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Rose of York
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Right wing is traditionally posh. Left wing is traditionally working class. I deduce that both right and left wing are trads. The question is, of the two wings which is the more extremely extremist?
Keep the Faith!

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Mairtin
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Rose of York
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 16:54
Right wing is traditionally posh. Left wing is traditionally working class.
Which group did Jesus generally support - the posh class or the working class?
:tc:
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OsullivanB

The only thing we know for certain about this is that Jesus is to the right of the Father.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Let's see.

If you knew of a state which criminalised abortion and homosexuality, for example, would you ever believe that such a government might be left wing?
S.A.G.

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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Anne-Marie
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 12:27
Right wing and left wing are normally understood in English (particularly in England) to refer to a relative position regarding libertarianism and rigid state control - which starts to get really ridiculous when we recall that Fascism (normally understood to be about as far right wing as you can get without falling off the end!!) practices considerable state control and reacts harshly to those who have a different opinion to that promoted by the State.
And what about those easy-going left wing Communists?

Quote:
 
Whether you prefer your Mass in Latin or the Tridentine form has nothing to do with right and left,


Who said it did?

Quote:
 
Like it or not, homosexuality has to do with your natural state/identity or a powerful natural/instinctive reaction to the same sex, rather than the other one - noting whatever to do with right or left wing;


No, but legislation in its regard does seem to have something to do with it.

Quote:
 
As for abortion... well... that's just an expression of total selfishness, happy to murder someone to rid oneself of an 'inconvenient' result of one's own behaviour!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You are missing the point, Anne-Marie. I never said that sinners were left wing and saints were right wing! I'm not referring to people's behaviour. I am referring to the law and what it allows, and what society accepts!
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
This is all ridiculous of course. I just get fed up when a person or group of people is unthinkably described as "right wing", as if nothing more needs to be said to condemn someone. Right-wingness is the fifth sin that cries to Heaven for vengeance, apparently. And right wing people are always extreme, and that is condemnable, whereas extreme left wingers, well, they're just fine! In fact, they're not even extreme!

Dismissing someone as right wing (or left wing) is not good enough. It is lazy. And I only mention the left-wing in response to others who believe that labelling someone "right wing" speaks for itself and is enough to condemn a person. It isn't.

So, there are right wing pro-lifers. So what? What is wrong with them, in particular? What are their erroneous "right wing" views?
S.A.G.

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OsullivanB

Clare
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 18:18
Let's see.

If you knew of a state which criminalised abortion and homosexuality, for example, would you ever believe that such a government might be left wing?
Cuba's communists criminalised homosexuality and did so very savagely, to take but one example.

That strengthens rather than weakens what I take to be your essential point, that right and left are often used as indications of disapproval rather than tools of analysis.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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PJD

"That strengthens rather than weakens what I take to be your essential point, that right and left are often used as indications of disapproval rather than tools of analysis."

Yes that seems logical and Aquinas would agree - deviate from the 'mean' of virtue and you risk ending with it's vice.

PJD
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Mairtin
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Clare
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 18:18
Let's see.

If you knew of a state which criminalised abortion and homosexuality, for example, would you ever believe that such a government might be left wing?
Yes, I believe they might be left wing. I also believe they might be right wing. I also believe they might be any-in-between wing.
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Mairtin
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Clare
Tuesday, 1. June 2010, 18:30
This is all ridiculous of course ... Dismissing someone as right wing (or left wing) is not good enough.
In the other thread, you claimed
Quote:
 
Because the world has moved to the extreme left, that makes what was mainstream opinion a few decades ago "extreme right wing".


I'm glad you have seen the error of your ways :fire:
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Rose of York
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This is all ridiculous of course. I just get fed up when a person or group of people is unthinkably described as "extreme modernist", as if nothing more needs to be said to condemn someone. And traditionalists are always extreme, and that is condemnable, whereas extreme lmodernists, well, they're just fine! In fact, they're not even extreme!

Dismissing someone as modernist (or traditionalist) is not good enough. It is lazy. And I only mention the modernists in response to others who believe that labelling someone "speaks for itself and is enough to condemn a person. It isn't.

So, there are left wing modernists. So what? What is wrong with them, in particular? What are their erroneous "left wing" views?
Keep the Faith!

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