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| Pastoral Letter | |
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| Topic Started: Friday, 16. October 2009, 15:53 (162 Views) | |
| Fortunatus | Friday, 16. October 2009, 15:53 Post #1 |
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May I draw the attention of readers of this forum to a pastoral letter issued by Bishop Nickless of the diocese of Sioux City, Iowa. Would to God that some of the bishops of Enlgnad and Wales (and Scotland) could produce something as simple and theologically sound. http://www.catholicglobe.org/no%20byline%20local%20news45.1.html |
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| Powerofone | Friday, 16. October 2009, 16:05 Post #2 |
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"Pope John Paul the Great" He's "the Great" now? When did this happen? Did I miss the announcement? By whose authority? If canonisation requires the services of a devil's advocate, shouldn't the same be required of a greatification? Isn't it all just a tad premature? Edited by Powerofone, Friday, 16. October 2009, 16:06.
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| OsullivanB | Friday, 16. October 2009, 17:33 Post #3 |
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Or to accommodate the latin root of the "ification": magnification. Anyhow, I was very pleased to see Fortunatus post - unless I've been inattentive, it's been a while. Edited by OsullivanB, Friday, 16. October 2009, 17:35.
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| Rose of York | Friday, 16. October 2009, 17:43 Post #4 |
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I have skimmed the document, with the time available, it appears to be just what we could do with here in England and Wales. |
  Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards | |
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| Deacon Robert | Friday, 16. October 2009, 18:11 Post #5 |
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P1, There was a discussion about "the great" among some of the Deacons. One teaches theology and church history at a Catholic college. The title great comes from popular acclaimation not from a Vatican declaration, much the same as Saints were in the early church. Eventually sometime in the future may add "The Great" to JPII in official documents. |
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| Mairtin | Friday, 16. October 2009, 18:46 Post #6 |
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A splendid document and easily understandable, unlike those we generally get in tis part of the world. I particularly like this bit:
Any chance of people on this forum taking that on board? Edited by Mairtin, Friday, 16. October 2009, 18:46.
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Online Prayer - Night Prayer, Rosary and Lectio Divina Visit www.roomtopray.net for details of days and times | |
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| Powerofone | Friday, 16. October 2009, 19:34 Post #7 |
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I have seen no such popular groundswell. Only clerics seek to magnify themselves and their office. That my first notice of it comes from bishop leads me to suspect that a campaign of cod popular support for the posthumous title is being orchestrated. Isn't it strange that bishops ignore the vox populi on all other matters yet are supposedly attentive to those same people at the first stirrings of magnification? |
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| Derekap | Friday, 16. October 2009, 21:03 Post #8 |
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The Bishop certainly loves his hermeneutics. I wonder how many lay people will read it right through,understand the word hermeneutics, and take any action. It is a word which I never came across until about 5 years ago It is well-written but I frankly suspect it may be too long for it to be very effective. I wandered further in the website and noted an item regarding a church which was closing. Also an item by the Bishop on his plans for the diocese. Can our members in The USA please explain what a "reading" priest (sic) is? |
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| Fortunatus | Friday, 16. October 2009, 21:48 Post #9 |
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There was at the time of John Paul's death. Nauseatingly reminiscent of the week after the death of Diana, Princess of Wales. Fortunately it died down. As someone who was brought up in the days of stiff upper lips, I always distrust these instant outbursts though that may say more about me than about the 'outbursters'. Experience tells me that unless they are curbed the emotion of the moment usually ends up making a big mistake. Derek ----- even at my relatively advanced age I am not afraid to learn and one of my most-thumbed volumes is a dictionary. I recommend them. 
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| Rose of York | Friday, 16. October 2009, 22:59 Post #10 |
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I gain the impression this bishop proposes keeping the baby and retrieving the bathwater. He has just closed a church, due to priest shortage. With a bishop who proposes retaining all that is good, and building upon it, encouraging Eucharistic devotion, regular Confession, good catechesis for adults as well as school pupils, and good liturgy and music (whether modern or traditional) he might well find an upsurge in vocations to priesthood and religious life. |
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Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards | |
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| Deacon Robert | Saturday, 17. October 2009, 12:26 Post #11 |
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P1, This is the first I have seen by clergy. I have heard it repeatedly from the laity, especially in my parish where the majority ar of Polish background. Personally I could not care less, but many feel he is among the greatest of the Popes. If they wish to call him "the great" good for them. Is that any different than the groups who promote a person for sainthood? |
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| OsullivanB | Saturday, 17. October 2009, 12:34 Post #12 |
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Well, I for one, see a considerable difference between " the great Pope, John Paul II" and "John Paul the Great".
Edited by OsullivanB, Saturday, 17. October 2009, 12:35.
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| Deacon Robert | Saturday, 17. October 2009, 13:32 Post #13 |
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OsB, The question was not "the great pope JPII" or "JPII the great". It was what difference is there between people who promote some one for sainthood and those who use "JPII the great"? Both are trying to bring their causes foreward to the universal church. |
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| OsullivanB | Saturday, 17. October 2009, 16:11 Post #14 |
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I am familiar with the canonisation process. I don't see a parallel with the magnification attempt. |
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| Joseph | Tuesday, 27. October 2009, 23:22 Post #15 |
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I'm sure it will come as no surprise, to anyone in here that knows me, but I thought it an excellent document. It is the nearest to "Fit for Mission" I have yet encountered, and it deserves great support. It would seem that Bishop Nickless finds himself faced with much the same situation as our Bishop Patrick O'Donoghue did in his Lancaster Diocese, and is setting about overcoming it in much the same way. I hope he receives better support than POD did, especially from his fellow bishops and priests. |
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