Manners

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Manners; How Bereft Are We?
Topic Started: Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:48 (152 Views)
Karin	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:48 Post #1
Karin Posts: 825 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: September 26, 2006	As a child, I was taught to say "please" and "thank you" or "excuse me, please." I was always polite to my elders (except for my sister who was 13 years my 'elder'). I tried not to bump into people and if I did, I said "pardon me." I used my utensils properly at meals (knife in the right hand, fork in the other) and I knew how to set a correct dinner table (even to the placement of the fish forks or soup spoons!) A lovely woman by the name of Marjabelle Stewart from Illinois was the Doyenne of Manners. She taught children the proper etiquette for parties, dances, manners in church, at school and in the home. She even taught the US Congress how to behave and also taught seminars to corporations enticing their upper eshelons on how to comport themselves in negotiations, meetings and business dealings. She even taught adults how to eat properly. The woman was a glutton for punishment, but she got the job done. I do feel, however, she left the Rednecks alone, because they have their own code of conduct!! But now that she's gone, who will teach the uncouth of the world? Our city (yes, we have a cathedral and it is Catholic) has three major universities here. Mick works at one of them. I dare say he will have a comment or two about manners and the lack thereof. I notice at the Mall or on the street in front of our considerable watering holes, these young people have no regard for the personal space of others. In fact, I see a lot of them go out of their way to be rude. Now I understand I am eligible for a bus pass this year (yeah), but are manners so out of fashion that propriety is also out the window? What has happened to the dignity of the human person and being courteous? Is this the case just in the US or are other countries still relatively well-mannered? I was pouring coffee at a fete a few months ago and asked "Shall I be Mother?" and I thought the woman was going to deck me!!! Any thoughts?
	Karin Hvaljen Isus i Marija. Kraljica Mira, moli za nas. "Praised be Jesus and Mary. Queen of Peace, Pray for Us."


SeanJ	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:57 Post #2
Moderator Posts: 877 Group: Moderator Member #208 Joined: September 26, 2008	Children in Britain and Ireland are taught to say "Pardon?" if they miss something and want the speaker to repeat something. Children being children many of them (us) say "What?" This leads to parents saying "Don't say what say pardon." Soon after I went to the USA, I was attending a barbecue with some friends when the father told one of the teenage boys to do something. The boy replied "Uh?" The father came back with "Dont say Uh say What." I just laughed myself sick.



OsullivanB	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 21:34 Post #3
Posts: 2,203 Group: Moderator Member #205 Joined: August 14, 2008	SeanJ, I suppose that was about a different view of manners each side of the Atlantic. While manners sometimes (but not I think very often) may matter, courtesy always is important. When manners do matter it is only because it would be discourteous not to be mannerly.



MickCook	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 21:59 Post #4
Posts: 633 Group: Members Member #18 Joined: September 26, 2006	SeanJ Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:57 Children in Britain and Ireland are taught to say "Pardon?" if they miss something and want the speaker to repeat something. Children being children many of them (us) say "What?" This leads to parents saying "Don't say what say pardon." Soon after I went to the USA, I was attending a barbecue with some friends when the father told one of the teenage boys to do something. The boy replied "Uh?" The father came back with "Dont say Uh say What." I just laughed myself sick. Now I wonder, was that a 'Redneck barbecue'? I can remember saying to a girl at work, "Excuse me!" when I needed to pass her in the corridor. In reply she asked, "Why, what've ya done?" Then again, this was long ago when I was working in Oldham. That's the problem with Oldham, it's not so much a town full of the English equivelant of 'Rednecks', it's a town full of comedians. While my parents taught me to be polite, I learned something different from friends and colleagues. Like getting into a lift (elevator) full of people and making the sound of someone passing gass. Edited by MickCook, Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:00.
	:) Mick The Cook Companies


Rose of York	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:01 Post #5
Administrator Posts: 14,558 Group: Admin Member #2 Joined: September 25, 2006	Karin Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:48 Now I understand I am eligible for a bus pass this year (yeah), but are manners so out of fashion that propriety is also out the window? What has happened to the dignity of the human person and being courteous? Is this the case just in the US or are other countries still relatively well-mannered? I was pouring coffee at a fete a few months ago and asked "Shall I be Mother?" and I thought the woman was going to deck me!!! Any thoughts? It is not a country or state problem. Here in the UK I find that in larger towns manners are pretty dreadful. In the rural area where I live it is unusual to hear swearing in the town centre, most men hold doors open for women, most people of either sex show consideration and courtesy to people who are old, disabled, or have children in buggies or just holding their hands. There are lots of stalls at farm and house gates, with produce for sale. Generally, the money is put in a glass jar. It is not often it gets stolen. I put it down to "everybody knowing everybody". Nobody wants to get a bad name. Children know that if they behave very badly their parents might find out, and parents do not want a bad reputation.
	$Posted Image$ Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards


SeanJ	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:43 Post #6
Moderator Posts: 877 Group: Moderator Member #208 Joined: September 26, 2008	When I was 11 or 12 years old (soon after entering a grammar school run by the De La Salle brothers) I was sent to a local shop to buy something, and presumably my behaviour was less than perfect. I don't remember what I did/said but shopkeeper said "Don't they teach you manners at that fancy school of yours?" I replied by saying "No. You are supposed to learn them at the ordinary school first." The shopkeeper told my dad, and, to put it mildly, my dad was not amused.



Clare	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:57 Post #7
Wacko Schismatic Traditionalist Woman Posts: 3,093 Group: Members Member #70 Joined: March 27, 2007	Karin Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 20:48 As a child, I was taught to say "please" and "thank you" or "excuse me, please." So? Quote: ... who will teach the uncouth of the world? Who cares? Quote: Any thoughts? Whatever!
	S.A.G. My attempt at a blog.


John Sweeney	Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:58 Post #8
Posts: 1,850 Group: Members Member #68 Joined: March 20, 2007	I agree that courtesy is more important than stylised manners but both have their place. Incidentally, while my knowledge of the English upper class is limited, I believe that they habitually use " What?" and that the use of "Pardon?" in their circles marks one out as a common person. John



ANGLO-CATH	Monday, 12. January 2009, 13:22 Post #9
Posts: 23 Group: Members Member #32 Joined: October 5, 2006	I've always taught my children to say please & thank-you etc, but as a parent, you can only do so much. My kids are watching all kinds of people on TV being rude to each other all the time. And that's only the factual programmes. You try to filter out what they watch, but it's fighting a losing battle I'm afraid. Must admit though, both me and my wife do the old " why watcha done?" reply to the "excuse me". Only to each other though!



Rose of York	Monday, 12. January 2009, 14:20 Post #10
Administrator Posts: 14,558 Group: Admin Member #2 Joined: September 25, 2006	ANGLO-CATH Monday, 12. January 2009, 13:22 I've always taught my children to say please & thank-you etc, but as a parent, you can only do so much. My kids are watching all kinds of people on TV being rude to each other all the time. And that's only the factual programmes. You try to filter out what they watch, but it's fighting a losing battle I'm afraid. Then there is the other problem - school. The children who are taught good manners at home are open to influences from children whose parents have a different approach to attitudes towards others. I meet young couples who have moved out of town, often at great inconvenience, to get their children away from bad influences. That is not to say all rural families teach their children good manners but I find that most do. Children who need to walk along single track lanes are taught, by their parents, to stand aside when they see or hear cars. It may be that in addition to safety it gets the children into the habit of noticing there are others around besides themselves. I try to do my bit, by thanking the children as well as their parents, complimenting them on their good manners and common sense. Appreciation gives encouragement.
	$Posted Image$ Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards


JRJ	Monday, 12. January 2009, 18:08 Post #11
Posts: 657 Group: Members Member #117 Joined: December 5, 2007	ANGLO-CATH Monday, 12. January 2009, 13:22 I've always taught my children to say please & thank-you etc, but as a parent, you can only do so much. My kids are watching all kinds of people on TV being rude to each other all the time. And that's only the factual programmes. You try to filter out what they watch, but it's fighting a losing battle I'm afraid. Must admit though, both me and my wife do the old " why watcha done?" reply to the "excuse me". Only to each other though! You are so right - TV is deadly to the development of all the virtues. We went TV-free upon our recent relocation. We are talking to each other, getting outdoors and reading a great deal more. And our manners have improved - I noticed that certain programs encouraged a very negative spirit.
	Jennifer hubby's dinosaur blog


CARLO	Monday, 12. January 2009, 20:04 Post #12
Posts: 1,691 Group: Members Member #27 Joined: September 28, 2006	John Sweeney Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:58 I agree that courtesy is more important than stylised manners but both have their place. Incidentally, while my knowledge of the English upper class is limited, I believe that they habitually use " What?" and that the use of "Pardon?" in their circles marks one out as a common person. John Fascinating John and I suppose 'pardon' is short for 'I beg your pardon' so that would seem to correspond with what you say. However anything is better than the awkward and inelegant modern habit of saying 'Say again' ! Must be a connection with V2 somewhere! Salva nos Save us! CARLO
	Judica me Deus


Derekap	Monday, 12. January 2009, 21:26 Post #13
Posts: 3,415 Group: Members Member #14 Joined: September 26, 2006	'Say again' is probably from army radio practice days, when pardon would not be adequate in difficult radio conditions and perhaps from CB or amateur radio practice.
	Derekap


CARLO	Monday, 12. January 2009, 21:55 Post #14
Posts: 1,691 Group: Members Member #27 Joined: September 28, 2006	Derekap Monday, 12. January 2009, 21:26 'Say again' is probably from army radio practice days, when pardon would not be adequate in difficult radio conditions and perhaps from CB or amateur radio practice. Derek Certainly could have an army origin Derek but it doesn't come from amateur radio. Any radio ham worth his salt would have used the immortal jargon/code of 'QRZ' !! As for CB (Citizen's Band) radio, that is a post-V2 development and anything is possible in that area! Oremus CARLO Edited by CARLO, Monday, 12. January 2009, 21:57.
	Judica me Deus


Clare	Monday, 12. January 2009, 22:13 Post #15
Wacko Schismatic Traditionalist Woman Posts: 3,093 Group: Members Member #70 Joined: March 27, 2007	CARLO Monday, 12. January 2009, 20:04 John Sweeney Wednesday, 7. January 2009, 22:58 I agree that courtesy is more important than stylised manners but both have their place. Incidentally, while my knowledge of the English upper class is limited, I believe that they habitually use " What?" and that the use of "Pardon?" in their circles marks one out as a common person. John Fascinating John and I suppose 'pardon' is short for 'I beg your pardon' so that would seem to correspond with what you say. However anything is better than the awkward and inelegant modern habit of saying 'Say again' ! When I don't hear something properly the first time, for some reason (I don't know why - habit?) I say: "Sorry?"
	S.A.G. My attempt at a blog.


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