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Enneagram
Topic Started: Friday, 2. January 2009, 18:34 (572 Views)
Deleted User
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Ah, now we have it! The old Myers Briggs tests which made fortunes for the type of management consultant beloved of Carlo. Totally spurious ( I never came out well for instance) but I doubt if even its most cynical opponents would claim it would endanger your immortal soul. Bore it to death, certainly.


John
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OsullivanB

It has many other applications some allegedly spiritual and others uncompromisingly New Age.
Edited by OsullivanB, Sunday, 4. January 2009, 00:34.
"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance - that principle is contempt prior to investigation." Herbert Spencer
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Emee
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The Enneagram session could be followed with a Belbin analysis of one's role in a team, followed by Maslow's levels of need, followed by a Colour Wheel - someone once told me they thought I was a 'yellow' though I have never undertaken the test so have no idea what that means...
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Deleted User
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Quote:
 
The Enneagram is alleged to be a 2000-year-old Sufi system of personality types from Islamic mystics who lived before the time of Christ.
The Enneagram is a circle, meant to symbolise the Cosmos and the "one-ness" which comes from a monist perspective. The Sufis are monists believing that we are all one with each other and with the universe and at the same time pantheists believing that the universe is god. So that's why they're not highly regarded in Islam, because they're kind of Heterodox.
Inside the circle is a triangle, and it connects up the points of the 9, the 3 and the 6; and it symbolizes God. We should notice right away that it's God inside the cosmos, not the cosmos inside God.
There's another figure that is 6 sided and it connects from the 1 to the 4, 4 to the 2, 2 to the 8, 8 to the 5, 5 to the 7, and the 7 back to the 1 again. And there you have your Enneagram. (Ennea is Greek for "nine")

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I have mentioned all this in terms of its roots, to de-mythologise the absolute nonsensical myth of it being a 2000-year-old Sufi system. That is untrue. It's less than 30 years old. I don't intend to say in any way that the Catholic teachers of the Enneagram are promoting pantheism; they don't know its pantheistic roots; they don't know about its occultic roots; they don't know that it came from spirit channelling; they don't know that it was originally a form of fortune-telling. They haven't got a clue of that. They all believe the old myth — or the not so old myth — the 30-year-old myth of it being an ancient system.

Article by Fr Mitch Pacwa
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Rose of York
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william of bow
Saturday, 3. January 2009, 14:45
Leave well alone, it is evil, wicked and corrupt. And don't take my word for it - read the Vatican document on the so called New Age movement Jesus Christ, bearer of water (title misremembered I think).
Thank you for that, WIlliam. I found the document on the Vatican website.

http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/pontifical_councils/interelg/documents/rc_pc_interelg_doc_20030203_new-age_en.html

PONTIFICAL COUNCIL FOR CULTURE
PONTIFICAL COUNCIL FOR INTERRELIGIOUS DIALOGUE

JESUS CHRIST
THE BEARER OF THE WATER OF LIFE

A Christian reflection
on the “New Age”


Quote:
 
1.4. The New Age and Catholic Faith

Even if it can be admitted that New Age religiosity in some way responds to the legitimate spiritual longing of human nature, it must be acknowledged that its attempts to do so run counter to Christian revelation. In Western culture in particular, the appeal of “alternative” approaches to spirituality is very strong. On the one hand, new forms of psychological affirmation of the individual have become very popular among Catholics, even in retreat-houses, seminaries and institutes of formation for religious. At the same time there is increasing nostalgia and curiosity for the wisdom and ritual of long ago, which is one of the reasons for the remarkable growth in the popularity of esotericism and gnosticism. Many people are particularly attracted to what is known – correctly or otherwise – as “Celtic” spirituality,(5) or to the religions of ancient peoples. Books and courses on spirituality and ancient or Eastern religions are a booming business, and they are frequently labelled “New Age” for commercial purposes. But the links with those religions are not always clear. In fact, they are often denied.

An adequate Christian discernment of New Age thought and practice cannot fail to recognize that, like second and third century gnosticism, it represents something of a compendium of positions that the Church has identified as heterodox. John Paul II warns with regard to the “return of ancient gnostic ideas under the guise of the so-called New Age: We cannot delude ourselves that this will lead toward a renewal of religion. It is only a new way of practising gnosticism – that attitude of the spirit that, in the name of a profound knowledge of God, results in distorting His Word and replacing it with purely human words. Gnosticism never completely abandoned the realm of Christianity. Instead, it has always existed side by side with Christianity, sometimes taking the shape of a philosophical movement, but more often assuming the characteristics of a religion or a para-religion in distinct, if not declared, conflict with all that is essentially Christian”.(6) An example of this can be seen in the enneagram, the nine-type tool for character analysis, which when used as a means of spiritual growth introduces an ambiguity in the doctrine and the life of the Christian faith.
Keep the Faith!

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Rose of York
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PJD
Saturday, 3. January 2009, 16:27
Rose: I do have a record on what I posted on here - but that's all. It relates to some advice I asked from a friend, and I relayed on here his/her text. Remember please what is below isn't mine, but someone else familiar with the spirituality of this subject. So have have put it below in italics:-

In order to maintain a complete sense of confidentiality I have set out below an “edited” text of the advice I received. It reads as follows:

“To be honest I know nothing about the Enneagram! …..some 17 years ago I visited Aylesford and it seemed that you could not move in the bookshop for titles on the Enneagram. That is very different now - probably as a result of the criticism you mentioned"

Aylesford Priory was still doing Enneagram courses in 2008.

http://www.thefriars.org.uk/retreatpilgrim/retreatprog.htm

Please note, the words on PJD's quoted words are not PJD's words, they are advice given to him by his friend who is familiar with the spirituality of this subject.

What I cannot grasp is this business of identifying one's Personality Type. We are meant to do our best to achieve perfection, categorising ourselves as types can give us excuses for our failings.

The personality types and the animals symbolizing them are:

1. Perfectionist/reformer, terrier

2. Helper, cat

3. Status-seeker, peacock

4. Artist, basset hound

5. Thinker, fox

6. Loyalist, rabbit

7. Fun-loving/generalist, monkey

8. Powerful, rhinoceros

9. Peacemaker, elephant.


Fine, if I am type 3 the status thinker, I don't have to help, think or be a peacemaker. I was not made that way, so it is not my fault if I am weak in those areas. I can leave those things to types 2, 5 and 9. Being type 3 I'll stick to being the way I was made - the status-seeker. No need to strive for perfection either, that is for type 1.

UNCHRISTIAN GARBAGE. DANGEROUS.

Keep the Faith!

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Quicunque vult

Well, well! Here we have a topic with a remarkable degree of unanimity, with which I am only too happy to be associated.

QV
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Bob Crowley

I attended a session on the enneagram some years ago run by a Catholic nun, who had worked previously with Fr. Robert Nogosek, an American priest, who has written at least one book on the enneagram. Like I said, there was no spiritual mumbo-jumbo, and in the long run it is a psychological tool. The main value is to find out what personality type you are, and the negative aspects you are inclined towards as a part of that personality type, in order to work against them. It may have had Sufi origins, but then Freud was Jewish, and who's been to a psychiatrist lately? So what?

Incidentally I don't even think about it much, and hadn't given it much thought until I saw the topic raised here.

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Bob Crowley

John Sweeney
Sunday, 4. January 2009, 00:51
But can I be a peacock or not?

John
Only if you've got the tail feathers to match.

There are nine main personality types typified by a symbol eg. peacock. I'll give a brief rundown, and you can make your own choice. As usual with human beings, there's an overlap. Nobody would be one type exclusively. The summary is based on one of Nogosek's books. And I'm not writing any more. If anybody wants to find out their personality types, they really need to do a questionnaire, which would probably be given during a formal presentation.

The exacting "One" - symbol Terrier - Postitives - Dedicated to perfection. (I think this is my wife's area, somehow). Hardworking. Believes in being direct and honest (that's my wife again!) Negatives - not good with anger. Preoccupied with faults. Resentment.

The ingratiating "Two" - symbol Cat - Positives - Dedicated to being helpful. High value on personal relationships. Non-judgemental. Negatives - propensity to flattery. Multiple selves (trying to please too many people). Only interested in relationship matters.

The ambitious "Three" - symbol Peacock - Positives - Time a vehicle for getting things done. Good talker. Focus on achievement. Negatives - takes on too much. Avoid failure at all costs. Self seeking. Indolent if he crashes.

The misunderstood "Four" - symbol Basset Hound - Positives - Very sensitive to dramatic moments eg. death, farewells. Aesthetic. Charming. Nostalgic. Negatives - Brooding, melancholic. Fantazing. Focus on what is missing. Hyper sensitive.Self Pity.

The aloof "Five" - symbol Fox - Positives - Withdraws from others to think. Reflects on observations. Quiet. Witty. Negatives - avoid people. Stinginess. Aloofness from other people. (I think I've got some of this in me as well as the peacock).

The apprehensive "six" - symbol Rabbit - Positives - punctual. Work overtime, Driven to do the right thing. Negatives - self doubt. Apprehensive. Indecisive. Overly serious.

The sanguine "seven" - symbol Monkey - Positives - good natured, sanguine and jovial. Nice person. Great talker. Negatives - avoid tension and pain. Superficial. Planning instead of doing.

The bossy "eight" - symbol Rhinoceros - Positives - Powerful sense of justice. Fighter. Strong person. Strong statesman. Negatives - See weakness as a great evil. Retaliates. Intimidates. Cantankerous - likes a fight.

The laid back "nine" - symbol Elephant - Positives - Good at getting people together. Likes a routine. To be is to be content. Negatives - Indolence. Lack of energy. Unfocused.

In the spiritual sense, there is talk of what is called the "Holy Idea", in that each personality type can serve God better in some ways that other ways.

I don't think about the "Holy Idea" bit much, since in reality the ways we can serve God are often limited by circumstances. A "bossy eight" who becomes a Christian in jail is in a very different position to a "bossy eight" who might be running a non-profit charitable group.
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sumermamma

Rose of York,
It is obviously a humanistic tool to determine personaity types. Personally I feel ot is just another method to pigeon hole people.
sm
a link may help.http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/intro.asp
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sumermamma

Rose of York,
It is necessary for the so called "intelligentia" to catagorize or name people, things and the like. Codify may be an appropriate word. it's potential use is like a bar code. You "fit" a certain catagory, receive the appropriate bar code and forever you will be exactly what your bar code defines, irrespective of what changes you make in your life or circumstances, you're bar coded..
It's not a game and it is not harmless, it's a direction the so called "intelligentia" wish to go.
sm
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Clare
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Putting the "Fun Dame" into Fundamentalist
Penfold
Sunday, 10. May 2009, 01:50
http://middlesbrough-diocese.org.uk/1976/through-personality-to-spirit/

For something that is
Quote:
 
UNCHRISTIAN GARBAGE. DANGEROUS.
i think it curious that The Roman Catholic Diocese of Middlesbrough should be so publicly suporting it.
Middlesbrough Diocese. Nuff said!

:wh:
S.A.G.

Motes 'n' Beams blog

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Joe Valente
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Reckon I must be the bull in the china shop. ! So I better stay away from these enneagrams lest I do some damage.

I know, I will just go to Mass instead and say a few old fashioned prayers and hope that the big Rancher has room for a tired old bull
to run around the heavenly pastures.
What doth it profit a man if he gains the whole world but suffers the loss of his soul
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