Acts

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Acts; The birth and growth of the church
Topic Started: Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 10:23 (15,988 Views)
Gerard	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 10:23 Post #1
Posts: 3,120 Group: Members Member #12 Joined: September 26, 2006	Quote: In the first book, O The-oph'ilus, I have dealt with all that Jesus began to do and teach, 2: until the day when he was taken up, after he had given commandment through the Holy Spirit to the apostles whom he had chosen. 3: To them he presented himself alive after his passion by many proofs, appearing to them during forty days, and speaking of the kingdom of God. 4: And while staying with them he charged them not to depart from Jerusalem, but to wait for the promise of the Father, which, he said, "you heard from me, 5: for John baptized with water, but before many days you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit." 6: So when they had come together, they asked him, "Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?" 7: He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8: But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Sama'ria and to the end of the earth." 9: And when he had said this, as they were looking on, he was lifted up, and a cloud took him out of their sight. 10: And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, 11: and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven." 12: Then they returned to Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is near Jerusalem, a sabbath day's journey away; Following James' excellent suggestion, could we discuss the Acts of the apostles? I have quoted the first 12 verses from the RSV translation. This is not the easiest to read but has advantages with respect to accuracy. The RSV translation of Acts is available here: http://etext.virginia.edu/toc/modeng/public/RsvActs.html Acts was written by Luke which explains the reference to the first book (i.e. Luke's Gospel). Luke was a doctor, hence highly educated, and was Greek - the two books were written in Greek. If we look at the beginning of Luke's Gospel we see that he wrote it as history after intensive investigation. Hence we have a history written by a highly educated author. This is an important point to remember. Luke is writing for the benefit of Theophilus ("that you may know the truth concerning the things of which you have been informed" cf Luke 1:4). So who is Theophilus? Well, I suggest you are (and me). There may have been a person called Theophilus but the name means "lover of God". So I think Luke and Acts are expressely written to every person who loves God enough to get to know Him better by reading these books. OK over to someone else. Gerry
	"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).


Rose of York	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 14:54 Post #2
Administrator Posts: 14,558 Group: Admin Member #2 Joined: September 25, 2006	In verses 3 to 5 I see several references to time. Verse 3, Apparently the apostles needed many proofs, just as most of us do. I wonder if Jesus, being an understanding person with insight, knew he needed 40 days to convince the Apostles he really was alive, permanently, and would not leave them. Verse 4, the apostles were told to be patient, to stay where they were and wait. Verse 5, this is a bit of a tease. "before many days". How many is many? Two? A hundred? A lifetime? The apostles did what I would have done, and what children do when they are waiting to get to the end of a journey. They wanted to know WHEN. As a parent I often said "We will get there when we get there. Have some patience." Jesus told the apostles His Father would decide the time. The Apostles had to WAIT of The Holy Spirit. Perhaps there is a lesson there, for all of us.
	$Posted Image$ Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards


James	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 15:23 Post #3
James Posts: 1,108 Group: Members Member #54 Joined: January 13, 2007	I found a reference in another book. There appears to have been several things running parallell with Jewish festivals surrounding the Temple (building) and the new Temple (Christ) around this time. Too significant to be coincidence and underlined by the lack of heart in the apostles around the days mentioned. The feast of Pentecost is also according to what I am reading - "quote" This had occured in Jerusalem during the Festival of Shavout (the Greek term for Shavout is Pentecost) 50 days after the passover (sedar) that had preceded Jesus' trial and crucifixion. I think as you suggest , Rose, there is a meaning in this timelapse. Jewish ( or is it Judaic) Festivals are being given a new meaning and this time had to elapse until the Festival of Shavout. I may be wrong here but it is what I am reading and it gives some significance to the timelapse. This can also give credibility into the Ressurection ( from our time) insofar as that these men( the apostles ) were still unsure about what was required of them for many weeks after passover. They had no inner fire within them to do what they did just ten days after the ascension( answers your verse 5 query Rose) and begin something that continues to day. Their names were to go down in history - the timelapse until Shavout, I think, is a significant and appropriate one in that light.?



James	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 15:40 Post #4
James Posts: 1,108 Group: Members Member #54 Joined: January 13, 2007	Appendix from the internet to my post above Shavout According to Jewish tradition, the Ten Commandments were given to Moses on Mount Sinai on Shavout. That is why this holiday is called "Zman Matan Toratenu" - the Time of the Giving of Our Law. Shavuot, which means the Festival of Weeks, and occurs seven weeks after Passover, also commemorates the early wheat harvest in Palestine. So we decorate our homes and synagogues with flowers and greens. Shavout has still another meaning. It is the Festival of New Fruits, when each man brought the first of his barley, wheat, grapes, figs, olive-oil, pomegranates, and honey to the Temple in Jerusalem. There, everyone took part in the Bikkurim (First Fruits) ceremony, which has been revived in new dress in modern Israel.



pete	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 19:51 Post #5
Posts: 695 Group: Members Member #76 Joined: April 2, 2007	RSV 14: All these with one accord devoted themselves to prayer, together with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brothers. King James�s version 14: These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren. RSV Catholic Edition 14: All these with one accord devoted themselves to prayer, together with the women and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his Brethen. I have had so many discussions arguing that Jesus had no blood brothers and sisters, that his mother was ever a virgin. The term brethren, seems to me, less confusing, as it would seem that most none Catholics do believe that Our Lord did indeed have brothers and sisters. God bless Pete



James	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 20:33 Post #6
James Posts: 1,108 Group: Members Member #54 Joined: January 13, 2007	Hold your horses a minute Pete. I am still thinking on 1 to 12. Didn't get that far yet.



KatyA	Wednesday, 4. July 2007, 23:03 Post #7
Administrator Posts: 5,413 Group: Admin Member #6 Joined: September 26, 2006	I have discovered an online commentary on Acts, freely downloadable as a pdf file. It may help in this discussion, although you should note that the CCEL site, worthy though it is, has distinctly protestant leanings http://www.ccel.org/ccel/mcgarvey/acts.ch1.html Also available online Haydock Commentary (Acts) Commentary by Ellen White KatyA



nelly k	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 08:52 Post #8
Posts: 549 Group: Members Member #43 Joined: November 1, 2006	I enjoyed reading, what does it say to me , well "trust" is one thing and another is about not being "alone" after Jesus earthly death. I wonder if the follow on was about the stregnth of the Holy Spirit enabeling those Chosen to carry on the word of God to all, not just the selected few, anyway I think I may now be babbeling , but still enjoyed reading and reasuring read. nelly



James	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 09:02 Post #9
James Posts: 1,108 Group: Members Member #54 Joined: January 13, 2007	Waiting and timelapse seems to be the keynote of these 12 verses as Rose mentioned. It seems a coincidence that Jesus spent 40 days in the desert before his mission and 40 days after before the ascension. Does 40 days have any significance in old testament , I wonder? Worth looking at .



maklavan	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 14:17 Post #10
Posts: 190 Group: Members Member #26 Joined: September 28, 2006	KatyA Jul 4 2007, 11:03 PM I have discovered an online commentary on Acts, freely downloadable as a pdf file. It may help in this discussion, although you should note that the CCEL site, worthy though it is, has distinctly protestant leanings http://www.ccel.org/ccel/mcgarvey/acts.ch1.html Also available online Haydock Commentary (Acts) Commentary by Ellen White KatyA Many thanks for that,Katya. The works of William Barclay, including Acts, are also worh dipping into. he is quite capable of taking five lines of Scripture and analysing it over 15 pages!, Be aware, however, if you are catholic, that he has a squint namely his anti-Catholic bias at rare intervals.This should not be a problem if your faith is strong.



Gerard	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 14:32 Post #11
Posts: 3,120 Group: Members Member #12 Joined: September 26, 2006	Some good responses here. Its helpful to have input from commentaries etc but even more helpful when we share our own thoughts. The Holy Spirit will show each of us something different and, though this may be for ourselves, still - sharing will let other see things they might otherwise miss. In this respect I noticed Nelly's points about trust, a word that is not found there but I can now see that it is all about trust - the apostles dont have a clue whats happening and they can only trust. Likewise being together. Rose' point about waiting is well taken and commented upon. The number 40 occurs repeatedly in the OT (e.g. 40 years in the desert before entering the promised Land). I believe it is symbolic of a period of testing before a significant intervention by God. Also the OT events and feasts prefigure the NT events as pointed out by James. Actually I still want to consider verse 1. Let me repeat it but translating the name Theophilus into its meaning. Quote: In the first book, O lover of God, I have dealt with all that Jesus began to do and teach, When you read it like that you get more of a feeling that this is a letter to you - which it is. But then I also find that the word began jumps out at me - always does - every time I read it. So the previous book (Luke's Gospel) is about what Jesus began to do - not what he did. And this book is, by implication, about what he is continuing to do. To give birth to the church, to grow it and to teach it. And this book is not finished. The church is still growing and still being taught by Jesus. Note that optimistic point. The church is still growing. We can get caught up in our own narrow world and think the church is in bad shape but it is not. It is growing in the world and jesus is in charge. But to reiterate - the book is not finished and we are part of this book we are part of the story (well, thats one way I see it). So this book is writen to us and is about us. Well I think thats enough from me for a while. Gerry
	"The institutional and charismatic aspects are quasi coessential to the Church's constitution" (Pope John Paul II, 1998).


KatyA	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 15:55 Post #12
Administrator Posts: 5,413 Group: Admin Member #6 Joined: September 26, 2006	Ellen White seems to see things the same light as Gerard Quote: For three years and a half the disciples were under the instruction of the greatest Teacher the world has ever known. By personal contact and association, Christ trained them for His service. ......................He did not command the disciples to do this or that, but said, "Follow Me." On His journeys through country and cities, He took them with Him, that they might see how He taught the people. ............... They saw Him in every phase of life. It was at the ordination of the Twelve that the first step was taken in the organization of the church that after Christ's departure was to carry on His work on the earth. Of this ordination the record says, "He goeth up into a mountain, and calleth unto Him whom He would: and they came unto Him. And He ordained twelve, that they should be with Him, and that He might send them forth to preach." Mark 3:13, 14. Look upon the touching scene. Behold the Majesty of heaven surrounded by the Twelve whom He has chosen. He is about to set them apart for their work. By these feeble agencies, through His word and Spirit, He designs to place salvation within the reach of all. "all that Jesus began to do and teach" refers to the beginning of His church, and He continues that work through His Church which teaches with His authority. katyA



nelly k	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 17:14 Post #13
Posts: 549 Group: Members Member #43 Joined: November 1, 2006	Hmm, enjoyed both what Gerry and Katie said. nelly



James	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 19:26 Post #14
James Posts: 1,108 Group: Members Member #54 Joined: January 13, 2007	I have since found some stuff on the internet regarding the 40 days but will not bore you as a lot of detail was given. Basically it was the method of measuring time in ancient times and was a nine year calendar based on 40 day cycles. The article calculated it was accurate to within 2.2 seconds over the nine years as against our means of calculating but pointed out that as the earth's wobble was not included, it was, more likely, closer. Therefore people thought and acted in 40 day cycles more or less as we would talk or act in a monthly cycle. This use of this 40 day cycle is supposed to be well documented into the oldest stories of old testament, even into genesis. -



Rose of York	Thursday, 5. July 2007, 19:43 Post #15
Administrator Posts: 14,558 Group: Admin Member #2 Joined: September 25, 2006	James Jul 5 2007, 08:26 PM Basically it was the method of measuring time in ancient times and was a nine year calendar based on 40 day cycles. There would be 5 spare days at the end of each year. After 9 years the seasons would be over six weeks out. They would be planting seeds a month and a half late. What then is the significance of 40 years in the desert?
	$Posted Image$ Catholic and proud of it! Talk to God before Mass. Talk to each other afterwards


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