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| Two Virgins Mono Sleeve | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Apr 1 2016, 08:47 AM (1,808 Views) | |
| muffmasterh | Jun 16 2017, 02:36 PM Post #46 |
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Level 7
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sadly there are so many patents number sleeves in use at the same time the time frame is not linear for them, however a pic is useful I can certainly identify it and may be able to affect a date for it.... Again i have never seen a TV in a pat number inner but if it was pressed in late 69 then thats what you would get for sure. I am wondering if these late copies that i have never seen were pressed primarily for the continent ?? a bit like the stereo sleeve RS's , with a small pressing run ( even if its more than 5000 its still small ) that might explain why i am never seeing any of these. BTW a mono sleeved stereo is currently for sale by a dealer at spitalfields... |
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| servi | Jun 16 2017, 02:40 PM Post #47 |
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Below is the inner sleeve. Yes, it makes sense that they had some labels left of this "big seller". @Henry, several non-laminated TV sleeves have surfaced (Garfield has one as well) all with the text on the front. Not mono sleeves, but a second batch of stereo sleeves. It is completely different from any Apple or EMI sleeve I know of, so it may have been printed at some other company than G&L due to its controversy. What do you think, 5209 ? Or do you know of any other UK sleeves like this one ? Posted Image Posted Image |
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| servi | Jun 16 2017, 02:43 PM Post #48 |
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Yes, most seem to appear outside of Europe, mine was from Germany. There was another one on Ebay like this, also from Germany. Makes sense that these were for Europe. Holland was the only country there that pressed this one in the sixties (Apple Negram pressing), possibly because it has always been a progressive country and because Lennon stayed a week in Amsterdam in 1969 ? |
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| 5209 | Jun 16 2017, 04:26 PM Post #49 |
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This inner sleeve is very common for EMI for years 1970-72 (maybe late 1969 as well). IMO it was the most common EMI inner in 1970. I've never seen such cutting style for inners from 1973 and later (but that does not mean they cannot exist!) I have the same in my Sentimental Journey and Thick As A Brick 1st press copies to name a few. Important is the combination of PATENT NO. (not noS!), MADE IN ENGLAND in small letters, black font colour and cutting style. Sorry, my Englsh is not good enough but I'll try: look at the points on the top and on the bottom where curved lines change to straight lines (or points where cutting ends). Follow the curve and you see that before transforming to straight line it makes a kind of zigzag. Posted Image Henry, what would you say? As for the cover itself I can't say anything. It is obviously not as accurately built as the majority of UK covers I've seen but there were many small printing companies in the UK in the 70ies I guess. And it may be European as well - most auctions for such covers are from Europe, not from the UK so an export version theory makes sense indeed. |
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| servi | Jun 16 2017, 04:31 PM Post #50 |
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Thanks, great info ! In which country are you 5209 ? |
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| muffmasterh | Jun 16 2017, 06:45 PM Post #51 |
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yes this inner is most common on original issues of Let it Be and McCartney so April/May 1970 is a common date for it, but it may not be restricted to May 1970 just that that is a common date thread for it, so i would put my head on the block and say spring 1970. It is also seen on many EMI Lp's of the period and on some side open WA's. It has a 1969 variant which is identical except that it has patents applied for on it. |
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| 5209 | Jun 16 2017, 08:29 PM Post #52 |
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St.Petersburg, Russia. Exactly, Henry, my 1st McCartney 1U/2U (earliest commercially available copy) has the same inner! EMI inners had so many cutting styles throughout the 70-ies but this one is very distinctive, you can't mix it with any other. As for the rest of these, unfortunately it's impossible to associate each cutting style with its time period. At least I would not dare so far. |
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| muffmasterh | Jun 16 2017, 10:32 PM Post #53 |
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and 2u 2u's have them as well since the 1u 2u was pressed in small numbers |
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| 1970grave | Jun 20 2017, 07:00 AM Post #54 |
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Yes, I can confirm that I have the laminated and un-laminated versions of the TWO VIRGINS cover with MONO discs. I must check the two for correlation of information in this thread. From recollection, I too was doubtful at first, but the fact that the covers are identical in size (a little smaller than standard issue BEATLES LP's) and the inner flaps are the exact same length (very long - from memory around 25mm). |
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| servi | Jun 20 2017, 01:33 PM Post #55 |
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WHAT, you have two mono discs ??????????? That's amazing !! One of the rarest commercial LPs ever....I assume you mean STEREO discs, right ? Would love to see pictures of the mono labels. |
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| 1970grave | Jun 21 2017, 12:48 PM Post #56 |
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Yes, I have 2 copies of the mono one has a little damage to Side 1 and has been repaired the other is nearly MINT The details for the 2 disc are as follows I cannot see any variation in the layout of the label both have KT tax code to centre of label Matrix APCOR 2A-1 NO EMI Stamps at 3 o'clcok 1 Mother Matrix APCOR 2B-1 NO EMI stamps at 3 o'clock 2 mother Matrix APCOR 2A-1 NO EMI Stamps at 3 o'clcok 1 Mother Matrix APCOR 2B-1 NO EMI stamps at 3 o'clock 2 mother (maybe a 1 - hard to tell) One has a Black original Apple inner the other has a non standard white paper sleeve Both the laminated and the un-laminated have inner flaps at 14mm the sleeve dimensions are exactly the same The laminated version is a lot whiter and the un-laminated is more a cream colour - maybe from smoke not sure (didn't smell of smoke) OF NOTE: the laminate version is like cling film laminate and although my version if pristine with no cuts the laminate has separated from the cover in places and this may be the reason why they stopped using this poor production design http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/grave197...y/Two%20Virgins |
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| 5209 | Jun 21 2017, 05:20 PM Post #57 |
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Thanks a lot for posting the picture of the two covers together, 1970grave. Chances are high that both were made by the same printer. |
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| servi | Jun 21 2017, 06:03 PM Post #58 |
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Wow, it is really something to own a mono TV, but two copies that is unbelievable.... My mono cover (unlaminated) also has a more cream colour, but the inner flaps are smaller. Laminate separation is also a problem with some stereo covers btw. Thanks for posting these pictures ! If you ever think of selling a mono, let me know :) |
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| 1970grave | Jun 22 2017, 03:15 PM Post #59 |
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everything is open to offers or swaps i still have a 'WANT' list although, i know Henry has at least 4 items that's on my list send me your email and i'll send over Servi |
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| 5209 | Jun 23 2017, 08:56 AM Post #60 |
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Following the discussion about stampers (though slightly off topic maybe, anyway I'm posting this here as this thread is alive): I've collected all the information available regarding stampers for LIFE WITH THE LIONS and there's a very curious detail. Among the earliest stampers' combinations confirmed for this LP have been the following combinations: 1-G/1-G, 1-G/1-R, 1-G/1-A, 1-G/1-M That leads us to conclusion that definitely: - either not both stampers were replaced in a record press at the same time but only one might be replaced while his "partner" kept on working within a given pressing job - or stampers could be re-used SEVERAL times (used, then mounted off the press, stored and after some time affixed to the press again for another run). I knew this was possible once but four (!) cycles as proven above... Whatever is the truth it's clear now that a stamper's life or "capacity" (how many records it may produce) is VERY indefinite. The example above shows us that stamper 1-G for side A may have produced four times more copies than say 1-G for side B. |
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6:57 PM Jul 11