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| R.r.p.g. Pricing | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 15 2009, 11:24 AM (641 Views) | |
| beatle-del | Aug 15 2009, 11:24 AM Post #1 |
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I recently purchased the 2010 edition of RRPG, one thing that almost immediately surprised me was the prices quoted for mint copies of Beatles records. I wish I could buy them for the prices quoted, but as most collectors know that would be almost immpossible. The other thing to take into account is that "the sting in the tail", of these prices is that if you were to sell records to a dealer, they would nearlly always quote the RRPG, and say that is what they are worth, and give you about 40% of that price, not what they are actually worth. Also of note is that Box sets are actually cheaper than buying each album seperately, could this be why box sets are hard to find, in as much as that dealers split them up. Derek |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 15 2009, 12:48 PM Post #2 |
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Yes minters will indeed always command a premium but especially so if they are early copies. However I am not sure I agree with you about the box sets, you can often pick up a minter EMI rimmed 2 box disc for 4 or 5 pounds as not many are interested in them, that means if you break up a BC13 box set you will struggle to get your money back, I think those BC13's go for about 90 or 100 now... I always say best to sell them yourself anyway. |
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| Will Cambell | Aug 15 2009, 01:40 PM Post #3 |
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Hi, Yes its interesting comparing the prices in the ‘2010 edition of RRPG’ (Mint condition prices), compared with the prices that records sell for on Ebay. 18 months ago you could half the RRPG prices to buy on ebay, but now things have changed, I know its the extreme but look at our friend Andrew in Austria, £900 for an ‘ordinary’ copy of a 1st press White LP and £1500 for a ‘Remix 11’ Revolver…. the sky is the limit it seems. WC. |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 15 2009, 03:46 PM Post #4 |
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but again thats Andrew, if I was to post a white album or remix 11 like his I would be lucky to get a third of what he does. However I understand why, he only normally deals with top quality items, he is know for that and thats why his lists always carry such a premium. I and many others are mostly selling our seconds, so even when we have an AGM style minter we can never command the same price he can cos people know that we also deal in the more ropey items, Andrew doesn't lol!! |
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| gzzsbj | Aug 16 2009, 02:55 PM Post #5 |
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I agree. The RRPG pricing for Beatles material bears no relationship to the prices achieved on Ebay, although they state in the preface that they will not take the 'inflated' prices on Ebay into account. But surely this is what the items are fetching, so should be taken into consideration, at least as an average? And what about the 'Reel to Reel' tape issues? They are not even listed anymore, which makes them almost worthless according the RRPG. Now, I'll argee that the original cardboard box versions are not rare, but the later jewel case issues, and especially the Abbey Road and Let it be Mono versions are like hens teeth and go for hundreds. Surely these are rare records? To be honest, i've lost a bit of faith in the RRPG, especially where the Beatles are concerned. I realise that they cater for all artists, but with the Beatles being one of the most collected artists, I think they deserve a greater profile in the book and a more realistic price guide. Richard |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 16 2009, 10:19 PM Post #6 |
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Yes Richard I agree, something is worth ( only ) what somebody is prepared to pay for it, I've never paid much attention to the guide, I don't even have a copy. I'm sure it can be a useful reference source but thats about it. However the fact the something is rare doesn't always make it collectable, as far as Beatles stuff is concerned if it dates from after about 73 it's often pretty worthless I'm afraid ( with some few exceptions obviously ). It can be the rarest record in the world, but of nobody wants to collect it.... |
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| servi | Aug 17 2009, 06:50 AM Post #7 |
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This RRPG has little connection with reality. To me it's a remnant of the pre-internet era when dealers determined values instead of sellers. These things have changed, wake up Record Collector !! Popsike.com is better to estimate a value IMO (and for free) although it has some drawbacks ofcourse. What do forum members think of Record Collector magazine these days ? Still as good as in the "black and white" days ?? Does anyone have the American price guide by Perry Cox ?? I think that is what we need for UK pressings. Just forget about the values in this book as well (they are determined by dealers), but as a discography book it is superb and has excellent pictures. |
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| Will Cambell | Aug 17 2009, 09:20 AM Post #8 |
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Hi, I suppose its like everything now, what has made the difference is the Internet. I used to buy copies of the ‘Record Collector’ (RC) mag. 20 years ago. I had a clear out recently and got rid of all my old copies of RC, but wisely I kept all the Beatle related ones. One RC mag. I have has a ‘top 100’ of most collectable Beatle LPs, a really excellent article, although its dated 1991 !, I still refer to it today ! And now today what the RC mag. does offer (which isnt much) is poor. I cannot believe the fuss they make of that ‘Ebay O meter’… when they completely ignored a certain No. ‘0000005’ White Album and have regularly comlpletly ignored certain copies of Please Please Me (PPM) Gold Stereo from our friend in Austria !.. And as for the RRPG, I have never owned a copy, but have referred to it a number of times, its needs to be completely re written, Ebay has created a massive data base now of what is available to collectors, especially records mispresses and misprints etc, the RRPG is hopelessly out of date. ‘Popsike’ is very good, but aren’t the prices just a little ‘over the top’ ? WC. |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 17 2009, 10:16 AM Post #9 |
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I think the problem with popski is that it will give you an example of one disc that went for 200 and a similar one that went for just 20 so again what do you beleive. I think it's like RRPG, handy as a reference only, definately not gospel though. |
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| rockinrobyn | Aug 18 2009, 12:15 PM Post #10 |
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I think, Henry, that this is the point. All of the collectibles market can be "ranged" in price far more effectively than to have a "set" price from a catalog. What is 'Very Fine" any way? A price guide with an entry such as: Parlophone 45R-4949 "Love Me Do" first pressing, with MIGB text, Exc. GBP 25-85 would be much more honest than to say that the record is worth GBP 50. I know that this is a bit too loose for folks that want to evaluate a collection or a specific item, but we all know that a record's value is what someone is willing to pay for it. |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 18 2009, 01:14 PM Post #11 |
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That is indeed true, however I think that you have to start with valuations for mint/near mint copies as a start point and the varition between what Andrew can sell for a minter and what I could for the same minter would be vast so thats not very helpful (not that I am bitter lol !! ) There is probably no easy answer to all this ;-( |
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| beatle-del | Aug 19 2009, 05:54 PM Post #12 |
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I have the American Price Guide, and the Bruce Spizer books, Excellent books and good value for money. Yes we could do with such a book for U.K Pressings, but there are numerous books out there that cover this sort of information. As regards the prices in the price guide, I think they are more realistic than the RRPG, but again caution should be used as the prices would really only be relevant at the time of publication. I used to buy Record Collector every month, but have not done so now for about 5 years, unless a Beatle article published, then I check the article to see if it justifies the cover price. Derek |
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| rockinrobyn | Aug 20 2009, 04:14 AM Post #13 |
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I'm becoming convinced that St. Andrew has a very sophisticated printing and vinyl pressing plant in his basement and hundreds of little Austrian elves cranking out brand new copies of every obtuse Beatle release ever conceived...where does that guy get all that brand new stuff from the early '60's? Time machine? |
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| Will Cambell | Aug 20 2009, 10:09 AM Post #14 |
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Hi, Yes right, or he was good mates of ‘H G Wells’, who our friend in Austria inherited a certain contraption to manipulate the space time continuum,…. just a thought. Andrew or ‘St Andrew’, (St. A) thats a good one ‘rockinrobyn’, I think that will stick, he had a recent ‘private’ collection to sell on commission, with needless to say some unbelievable Beatle records just to add to the legend of ‘St A’. ‘St. A’ hasn’t been that active recently, I have been missing his selected delights, just to look at his photos is pure joy, he must be on holiday….. he does have some items listed under his other trading name, they are mostly ‘buy it now’s’, which is unusual for him. I wonder if his move to Austria is a clue to his success ? apart from all the Tax benefits ! WC. |
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| muffmasterh | Aug 20 2009, 01:22 PM Post #15 |
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If I ever had to sell my collection I would definately send it to him to sell on commish!! Yes wasn't odd to see those buy it nows on the other site, maybe our friend " X " paved the way.... |
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